Mental light meters

[ChiILX1]

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Hi everyone. I'm a little new to film photography without built-in meters so go easy on me.

 

I'm really getting into using my new M2. I find that the Leicameter-M light meter is useless though when I need a particular exposure on my subject, especially with contrasting light in a frame. Take a neon sign for example like this. I use spot metering on my X1, and now I'd like to learn everyone's rules of thumb for determining proper exposure on their non-metered cameras for their subject in the same ways as spot metering.

 

I will be doing a portrait session soon for a friend using Porta 160 NC, and would like to properly expose his face even if it means blown highlights. I'll be using a 90mm collapsible elmar most of the time but also have a 50mm collapsible summicron. Thanks.

[johnloumiles]

You will probably get quite a few responses about techniques (sunny 16- for daylight etc.) but I find unless you use a light meter on a regular basis for a while you have nothing to base the theories off of especially with film. Low light is especially difficult to meter in your head

 

I will state the obvious and say you should pick up a modern light meter. Spot meter would be best but they cost more then a incident meter. I'm not sure if you have time to sell your Leicameter but the price difference would be negligible. You can hold the ball of the incident meter facing towards camera right in front of your subjects face and get an accurate reading. If anything you should bracket each shot one stop over and under if you want to be safe.

 

Lastly you can use your X1 as your polaroid in a pinch. Most medium format photographers slap a polaroid back on their camera and test the scene before shooting. Allow for a full stop difference between digital and film though.

[giordano]

You can hold the ball of the incident meter facing towards camera right in front of your subjects face and get an accurate reading.

 

Unless you're photographing neon signs in the dark, when an incident light meter is about as much use as an umbrella stand.

[johnloumiles]

Unless you're photographing neon signs in the dark, when an incident light meter is about as much use as an umbrella stand.

 

I took that as anecdotal as to what his issue was. I was addressing his future photo shoot and his need for proper exposure on the face. I'm assuming the subject won't be strapped to a hanging neon sign like in the picture.

 

Good job cutting out every other sentence in both posts to come up with your witty remark though!

[earleygallery]

The MR meters are old, they aren't as sensitive as newer meters.

 

I agree you need a handheld meter that can take incident readings as well as reflective. For dark scenes/night shots you need to meter for the area that you want correctly exposed, but it's best to bracket too.

 

For a neon sign you might expose the sign correctly but then a lot of the rest of the scene will be underexposed. As suggested it's also helpful to use your digital as a 'polaroid' to give you some idea of the likely result.

[Xmas]

Hi

 

The light meters are only light meters you still have to do the exposure in your head.

 

If you are doing facials with flood or daylight then an incident measurement off the light falling on the face is best. e.g. it is what the cine pros used for jump cuts in studio shoots.

 

I got my last Weston master II (with incident dome and ND filter) for 15 GBP of a market stall same reading as my current Weston Master.

 

New fangled digital will be little bit more expensive, but more sensitive, moonlight readings.

 

Noel

 

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[budrichard]

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"I'd like to learn everyone's rules of thumb for determining proper exposure on their non-metered cameras for their subject in the same ways as spot metering."

 

I have none but always meter with either a hand held meter or another camera with a built in meter. You eyes adjust to the light available and are not a good system for determining exposure. Rules don't cut it when determining if you can photograph a scene with variable light intensity. I shoot mostly color reversal now but when working shot a lot of B&W for my newspaper. I would never guess the exposure for a shot.-Dick

[ChiILX1]

Thanks everyone. The neon sign was anecdotal but is a great example of the kind of exposure contrast a shaded face can have in a sunny portrait (or vice versa).

 

The best idea I see here is perhaps using my x1 on spot metering, or if its not on me, bracketing.

 

A follow up question: what does the leicameterM take for light? I know it sounds like a dumb question, but what I mean is, if I have some idea of what it's reading then perhaps I can judge if the subject's face is lighter or darker than that, and then I can practice with my X1 at what exactly is one to three stops lighter or darker on a subject's face from what the lightmeter is reading.

 

Again old timers, go easy on me. Thanks.

[earleygallery]

I was almost not going to reply, being called an 'old timer'

 

Use the frame preview lever on your M to bring up the 90mm framelines (on the MR anyway, I'm not 100% sure about the earlier ones). That's what your M meter is reading. It's almost like 'fat spot' metering.

 

For the conditions you mention incident readings are better IMHO. You can find older Gossen and Zeiss meters on ebay, the sort that don't rely on batteries, very cheaply if you want to experiment before shelling out on a new one.

[earleygallery]

JC Braconi has just added info on the meters to his website LEICA HISTORICA

 

You will see there was an incident attachment available (I don't know if it was made for all models or just the earlier ones with the larger cells, I certainly didn't have one with my MR meter).

[ChiILX1]

Thanks!

Very interesting and useful that it's taking a reading from about the 90mm frame. Since mine is the Leicameter M with the pop-up lid, does that sample area vary depending on whether it's taking a reading from the slit when the lid is down or if the cover is up?

[Xmas]

Hi everyone. I'm a little new to film photography without built-in meters so go easy on me.

 

I'm really getting into using my new M2. I find that the Leicameter-M light meter is useless though when I need a particular exposure on my subject, especially with contrasting light in a frame. Take a neon sign for example like this. I use spot metering on my X1, and now I'd like to learn everyone's rules of thumb for determining proper exposure on their non-metered cameras for their subject in the same ways as spot metering.

 

I will be doing a portrait session soon for a friend using Porta 160 NC, and would like to properly expose his face even if it means blown highlights. I'll be using a 90mm collapsible elmar most of the time but also have a 50mm collapsible summicron. Thanks.

 

Well I'll try and answer your question this time.

 

http://www.brayebrookobservatory.org/BrayObsWebSite/HOMEPAGE/PHOTO_EXP_CALC_HIST.h

 

Noel

[nhabedi]

I think the idea of using a small digital camera as a "Polaroid" is a good one, actually. Get a used one that's as small as possible and offers manual settings for aperture, shutter speed, and ISO. You can use it to measure exposure (albeit you won't have incident readings) and at the same time you'll have a (very rough) idea about how your photos will eventually look like, especially in difficult situations.

 

I bought a used Panasonic FX 500 for 80 Euros on eBay a while ago. It isn't much bigger than a Gossen Digisix and certainly smaller than most other dedicated light meters. And it's cheaper too.

[robert blu]

Interesting idea to use the x1 as spot meter, I'll give a try ...thanks

robert

[giordano]

Thanks!

Very interesting and useful that it's taking a reading from about the 90mm frame. Since mine is the Leicameter M with the pop-up lid, does that sample area vary depending on whether it's taking a reading from the slit when the lid is down or if the cover is up?

 

The Leicameter-MR (with CdS photoresistor and battery) approximated the 90mm frame reasonably well.

 

Selenium meters like the Leicameter M and MC generally have a much wider and less well defined coverage, which gets wider still when you flip up the cover to switch to the low metering range. By pointing the meter at a light bulb in a darkened room and watching how the needle moves one can get a very good idea of the coverage.