So Confused! X1 or DSLR

[JanCderidder]

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I like my X1, it's the only camera I use, but then there aren't any fast kids and potent grandparents or otherwise fast moving things in my family. For "stills" the X1 is perfect, as mentioned it's an always have with you camera, but it has it's downsides such have been described earlier in this thread.

 

If it's IQ you're concerned about and don't really want/need a zoom I would check out the Latest Pentax DSLR, I don't know the reference but it's small, pretty light and if mounted with Pentax prime lenses the results are very good indeed. My Brother in law has one and I haven't tested it in any depth at all but the results with a 40mm pancake limited lens were very pleasing. I don't know how it reacts to low light though, but it might be worth checking out.

 

For kids you also need something with an optical viewfinder I imagine, otherwise the Nex is pretty OK as well or maybe even a Panasonic G something or other, it has an electronic viewfinder and the ability to shoot HD films ... (so I'v heard)

 

Anyway photo's of your kids in 2 - 30 years or so will be worth a lot more to you and your wife than a small practical package "now" ... if you know what I mean, so accomodate that with the perfect kid equipement and go for an X1 or equivalent in a later stage

 

I use M6's and M4's but when my son was born I did go out and buy the perfect kids-deal, fast, responsive and good IQ ... although it was big and heavy I haven't regretted the purchase ever since the images are all great ....

[phancj]

phancj you aren't helping with an informed choice you never bothered to answer his criteria just waffled on about it being scarce...... atleast nippa addressed the questions.

 

If you read the thread you would have seen the choices I put out for Chris, anyway it is relevant if the X1 is still not so readily available, lest Chris go to the store to try out and there isnt any.

 

I think the availability is an issue, and maybe Chris may think so too, I think he is the one buying??!!

 

I do not see the need for your response however, it is caustic and unnecessary.

[ravinj]

Most of my stuff is travel and with the small children. The problem is that I love the flexibility with the DSLR but I love the portability of the X1 and images of the X1. I also care about quality so that is a major factor.

 

This is a loaded question. What should I do?

 

Chris

 

I would suggest that you try out the X1 if you can find it at a dealer. Panasonic GF1 and Oly E-PL1 are not bad options. I own the X1. I tried the GF1 in the store and found its build quality a bit more solid than the X1. My reason for buying the X1 was image quality.

 

Here is my recent field report:

 

I recently went for a 8 day trip to Europe. I took the X1 with me. My backup camera was Canon S90 which I never used. I shot approx 2,000 photos with the X1 during the trip. One day it was raining all day (in Amsterdam) and I took all of my pictures with one hand, the other hand holding the umbrella - I would never have been able to do this with a DSLR.

 

When I found AF too slow, I switched to manual focus at infinity for landscape shots. Most of the time, AF speed was adequate for me though. Another thing I found that the spot focus on the X1 is amazing in its accuracy and I used it quite a bit.

 

The X1 never failed and for me it turned out to be ideal for me. Your mileage may vary.

 

Some pictures, OOC jpg:

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[JanCderidder]

... but with your kids you'd preferable not want/need to miss one single shot ever .... with the X1/M43 you most certainly will miss shots.

 

With young kids I'd go for a D90 24-70 2.8 and a powerful flash .... and take weightlifting classes .... Or something equivelant

[Guest badbob]

Most of my stuff is travel and with the small children. The problem is that I love the flexibility with the DSLR but I love the portability of the X1 and images of the X1. I also care about quality so that is a major factor.

 

This says to me "No to X1, unless it's a backup camera." The X1 is so different from a DSLR that they're not comparable. Anyone who *loves* DSLR's will not be happy to have *only* an X1. The best compromise I can imagine would be a GF1 with pancake lens.

[h00ligan]

The X1 is a wonderful camera, it really is - but there's no way i'd ever tell anyone to get it as a primary camera(alright maybe someone who only needs one for static objects 100% of the time or wants to take photos not of people or animals). Even if it's the camera one uses the most (such as myself) there are still times I need a dslr. The x1 is great, but it can't do action (yes yes, compared to a dslr it can't do action).

 

Personally, I'd recommend an entry level dslr and good glass if I had to choose one I think. Kids with a dslr and usm or similar will be a treat compared to trying to capture with a compact.

 

Micro 4/3 is another option, but it misses out on the best of both while mastering none imho. Get the dslr, and a good lens, then get a panasonic lx5 for when you need to travel light (wait a few months till the price drops $100, which I truly believe it will) or continue to use the dl4 for those occasions. A good small point and shoot for travel or day shots outdoors will have perfectly acceptable results unless you are printing big.

 

On the dslr side right now, I would go with canon, not nikon (not the most popular opinion in this forum). I did a ton of research and shot a lot of samples and wound up thinking canon has the better glass. The t2i is light, high mp, good high iso, fast, good af, not too expensive. You could easily get:

 

t2i with kit lens and canon 55-250 (2 lens kit)

35/1.4, 85/1.8

and a panasonic lx5

 

That should all fit in your budget and leave you with a ton of options.

[h00ligan]

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BTW Ravin, nice shots - makes me wish for the green of the countryside! Unfortunately shooting jpg in broad daylight really limits one's ability to recover cloud detail.

[Danielsan]

Yes kids are moving objects but when my father took a picture of me in the past i smiled in the camera and stand still most of the time, a normal John doe is not into action photograpy. I mean the really good pictures are the ones your kids standing and looking in the camera, not while they are running away. The X1 can do all the tricks a DSLR can except the zoom and faster AF, the question is if u need those two points?

[prk60091]

Chris

Here is my opinion for what it is worth (usually 2 cents),

 

I prefer traveling light. I sold a digilux2 because it was to big and heavy to take everywhere. You can read in other parts of this board the fanaticism for that camera. The IQ was spectacular I have framed 24x36 prints in my home that the D2 took. I stopped carrying the D2 because it was bulky and inconvenient to use. I sold it and took aa step down in IQwith the dlux4, but it is small an I can carry it everywhere.

 

I now have the x1 which is little larger than the dlux4 but very carryable and light as a feather. Yes there are limitations-but what camera doesn't have limitations?

 

The best camera isnthe one you are going to use. If you are going to use the dslr often enough then that is what you should buy. On the other hand I would never carry a dslr lenses etc so for me the best camera would be the x1

[chrispatel]

Thanks for the advice. I agree. I tend to carry light loads and leave my camera in the kitchen so it is easy to pick up and take photos. My D700 was always in my bag and not very spontaneous. Still deciding but I like your perspective.

 

Chris

[johnwolf]

No question in my mind: a GF1, two kit lenses, and EVF. Under $1,000 and you're all set.

 

John

[Guest stnami]

Many have seen this but it does highlight what someone can do Panasonic Lumix GF1 Field Test — 16 Days in the Himalayas

 

Love to see a X1 review that can surpass even though there is pp work involved

Edit. Edit. Edit. And post-process. I spend tons of time in Lightroom editing and filtering images — trying to find thematic threads — and performing 'standard' darkroom post-processing.

[NZDavid]

Chris, don't rush! Why not wait and see what comes up at Photokina in just a few weeks time.

 

The Panasonic Lumix choices (G1, GF1, etc) do look interesting and rate very highly. For example, see http://www.stevehuffphoto.com and http://www.dpreview.com. I simply don't buy the opinions of those rubbishing these cameras. So much depends on the sensor now. And they use interchangeable Leica-designed lenses.

 

Another choice is one of the Olympus Pen cameras.

 

Nothing matches the X1 for its superb simple controls. But its fixed lens is limiting and it does have slow AF -- facts. You may be able to live with that. For travel, 35mm is my favorite focal length.

 

Many people want DSLR quality and versatility in a compact package. Larger sensor cameras (those with APS-C sensors and larger) perform much better at high ISOs -- definitely a virtue, and a point against ultra compacts.

[RichardM8]

As side-step; I'm surprised that neither Canon or Nikon have jumped on the small-camera-large-sensor bandwagon so far. Or M4/3s for that matter.

 

Maybe they are cautious to protect their entry SLR sales that is hugely important for both. Much more than for Panny, Oly or Sony, let alone Ricoh or Samsung.

[jorismichielsen]

Most of my stuff is travel and with the small children. The problem is that I love the flexibility with the DSLR but I love the portability of the X1 and images of the X1. I also care about quality so that is a major factor.

 

This is a loaded question. What should I do? Please don't rail on me!

 

Chris

 

- In my opinion the X1 is one of the best options for travel because its lack of 'flexibility' as compared with the DSLR. OK there is no zoom, but after traveling to Denmark on a hiking tour my X1 did a far more better job than my Canon with bunch of lenses ever did. Especially considering weight and missing shots because of changing lenses and finding the good aperture settings with the DSLR. Further, I missed a lot of good shots with DSLR over time simply because I left it at home because of the heavy weight.

 

- I would even go that far to recommend as one's main and only camera. At least in my case it is the ideal digital camera I was waiting for and I am regretting the investments made in a DSLR. But that's just me loving to use prime lenses of 35 mm and IQ. I you like using zoom and telelenses the X1 could be too limited for you. X1 is not made to take close up pictures of lions on safari, but of a sceneries with lions in it.

 

- Much has been said about the slow AF and X1 not suitable for shooting fast moving objects. Well which affordable DSLR of MFT with lens set up is? I disagree that the slower AF of X1 is the reason. I tried to shoot my one year old son and his 3 year old cousin with my Canon and a fast prime and I missed a lot of shots because using the AF-points (even when using the one point centre option). Several reasons: accuracy of the AF system of the canon, boys are just moving too fast, time lost when choosing angle and frame, time lost choosing other settings... So the lesson I learned was if you want to shoot moving objects as kids, you have to anticipate and prefocus and the X1 does preform as well in this job as the DSLR (or even better because it is much easier in its menus). Secondly, I never liked static photo's of moving objects, so when shooting moving objects try to capture the move as well and the MF option the X1 offers is just the best option I had so far to do this.

[phancj]

As side-step; I'm surprised that neither Canon or Nikon have jumped on the small-camera-large-sensor bandwagon so far. Or M4/3s for that matter.

 

Maybe they are cautious to protect their entry SLR sales that is hugely important for both. Much more than for Panny, Oly or Sony, let alone Ricoh or Samsung.

 

Maybe, but I think sooner or later Canon and Nikon may mot have a choice but jump on the bandwagon given the heavy bulk of dslrs. However, I have also heard from Sony sales reps that the nex is killing the alpha line. So when it was launched they didnt have enough to sell and most are buying the nex in lieu of the alpha series, and ended up with nothing since the nex was running out fast daily. That may not necessarily be good for Sony. But for now it is wait and see till photokina. There is a rumored leica EVIL too.

[Guest stnami]

By the way magnum photographer David Harvey has been using a GF1 and that includes stuff for National Geographic ...... so it can't be too bad a unit

[NZDavid]

I reckon if Leica simply stuck a red circle on the GF1 it would sell brilliantly! If they rounded the sides and added the top-plate controls of the X1, even better!

[Danielsan]

Many have seen this but it does highlight what someone can do Panasonic Lumix GF1 Field Test — 16 Days in the Himalayas

 

from the pictures im not so impressed, nice for a camera in this size but X1 can do the same or probably better especially with photoshop. The X1 buyers want the smallest form factor and the best IQ possible, well the majority of them

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[prk60091]

I reckon if Leica simply stuck a red circle on the GF1 it would sell brilliantly! If they rounded the sides and added the top-plate controls of the X1, even better!

 

All that would do is to reignite the pana-0ly-leica controversy. "Is it a real leica?" there is no dispute the x1 is a Leica from looks to results to manufacture.