Backup to my new M6TTL: R4S, M4-P, or R6.2?

[Ruhayat]

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Hi everyone. 2 weeks ago I bought a brand new M6TTL which I came across by chance in a shop. After seeing the results from 3 rolls I've decided I'm sticking to film for my personal shooting (I have my Canon 5D for jobs -- I'm a graphic designer -- but digital printouts just look flat to my eyes now).

 

Anyway. I'm now looking for a backup to my precious, which really is a little too precious to take out in some parts of town. Thus far I have acquired a Yashica GSN, which works fine for events and stuff, but it's a little too big and it doesn't handle like an M.

 

I have the following options, in ascending order of cost. Any advice or tips you might have would be welcome:

 

1. All-black Leica R4S (secondhand): I like the feel of it and it is small, almost M-like. Getting this would give me the best of both worlds (plus let me use my existing 2/50mm and 2.8/28mm R lenses), and it's cheap enough I wouldn't lose sleep if it got stolen. The shutter sounds softer than that of an R6.2 to my ears. But still, it's not as sex as shooting with...

 

2. ...a black M4-P (secondhand): lighter than my M6TTL and feels firm in the hand, too. It's double the price of the R4S, though... will it give me 2x the value? Still, my heart says buy this, but my mind says better to get...

 

3. ...a chrome R6.2. Brand new! From the same shop I got the M6TTL from. Unfortunately, it costs 3x the R4s, and 50% more than the M4-P. That and the loud shutter sound are two reasons against getting one. But on the pro side, it's brand new so has warranty, and it would give me 2 lenses immediately (I already own 28mm and 50mm Leica R lenses).

 

Any thoughts? Which one would you get to complement your main M, and why?

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[hunghang]

I would choose any RF body that takes M-mount lenses. That way, you can always use your existing lenses without having to deal with yet another system. An M2/M4 sounds like ideal candidates. Failing that, a CV Bessa R2/3/4 would be a good choice also. CL/CLE would also make good candidates.

[Lazzaros]

I have the M7 but I can't live without my R8 too. I love to use the different systems...

 

That's why I have the 5DMKII, M7, R8, Hasselblad 500CM, Kowa Six, Contax 645 and others.

 

Each system has it magic!

 

Maybe you can give a try to the R one....

 

 

(Where do you get "new" Leica cameras with that "good price"? )

[tobey bilek]

Two systems are a pain. I would rather have one complete. If you have more than one, it is always a question, what to bring.

 

I have a few 6`s 6.2`s and 7`s and they are simply terrific cameras. Not sure if I would buy into that system today.

 

R4 are worth about what what you pay. Mine shook like a car out of tune, had a crappy viewfinder, and the electronics can be iffy. Sent it back to Leica reguarding the shake along with film from the R3 that also went thru the R4, same lens, showing the difference. They denied a difference.

I have since come to learn there is no mirror dampner in the R4 and R5, hence the shake.

They are not like the Leicaflex models or the R 6/7/8/9. No way. Leica has no parts. AVOID

 

Complete the M system with another body, and lenses.

[Guest ccmsosse]

Two systems are a pain. I would rather have one complete. If you have more than one, it is always a question, what to bring. Complete the M system with another body, and lenses.

I would agree with that sentiment. M system - then you can use your lenses on different bodies.

What film are you using? B+W or color.

 

And why not add a MP if you don't want digital?

 

Cheers

[antistatic]

He is looking for something a little less precious than the M6 so I don't think an MP will do.

 

I would also get another M body.

[E.M]

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I 'd buy the R6-2 , fabulous mechanical camera and maybe the last chance to acquire it new . If you can afford it ...

 

Etienne Michiels

[bill]

I'm with those who believe that the backup to an M is another M. Anything else is an adjunct, or supplement. that is not a bad thing, but it is not the same as a backup. I have M2 and M7s and an R7. The R7 is not a backup to the M system or vice versa, although there is some overlap in focal lengths. Each system does different things better.

 

Regards,

 

Bill

[smb]

Your best backup is the same camera in a different finish. This way you can use the same lenses and shoot black and white and color at the same time. In addition when using the same camera there will be not difference in handling.

[FiZZ]

As mentioned above, I would recommend a Bessa. It's the same lens mount, so you don't have to invest in more lenses. Plus, the Bessa apparently have a longer baseline and higher magnification than Leica M's, never a bad thing in my opinion.

[Jeff S]

I'm a bit confused by the initial post. The beginning refers to the need for a 'back-up'; the end cites the need for a camera to 'complement' the M. Two different issues and responses. For the former, another M; for the latter, depends on subject matter and related needs and preferences, i.e., what's missing from the M for the OP?

 

In addition, while I'm not familiar with Malaysia, I'm not sure that the public will be able to distinguish between a 'precious' M6 versus an M4 or R4, etc. If the camera is considered too 'precious' just because it's new and pristine, I suggest just using it and be happy.

 

Jeff

[earleygallery]

Maybe just spend some of the money on insurance?

 

You have some R lenses but not tele or zooms so there's little advantage in buying an R body unless you will need longer tele and or macro in the future, or you could sell the R lenses to put towards another M body.

 

Personally I use both systems and enjoy them equally. R4 are cheap now, the R6.2 will also be too precious!

[Ruhayat]

Sorry for the late response... I don't have Internet over the weekend. Thanks for all the thoughts. I agree, the R6.2 would be as precious as the M6TTL. So that's out of the running.

 

(For those interested to know, I bought the M6TTL brand new for half the price of a new MP that another shop here was selling. Leicas are darned expensive here in Malaysia, though. The price was RM6,500... about USD1800. The R6.2 is about RM1,000 less; that is, around USD275 cheaper).

 

I think I shall go for the M4-P after all. It does make sense to have the same body. Thanks again for your thoughts.

[Ruhayat]

By the way, the same shop also has a complete Minolta CLE set (28, 40, 90) going for the same price as the M4-P body. Tempting, I have to say... the lenses are nice and compact. Not so sure about the body, though... the M4-P just feels a lot nicer to hold. And I thought digital decisions were tough.

[holmes]

Confusion??? You talk about M series then jump to a totally different element, a SLR, "R"series. The R series is generally thought of as being wide, with a long reach, throw in macro. I have both systems. Once upon a time I shot a fair amount of editorial work: college, high school, grade school, childrens books. In addition, some of my efforts found their way into presentation papers, dissertations, military papers for presentation at Pentagon level. But all of this did not require three bags and a slave to carry. You have a M6TTL. Why don't you shoot a lot with it and then start thinking of expanding. Bye the way I have two R6.2s and one R7.

[symmetron]

Redundancy in your M system is the way to go.

[batmobile]

No question, another M6TTL just like the one you have (but black).

 

KISS... nothing is better than knowing whichever you pick up the operation is the same eyes closed. Thats why I shoot five Ms all of which are identical in key areas (MPs and M6 classics). Dials go the same way and dimensions are the same. only real differences are film rewind (I actually prefer the MP), meter indications (easy to deal with as dials still turn the same way) and the M6s are a touch lighter.

 

It may be more boring, but I like exciting photos and boring cameras more than exciting cameras and boring pictures. Only deviation is the use of an Eos 1n with 85L permanently affixed alongside the Ms when I can travel with my bigger bag.

[Ruhayat]

Thank you all for your words. They have been helpful.

 

Having decided that another M would be better for me as a second camera, I'm pondering which model would be the best for the 90mm Summicron I am shooting with now. (Starting from next week my M6TTL will live semi-full-time with the CV Nokton 1.1/50mm that's on its way. )

 

So far it looks like the M3 is the best candidate. But for some reason it commands a price RM1,000 higher than the M4-P. In fact, it's the same price as a brand new Zeiss Ikon, so...

 

Interesting times. Good thing I'm not pressured by a deadline so can take my time. Thanks again for all the responses.

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[earleygallery]

Actually I'd be tempted by that Minolta set, unless you already have those focal length lenses.

[Ruhayat]

Actually I'd be tempted by that Minolta set, unless you already have those focal length lenses.

 

I sort of *do* have Leica lenses in that range, except that I have them the wrong way around -- 28mm and 50mm for the R system, 90mm for the M system.

 

Guess I'll have to start over with all-M lenses, and I'm tempted to get the Minolta set just for the lenses, too. Especially that 40mm. And that 90mm f4 is *tiny*!