Will X1 Values Plummet When Leica Releases New EVIL Camera?

[Tsungtak]

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The X1 is the first Leica I have ever owned, I have never been so proud of a camera. I go places and this little camera goes unnoticed. I know the little Japanese cameras are good but do not come close to what a Leica represents. It is camera built with pride, and heritage. It is not some gaudy mass produced camera, that bases its existence on gadgets and price. We need to remember the X1 and M9 are a luxury item not a toy.

 

The X1 comes closer to creating art then any other Japanese compact or 4/3 camera. And if they come out with a Fuji compact better the a Lecia X1. Great but I have no interest in owning one. But if Leica comes out with a better compact camera, I will be in line to buy one.

[Tsungtak]

In what way? They both use the same size sensor and the both have a fixed 35mm lens. It would seem to me the Fuji have 'improved' on the X1 with the optical viewfinder. I would expect image quality to be as good for two reasons:

 

1. Fuji have a larger R&D budget.

2. An extra year of technological advancement.

 

I just HOPE Leica have an announcement at Photokina.

 

If this is true Fuji should have created a better camera then Leica a long time ago.

[ravinj]

Leica is already history. It's over. Fuji rules. X100's sales will surpass that of Halo Reach on the first day. X1's price drop will put the real estate bust to shame. Leica should have created the X100 in the first place. X1 is so slow. Red dot is so expensive. Latest and the greatest wins. I will be the first in line to buy the X100 because I hate the X1 so much. Faster lens, faster AF, faster everything. Perfect for shooting birds. People who like the X1 are Leicaphiles. Nex-5 vs X1. GF1 vs X1. X100 vs X1.

 

And, so on.

[phancj]

This reaction to this camera reflects the pent up demand many of us have had for a small (ala CL) high quality digital. For me, the X1, despite having decent IQ just didn't make it. To me Leica has failed in three areas so far. They are poor quality control, very poor service after sales with months and too many emails and phone calls required for fixes, and finally, too little for the price.

 

Go to the first page of the M9 or this forum for examples: Shutter blades that stick or jam, sensors that crack, coverings that peel, battery doors that don't close properly, pink edges on images, etc. Maybe this camera will spur Leica to address some of these issues and produce a camera (s) that IS the creme of the crop and warrants its high price. They aren't there yet by a long way and waste far too much time and money on "special editions" rather than real improvements.

 

Sometimes someone has to tell the Emperor he has no clothes. Some people would rather stick their head in the sand and pretend otherwise.

 

Barjohn, it appears to me you have an axe to grind. Talking about how great a camera is when it hasnt even materialized yet? The nex came and it hasnt even dented X1 sales, coz the X1 is a niche product for people who want great lens, great IQ, tiny size and AF. The nex never quite delivered for this crowd. I am looking at the Fuji with great interest, but will not sell my X1 as it is wonderful for me, not to say it is for you or anyone else. But your condescending tones is unwarranted, its just a camera discussion. You have posted more than enough negative threads shouldnt you just let it rest, go buy a fuji when it launches, really?

 

Bitching about a camera you do not own is juvenile, perhaps deep down you actually want it but it is not perfect but then no camera is? or maybe price too high? Complaining about it is not going to make Leica lower prices surely...

 

Meanwhile, I have this great camera and am enjoying it tremendously, taking what to me are great pictures, you can go on ranting without a portable camera with great IQ, and continue so after the fuji launch, the nex 7, and the X2, Canon , Nikon, pentax, Ricoh,etc,etc.....

 

Shouldnt you be happy with your nex which I presume you own and happily go shooting or is it not good enough for you compared to the X1? I wouldnt go to the nex forum and slam it even though I do not think it is good enough for me.

 

I do not have the catastrophic bad experience you described about the X1, maybe someone got a dud, doesnt that happen to ANY brand? Including sony, fuji, apple, and just about everybody? And Mercedes, Lexus, etc,etc too but lets not go there?

 

What is your point? After so many posts shouldnt you come to the conclusion that leica isnt listening to you? Or sony for that matter? Practically no one is going to use your recommendations for doing business, Leica and everybody else. They are doing well, irrespective of your ceaseless ranting on the same regurgitated stuff. And you do not own it yet, hence your ranting is irrelevant. If anything if I were Leica i would get feedback from users, and act on them more than yours.

 

Oh I forgot, the X1 doesnt take photos at iso 6400 that looks like iso 400, I remember that was your contention too, shouldnt you be enjoying your superb nex and leave us alone??!! Emperor with no clothes?? meanwhile I am enjoying the camera, with clothes or sometimes without when I so choose. Let your images speak for themselves.

 

The fact is the X1 still gets sold out and Leica's balance sheet is looking rosy. That is the reality.

 

Leica is already history. It's over. Fuji rules. X100's sales will surpass that of Halo Reach on the first day. X1's price drop will put the real estate bust to shame. Leica should have created the X100 in the first place. X1 is so slow. Red dot is so expensive. Latest and the greatest wins. I will be the first in line to buy the X100 because I hate the X1 so much. Faster lens, faster AF, faster everything. Perfect for shooting birds. People who like the X1 are Leicaphiles. Nex-5 vs X1. GF1 vs X1. X100 vs X1.

 

And, so on.

 

 

This may work Ravinj, funny thing is we see the same people rehashing the same old complaints about the X1, one year after launch. This camera must mean something if people continue to slam it after so long. I am no psychologist but remember some theory about secret yearnings unresolved...

[nigelb]

The X1 comes closer to creating art then any other Japanese compact or 4/3 camera.

 

Wow, another sweeping statement of tsunami like proportions!

 

Art is in your head, not in the camera you use.

 

X1 adorers will always go to great lengths to justify its superiority, if it is the camera for you, that's fine, but it wasn't the camera for me or many other people, and no adoration will convince me otherwise. The X100 seems to be the camera for me and I will be looking closely over the next few months. Seems to me that Fuji have done their homework and above all listened, I don't think Leica have judging by the uninspiring announcements so far.

 

As far as IQ is concerned, it is not the absolute for me that it is to many pixel peepers, but having used various Fuji 6x7 and 6x9 rangefinders over the years, ( the Fujinon 90mm f3.5 on the 670lll was stunningly sharp) I am convinced that the lens at least will be up to the job. I dare say that sample images that will appear over the next few months will be disected to the nth degree, so we shall see.

[BB W]

Definitely agree that the art is not attached to any camera. I like to think art is in my head, but know it doesn't always translate so well.

[Ozkar]

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Barjohn, it appears to me you have an axe to grind.

 

You've got to hand it to these trolls for commitment. Every new camera announcement fuels their rants and raves on how Leica will suffer.

[prk60091]

You've got to hand it to these trolls for commitment. Every new camera announcement fuels their rants and raves on how Leica will suffer.

 

 

i really think it is envy

 

they can't afford it and dislike anyone who can and they only way they can feel better is by "trash talking" the camera and/or company....

[hoppyman]

Good news from Leica Camera then for those concerned regarding plummeting X1 values

see no EVIL, speak no EVIL, hear no EVIL

[ravinj]

meanwhile I am enjoying the camera, with clothes or sometimes without when I so choose.

 

CJ - enjoying the camera? without clothes? now THAT is a bit extreme, I must say! On the other hand, the Emperor needs no clothes as he has nothing to hide.

 

[elansprint72]

........... Without the X1 there would be no Fuji X100. .......

 

Jumping Jesus; what are you talking about? Get a grip, man.

 

This is the difference between something which was rushed out; vs, something which was thought out.

[peterb]

Um do you think it's possible Fuji simply wondered if anyone would like a digital camera capable of providing images up 20x30" with few artifacts and low noise that had a bright, crystal clear optical rangefinder view with the advantages of an EVIL to project precise frame lines and other useful data onto the scene you are viewing without too much clutter along with a high quality 35mm lens (35mm equiv.) with advanced aspherical surfaces that provides an almost extended 'normal' view making utterly sharp images with little coma, distortion and ghosting with simple, analog controls to set shutter, aperture and exposure compensation (not to mention a brilliant toggle that lets you choose between real view and 'live' direct from the sensor as well as what was just captured) all in a reasonably sized body that's not too small and not boulder-like with enough heft and metal to impart the user a sense of solid workmanship?

[Guest badbob]

Leica is already history. It's over. Fuji rules. X100's sales will surpass that of Halo Reach on the first day. X1's price drop will put the real estate bust to shame. Leica should have created the X100 in the first place. X1 is so slow. Red dot is so expensive. Latest and the greatest wins. I will be the first in line to buy the X100 because I hate the X1 so much. Faster lens, faster AF, faster everything. Perfect for shooting birds. People who like the X1 are Leicaphiles. Nex-5 vs X1. GF1 vs X1. X100 vs X1.

And, so on.

 

When I first saw the photo of the X100 (I wonder where they got that from?), I was thinking what you just said here. Then I saw how much bigger it is than the X1, so now back to reality. Sure, if the X100 is good enough, lots of people will buy it. Gee, I wonder why it's going to be March 2011? Production problems, maybe? Now just sit back and think about the gorgeous photos I get with the X1, in September, October, November, December, January, February, March.... then *maybe* you'll get an X100 and you can begin to enjoy whatever it is you'll have (taking bets?). Maybe.

[Guest badbob]

Absolutely amazing, the people raving positive about something that doesn't even exist, and beating up on a camera that's more than a year older, will probably capture better photos (the X1), and is significantly smaller and lighter.

[Ozkar]

Absolutely amazing, the people raving positive about something that doesn't even exist, and beating up on a camera that's more than a year older, will probably capture better photos (the X1), and is significantly smaller and lighter.

 

It's just the same old same old. Rather than post positive dialogue in the Fuji forums the Barjohn's of the world troll every Leica forum and post negative rants on how their new "latest and greatest" will result in plunging X1 values and so on.

[barjohn]

It's just the same old same old. Rather than post positive dialogue in the Fuji forums the Barjohn's of the world troll every Leica forum and post negative rants on how their new "latest and greatest" will result in plunging X1 values and so on.

 

It's too bad you haven't learned to read yet. The title to this thread was posed as a question about a rumored Leica EVIL camera and not as a statement. We now know that Leica has no EVIL camera announcement for Photokina so the question relative to the rumor is moot.

 

When I post comments taken from other Leica owners or reviewers about the X1 they are their views and statements so take up your beef with them. This is after all a gear forum. You are entitled to think whatever you like about a piece of gear and so am I. Sony has its flaws in the lenses and Leica in the electronics which one is more critical is open to debate. I grew up with traditional cameras, range finders and SLRs so that colors my perception about what makes a good camera ergonomically. Someone that grew up with the PASM P&S may have a completely different view and look upon a camera like the Fuji X100 as archaic.

 

In a static situation the X1 can take excellent quality photos. In very skilled hands it can take excellent quality photos in a dynamic environment within limits. However, a tool with greater ability makes the skill set needed to accomplish the task easier. A good mechanic can work miracles with a less than ideal tool set but given the right tool set will do a superior job with greater ease.

[phancj]

It's too bad you haven't learned to read yet. The title to this thread was posed as a question about a rumored Leica EVIL camera and not as a statement. We now know that Leica has no EVIL camera announcement for Photokina so the question relative to the rumor is moot.

 

When I post comments taken from other Leica owners or reviewers about the X1 they are their views and statements so take up your beef with them. This is after all a gear forum. You are entitled to think whatever you like about a piece of gear and so am I. Sony has its flaws in the lenses and Leica in the electronics which one is more critical is open to debate. I grew up with traditional cameras, range finders and SLRs so that colors my perception about what makes a good camera ergonomically. Someone that grew up with the PASM P&S may have a completely different view and look upon a camera like the Fuji X100 as archaic.

 

In a static situation the X1 can take excellent quality photos. In very skilled hands it can take excellent quality photos in a dynamic environment within limits. However, a tool with greater ability makes the skill set needed to accomplish the task easier. A good mechanic can work miracles with a less than ideal tool set but given the right tool set will do a superior job with greater ease.

 

John, out of pure curiosity, what of your nex now??

 

I do not hear much from you about it, instead now you are talking about a camera where NO sample images are out yet.

 

I may or may not buy the Fuji (gut instincts tells me the IQ will be soso) but meanwhile the X1 has proven itself more than capable. Images astound me often so much so I find your rants inconsistent with my experiences, as do many in this forum.

 

If the fuji approaches the IQ like your famed nex which delivers iso 6400 images with quality of iso 400, I assure you all X1 users will break the doors down BestBuy and clean out all the X100.

 

Meanwhile, a kind suggestion: WAIT FOR SAMPLE IMAGES BETTER STILL ACTUAL CAMERA BEFORE SHOOTING YOUR MOUTH!

 

Looking at a press release, taking it all in, believing in it 100% thinking it will trump the X1 and drive Leica to bankruptcy is not just naive, its juvenile lunacy at best.

 

Just because it has a built-in VF it will produce great images??!!

 

I thought the lens, Sensor, and image processing engine combination is the one taking the picture?

 

Oh, I forgot, some may require panorama, tilt LCD, touch screen, etc,etc, others like me just like IQ and IQ alone. No wonder we love the X1. But I do not go to the nex forum and slam the camera. I just go and take loads of nice photos, and discuss in this forum how to take even better photos. Thats precisely why I find your posts outright annoying. Trust me, if the fuji is any good, the X1 owners will buy the fuji since it is so inexpensive, but right now the appropriate thing for you to do is to zip it. Fuji, sony got their own great marketing departments, you are not doing them any favors coz many may end up NOT buy the fuji just to spite someone like you, so damn annoying!

 

Come to think of it maybe you are clandestine agent of Leica? Muahahahha!!!

[barjohn]

Phancj, I guess you can't read either. Maybe you need to read the headline again. Do that over and over about 100 times and you may slowly realize it says nothing about Sony NEX and nothing about Fuji X100.

 

WILL X1 VLUES PLUMMET WHEN LEICA RELEASES A NEW EVIL CAMERA?

 

Do you see Sony in there? Maybe it is some inferiority complex that compels your statement.

[phancj]

Phancj, I guess you can't read either. Maybe you need to read the headline again. Do that over and over about 100 times and you may slowly realize it says nothing about Sony NEX and nothing about Fuji X100.

 

WILL X1 VLUES PLUMMET WHEN LEICA RELEASES A NEW EVIL CAMERA?

 

Do you see Sony in there? Maybe it is some inferiority complex that compels your statement.

 

Sorry I am illiterate great one. We are talking about your incessant ranting since the nex, till now. So ANY discussion is seen as a whole in relation to you.

 

Since the thread has digressed to the fuji, then the fair question to you is about the nex, I am very curious how that camera is doing for you. Otherwise you should not post anything about the fuji here either, but you have:

 

" Sony has its flaws in the lenses and Leica in the electronics which one is more critical is open to debate. I grew up with traditional cameras, range finders and SLRs so that colors my perception about what makes a good camera ergonomically. Someone that grew up with the PASM P&S may have a completely different view and look upon a camera like the Fuji X100 as archaic."

 

Since you conveniently popped out of nowhere again with your ranting, can I not conveniently ask you about your magic iso machine??

 

It appears that the inferiority complex stems from deep within you, first sony, now fuji who knows what next? In a Leica forum. Get a life, and we are all happy for you, whatever camera you buy.

 

If the X1 is not good enough for you, so be it. But it is excellent for many of us owners. I cannot see the relevance of your posts. Leica isnt listening to you for sure, many here see you as a pest with nothing substantial to contribute, so I ask again: WHAT OF YOUR NEX?????

 

Sad.

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[barjohn]

Since the thread has digressed to the Fuji, the fair question is to me about the NEX? Huh? If you really want to know about the NEX I would be pleased to share my opinion on it but I somehow don't think you have any real interest. But since you asked, In terms of what is available today it is the most modern and best small camera with APS-C sensor. Sony is showing themselves to be far more responsive to customer feedback than Leica which is a shame on Leica. In October they will release the second firmware upgrade to address the issues customers have complained about. Where is the X1 new firmware over a year later? I have seen plenty of customer wish list threads and also the requests of respected reviewers like Sean Reid and NOTHING from Leica but silence.