sortapundit Posted May 2, 2011 Share #1 Posted May 2, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi guys. Please forgive me for my pitiful lack of Leica knowledge, but if you have a moment I'd love to borrow your expertise for a little detective work. Until a few months ago the word Leica hovered on the very margins of my consciousness. I vaguely knew it was a camera manufacturer, and that it had a reputation for superb quality and eye-watering cost, but that was the sum total of my knowledge. In February, after a photojournalist friend of mine spent a month flooding my email with endless praise for the Leica, I had the opportunity to get hold of an Elmar 9cm f/4 for about £40. I had no idea at the time that it wouldn't focus to infinity on my Canon 450D without screwing off the optical block and buying a stack of extra adaptors, but I had fun with it nonetheless (I spent a happy day modifying bellows from an old Agifold to rig up a Heath Robinsonesque unintentionally tilt-shift focusing mount - good times). So far, so frustrating. After a while I grew tired of hovering the lens in front of the Canon and decided to look for a real camera. Last night I found a likely contender at auction, a Leica III with a collection of lenses being sold as part of an estate sale, and in a moment of madness I snapped it up for around $750, which I suspect may have been a very decent price (though feel free to laughingly correct me if I'm wrong). Now, the seller's knowledge of Leica equipment is even smaller than mine (to the extent that she didn't mention the word once in the auction, opting instead for the 'Ernst Leitz Wetzlar' engraved on everything). When I asked her for more details about the items it quickly became clear that I was barking up the wrong tree. The photographs are OK, but the descriptions are terrible, and apart from a few things I definitely recognise I'm not entirely certain what most of the equipment is. This is where you come in. If you can spare a moment it would be great it you could confirm/correct my assessment of what, exactly, I've just spent a hefty sum of money on. I won't post a link to the popular auction site in question, but I'll go one better and upload the images here. This is the description as given by the seller: THIS CAMERA IS A LEICA D.R.P. ERNST LEITZ WETZLAR GERMANY. NO. 260224. E. LEITZ ADAPTER RING ERNST LEITZ GMBH WETZLAR GERMANY RING E. LEITZ NY ELMAR 35MM LENS RING SUMMITAR E. LEITZ WETZLAR GERMAN LENS ATTACHMENT E. LEITZ WETZLAR GERMANY #50276 3.5-13.5 LENS ERNST LEITZ WETZLAR ELMAR F=9CM 1:4 NR.961056 LENS WITH COVER. ERNST LEITZ GMBH WETZLARHEKTOR F=135CM 1:45NR.1113417 LENS WITH COVER. ERNST LEITZ WETZLAR SUMMARON F=35CM 1:35 LENS WITH COVER 3 ADDITIONAL RINGS FOUR COLOR LENSES- OR.(ORANGE);RH.(RED);GR.(GREEN);1(YELLOW) LEATHER CAMERA STRAP ALL IN NICE LEATHER CARRY CASE. And here are the pictures: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! So, from what the Internet has told me so far this is what I think I may be getting: 1 Leica III camera from around 1937 1 Elmar 9cm f/4 1 Hektor 13.5cm f/4.5 1 Summaron 3.5cm f/3.5 1 Elmar 3.5cm f/3.5? 1 ETGUS camera case 1 VIOOH viewfinder 1 SOOPD collapsible hood for Summitar lens 1 Leica filter adaptor? 4 coloured Leica filters Various other things the purpose of which I have no earthly clue. Lens hoods, perhaps? I've speculated on these based on the terrible description and the average quality photographs, but I'm hoping those of you who have been using this sort of kit for many years may be able to shed some light on it. Thank you in advance Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! So, from what the Internet has told me so far this is what I think I may be getting: 1 Leica III camera from around 1937 1 Elmar 9cm f/4 1 Hektor 13.5cm f/4.5 1 Summaron 3.5cm f/3.5 1 Elmar 3.5cm f/3.5? 1 ETGUS camera case 1 VIOOH viewfinder 1 SOOPD collapsible hood for Summitar lens 1 Leica filter adaptor? 4 coloured Leica filters Various other things the purpose of which I have no earthly clue. Lens hoods, perhaps? I've speculated on these based on the terrible description and the average quality photographs, but I'm hoping those of you who have been using this sort of kit for many years may be able to shed some light on it. Thank you in advance ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/150738-can-i-borrow-your-fine-leica-minds/?do=findComment&comment=1661253'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 2, 2011 Posted May 2, 2011 Hi sortapundit, Take a look here Can I Borrow Your Fine Leica Minds?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
luigi bertolotti Posted May 2, 2011 Share #2 Posted May 2, 2011 Welcome to the Leica collectors' community !! You enterd into the right way.. a good fine set with its case, surely original, and apparently in good shape; the camera (see our Wiki section) is a Leica III from 1937; there is no evidence of the Elmar 35 f3,5 you quote with a question mark... both the 90 and 135 lenses are much younger than the camera (1952-53) and so is , probably, aso the Summaron 35 f3,5 you show in a picture (it was a "postwar" item). So, definitely, a very nice set, bought at a very good price (there is no one rare item within, apparently, but the number of items, and the fact that it's a complete - cased set, is an add-on value). NOW... ... you are in a typical situation to enter in collectors' mood (or "frenzy", depending on...) : 1) You have TWO identical items (the Elmars 4/90)... 2)... but ARE THEY really IDENTICAL (Elmar 90 had MANY variants...) ? 3) What to do ? if they are someway different... it's fine to collect different version of a certain item (I have 7 Elmars 90 ) 4) But one can also think to sell one a get another lens (how can you have such a complete set WITHOUT a 50mm lens...?) ... and so starts a long long adventure... So... it's totally up to you... you can keep the set as is and stop... or you can join a vaste and fascinating world (very well represented in our forum): even limiting yourself to the HUNDREDS of accessories, lenses, various kits... for YOUR camera, you can have years and years of chase in front of you... And, finally... if in good shape (easy to verify) your Leica III is a perfectly usable camera HERE Free camera instruction manuals, camera instructions, free film camera user guide, camera manual, camera instruction manuals, you can find even the copy of a user manual for it (use the link to Leica IIIa manual.. almost identical to yours, apart the addition of 1/1000 speed). And, if it is not so well working, it is easy to find a lab who can repair it at decent cost. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted May 2, 2011 Share #3 Posted May 2, 2011 I agree with Luigi. And Leica gear, even if it is only used for patting in front of the fire on a rainy evening, deserves to be in working order; and running a film through the camera occasionally is a good way to keep it in working order. So a CLA may well be indicated. A cased set like this one is of course a splendid conversation piece ("what on Earth is THAT?" Keep the outfit in a really dry place however, for leather can attract humidity and humidity can lead to mildew and other fungus. In other words, you may well have found something to occupy your mind ... The old man from the Age of the Leica III Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted May 2, 2011 Share #4 Posted May 2, 2011 Regarding your set... you have the Summitar hood, but NOT its lens (Summitar 5 cm f2)... the first addition is OBVIOUS... : I quickly found one in Italy (Leica, Nikon, Ducati, Hasselblad, Linhof) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sortapundit Posted May 2, 2011 Author Share #5 Posted May 2, 2011 Thanks, both of you, for your replies. It's great to wake up to something fun to read Luigi, I actually already made a decision with regards to my first Elmar 9cm. Last week I put it up for auction and, to my surprise, managed to sell it for over three times what I paid for it! That profit allowed me to justify spending $750 on a film camera. I'm guessing many Leica users will be able to relate to the mental somersaults involved in convincing yourself that spending hundreds of dollars on glass and metal is a sensible idea Looking at my personality and camera history I know exactly where this is leading. Now I've started I won't be able to stop, and there are only two possible outcomes. Either this will become a dangerous obsession that will financially destroy me, or my partner will eventually kill me in my sleep when I devote more time to the camera than I do to her. Both are unpleasant eventualities, but hopefully I'll have a lot of fun along the way Good tip, Lars. I can assure you that moisture will be the least of my concerns. In four days I'm emigrating to Mongolia, an insanely arid country for most of the year, and my greatest concern by far will be the dust that fills the air with the slightest breeze. I think the CLA will have to wait until I visit Hong Kong in the autumn, unfortunately. Mongolians have many positive attributes, but a gentle touch with delicate equipment is not one of them. One more question: I think I'm right in saying that the second to last picture is the Summaron, but what's the item in the photo above it? Is it the same lens, just from a different angle? The auction seems to describe four lenses, but my question to the seller on this has remained unanswered Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sortapundit Posted May 2, 2011 Author Share #6 Posted May 2, 2011 Regarding your set... you have the Summitar hood, but NOT its lens (Summitar 5 cm f2)... the first addition is OBVIOUS... Ha, I think you may have hit the nail on the head. Oh God, I'm in trouble Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted May 2, 2011 Share #7 Posted May 2, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) ....One more question: I think I'm right in saying that the second to last picture is the Summaron, but what's the item in the photo above it? Is it the same lens, just from a different angle? The auction seems to describe four lenses, but my question to the seller on this has remained unanswered I'd say it's the same, even if the front-taken picture isn't so clear... the second to last, as you say, is a Summaron 35. And... don't be so worried about the financial impact of a decent collection built around your set... many items (even lenses) are not SO costly, expecially if you do not pretend A A/B conditions... and even "complex/fine" accessories like the Visoflexes or the copying equipments are not too costly... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sortapundit Posted May 2, 2011 Author Share #8 Posted May 2, 2011 I'd say it's the same, even if the front-taken picture isn't so clear... the second to last, as you say, is a Summaron 35. Oh, that's a shame. It would have been nice to have a bonus lens From the look of the photo the first image seems to have a smooth barrel rather than the Summaron's curvy shape, but perhaps it's just the angle playing tricks with my eyes I suspect the largest cost will come from developing film. Unless I learn how to do it myself I'll be at the mercy of the photo booth in the local department store Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted May 2, 2011 Share #9 Posted May 2, 2011 1 Leica filter adaptor? the E Leitz Wetzlar one in the middle, is for use these typical Summarit 2/50mm filters, a kind of bayonet locking system. The VIOOH comes in the cell near the body (at left) the 2 similars where in one is the VIOOH actually are for DRXOO spool containers. The case gives to the deal a good consistency. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted May 2, 2011 Share #10 Posted May 2, 2011 ....So, from what the Internet has told me so far this is what I think I may be getting: 1 Leica filter adaptor? .... Lens hoods, perhaps? .... There are surely some lens hoods... I'd say that one is a FLQOO for Elmar 3,5 cm in the Leitz New York chrome version (right to the folded - back seen SOOPD in the picture) ... then another in black (picture) very similar... clearly another 35mm lens has been around sometime during the story of this kit.... maybe another chrome into the bag (left) ? Strange there is not a FIKUS extendible hood, in a kit with 90+135 mm... And maybe more than one filter adapter... probably one is for the Summitar that, once, was part of this kit... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted May 2, 2011 Share #11 Posted May 2, 2011 Strange there is not a FIKUS extendible hood, in a kit with 90+135 mm... There is, Luigi, there is, look at the right of the 135 visible also on many picts Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/150738-can-i-borrow-your-fine-leica-minds/?do=findComment&comment=1661867'>More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted May 2, 2011 Share #12 Posted May 2, 2011 There is, Luigi, there is, look at the right of the 135 visible also on many picts Damn !! I missed the 2 screws... ... high ranking bench rest shooters have always hawk's eyes... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted May 2, 2011 Share #13 Posted May 2, 2011 Damn !! I missed the 2 screws... ... high ranking bench rest shooters have always hawk's eyes... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sortapundit Posted May 2, 2011 Author Share #14 Posted May 2, 2011 Damn !! I missed the 2 screws... ... high ranking bench rest shooters have always hawk's eyes... I'm impressed by the degree of knowledge here. To my eyes most of these random rings look almost identical What's really baking my noodle is the silver object between the FIKUS hood and the camera strap in the case. It almost looks like a thicker than usual lens cap, but the detail isn't enough to make it out. Also, there's a sliver of silver tucked behind the camera strap in the case that looks to be yet another treasure I really can't wait for this stuff to arrive so I can have a good old root around. My biggest fear is that some sneaky Mongolian customs officer will decide to keep it to himself - the Mongolian postal service is... well, let's just say it doesn't enjoy a stellar reputation for security. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted May 2, 2011 Share #15 Posted May 2, 2011 Also, there's a sliver of silver tucked behind the camera strap in the case that looks to be yet another treasure . Looks like a Summitar chrome filter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twotone Posted May 2, 2011 Share #16 Posted May 2, 2011 Have to say that that's some kit for the money, some of those filters alone are about £30:D You've done really well here, I've seen the case by itself go for at least £70 in the past few months. Think that barn door lens hood is quiet expensive too:cool: Chrome lens caps go from about £20 up, some of them are as much as £50. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sortapundit Posted May 2, 2011 Author Share #17 Posted May 2, 2011 Have to say that that's some kit for the money, some of those filters alone are about £30:D You've done really well here, I've seen the case by itself go for at least £70 in the past few months. Yeah, I'm really pleased with the price It sat for days at $545 until the last few moments, but even with the last minute price jump I'm still happy with the value. Next time I'm in a country with a reliable postal service I'll probably sell off the case and a few of the accessories. I'd love to keep it all together as a beautiful set, but I'm sure I'll be itching for a 50mm lens soon enough so I'll need the extra pennies Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twotone Posted May 2, 2011 Share #18 Posted May 2, 2011 Yeah, I'm really pleased with the price It sat for days at $545 until the last few moments, but even with the last minute price jump I'm still happy with the value. Next time I'm in a country with a reliable postal service I'll probably sell off the case and a few of the accessories. I'd love to keep it all together as a beautiful set, but I'm sure I'll be itching for a 50mm lens soon enough so I'll need the extra pennies I can understand that you want to get some of your money back but, personally, I wouldn't split the collection. You should be able to pick up a good user Elmar 50mm lens for about £150 or so maybe even less. Best of luck Tony Ps looks like one of those barn door hoods are £45 here below http://www.peterloy.com/stock-list.php Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
iphoenix Posted May 3, 2011 Share #19 Posted May 3, 2011 I totally agree with Tony, Sell off the case and weeks, months or years later you'll look at your collection and think "Gee, I used to have a beautiful, original Leitz case to protect and display these in. Why oh why did I sell it?" I know I'm being presumptive but a case in that condition would be hard to replace. As far as a 50mm lens is concerned, I bought a Russian copy Elmar (Industar 22 or similar) lens to fill in until I could save for the real thing. Good Luck, David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidStone Posted May 3, 2011 Share #20 Posted May 3, 2011 I absolutely agree. You have a very nice camera (identical to mine, in fact), a 35mm Summaron, a lenshood, and a viewfinder. Get youself a roll of film and start shooting. You don't even need an exposure meter. The 50mm can wait. Decisions on the case can wait. David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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