bill Posted November 19, 2009 Share #21 Posted November 19, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) But it's not as if Leica were one of those big corporations (Canon, Nikon, Panasonic...) who can afford some initial lost sales if there is a problem, and who have enough products and markets to offset a glitch on the distribution front of a particular item. Leica is a small outfit which has suceeded in opeing a big new market with the digital Ms. But they can't satisfy the demand. They are seemingly constantly on the verge of going bankrupt, and the M9 was supposed to be their life-saver. One error could be fatal. Everything is relative. And where does this "seemingly constantly on the verge of going bankrupt" come from? Nothing like a bit of random subjectivity. I really am getting tired of all this memory card half-empty negativity. More gloom and despond than an Ingmar Bergman adaptation of an Ibsen play. Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted November 19, 2009 Posted November 19, 2009 Hi bill, Take a look here M9 Delivery Delay again ?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Guest EarlBurrellPhoto Posted November 19, 2009 Share #22 Posted November 19, 2009 If it were just a matter of tremendous demand overtaking Leica's production capacity, then shouldn't there be at least a steady trickle of M9s arriving at dealers? Like 50 a day, which is what someone said Leica can produce. But the deliveries seem to have stopped in their tracks, at least according to what a couple of large-scale dealers told a friend who has been waiting. To me that hints some sort of snag in the clockworks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted November 19, 2009 Share #23 Posted November 19, 2009 They're trickling into places like Toronto. One large retail house just got its first demo, so I have a feeling Leica is slowly filling out secondary markets (like Canada) before getting back to their primary ones... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted November 19, 2009 Share #24 Posted November 19, 2009 If it were just a matter of tremendous demand overtaking Leica's production capacity, then shouldn't there be at least a steady trickle of M9s arriving at dealers? There is, according to people posting here, which of course is not a representative sample. But the deliveries seem to have stopped in their tracks, at least according to what a couple of large-scale dealers told a friend who has been waiting. To me that hints some sort of snag in the clockworks. This is hearsay and unfounded speculation. The facts are: 1. There are a trickle of people posting here to say that they have their M9s 2. This forum is by any standards statistically unrepresentative 3. There is nothing to indicate that Leica are not delivering 50 bodies a day Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted November 19, 2009 Share #25 Posted November 19, 2009 But the deliveries seem to have stopped in their tracks, at least according to what a couple of large-scale dealers told a friend who has been waiting That's not what my dealer said when I spoke to him earlier this week. He has a waiting list, but bodies are still being delivered. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammam Posted November 19, 2009 Share #26 Posted November 19, 2009 Everything is relative. And where does this "seemingly constantly on the verge of going bankrupt" come from? Nothing like a bit of random subjectivity. I really am getting tired of all this memory card half-empty negativity. More gloom and despond than an Ingmar Bergman adaptation of an Ibsen play. Regards, Bill Maybe you were sleeping a few years ago, just before the launch of the M8, when Leica almost went into insolvency, then was salvaged by a company, then by another one (Hermes, I think.) And their sales for 2008-2009 show a 14 % decrease. And their has been quite a game of shuffling of high level executives there in the last few yeas. Not the sign of a very healthy corporation. Not that I wish them bad, on the contrary, I'm a great admirer of their products, I have a M8.2 and I hope they will be there for a very long time. This is why I'm worried to see them repeat the same mistakes over and over. I'm not a marketing specialist, but here is my take on the M9 distribution: Create a buzz: good. Find a spin for the announcement of a new great product: good Create excitation and expectation: good Not capitalize on all this: very bad. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lotw Posted November 19, 2009 Share #27 Posted November 19, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Well, with Apple it's not much different. Magic Mouse, iPhone 3G s, it's all not in the stores. Maybe it's the financial crisis :-): the banks do not give the credits to produce unless there is a certain amount of consumers. By the way the estimation of my M9-dealer is April 2010 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted November 19, 2009 Share #28 Posted November 19, 2009 Maybe you were sleeping a few years ago, just before the launch of the M8, when Leica almost went into insolvency, then was salvaged by a company, then by another one (Hermes, I think.) And their sales for 2008-2009 show a 14 % decrease. And their has been quite a game of shuffling of high level executives there in the last few yeas. Not the sign of a very healthy corporation. Not that I wish them bad, on the contrary, I'm a great admirer of their products, I have a M8.2 and I hope they will be there for a very long time. This is why I'm worried to see them repeat the same mistakes over and over. I'm not a marketing specialist, but here is my take on the M9 distribution: Create a buzz: good. Find a spin for the announcement of a new great product: good Create excitation and expectation: good Not capitalize on all this: very bad. I was far from asleep at that time, and recollect it better than you appear to. My issue is that you are telescoping and conflating years of events and thereby making it sound like a current issue. There are few companies around today that have not suffered a reduction in their order books; the measure is that many are no longer with us - Leica is, and has a full order book. What more do you want? Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanJW Posted November 19, 2009 Share #29 Posted November 19, 2009 My impression is the deliveries have increased rather than decreased. Mine is coming --- finally -- tomorrow. But I was also told by a retailer friend that he would have some end of this week, beginning of next as well. This isn't a good sample either, but there's no sense conjuring up systemic delays, which cannot be inferred from isolated cases. Having said that, there seems to be general agreement that gray bodies are still scarce. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammam Posted November 19, 2009 Share #30 Posted November 19, 2009 I was far from asleep at that time, and recollect it better than you appear to. My issue is that you are telescoping and conflating years of events and thereby making it sound like a current issue. There are few companies around today that have not suffered a reduction in their order books; the measure is that many are no longer with us - Leica is, and has a full order book. What more do you want? Regards, Bill My point is that Leica is a fragile small company, and one would expect them to be very careful and learn from past lessons. They did exactly the same thing with the M8, launch it in great fanfare, only to make their customers wait months to get one, thus creating disappointment, frustration and even anger. The lack of clear communication at the time didn't help matters. I'm sure many would be new customers shun Leica at that moment. Even diehard Leica fans. Don't you think they could have avoided repeating the same mistake, by waiting until they were sure to deliver on their pormises, and ship M9s at a normal pace? But no, they had to rush the announcement before the assembly line was ready. And to make matters worse, they have the exact same problem of communication now as they had at the time of the M8. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken_tanaka Posted November 19, 2009 Share #31 Posted November 19, 2009 That Leica has badly botched the M9's supply chain is self-evident truth. I ordered mine on the 9/9 announcement day (and paid for it in full). Only ONE has been delivered to my local dealer, one of only three Leica dealers in Chicago. CHICAGO...six million people in the area. I'm now #1 in line and have been for at least two weeks. Early scarcity of popular products is to be expected. But the $7,000 M9 is hardly "popular" (by Canon or Nikon standards) and months-long delays exceed the definition of "scarcity". The M9's hardly critical to me but Leica has botched this badly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
yanidel Posted November 19, 2009 Share #32 Posted November 19, 2009 That Leica has badly botched the M9's supply chain is self-evident truth. I ordered mine on the 9/9 announcement day (and paid for it in full). Only ONE has been delivered to my local dealer, one of only three Leica dealers in Chicago. CHICAGO...six million people in the area. I'm now #1 in line and have been for at least two weeks. Early scarcity of popular products is to be expected. But the $7,000 M9 is hardly "popular" (by Canon or Nikon standards) and months-long delays exceed the definition of "scarcity". The M9's hardly critical to me but Leica has botched this badly. You guys in the US need a bit of understanding sometimes ... when Apple came out with the Iphone, we got it almost a year afterwards. And it is the same for many products. So for once that a EU company has a hot product, I have no problem to see them ship first to Arras, small town of 42,015 and 30'000 cows in France instead of Chicago. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick_dykstra Posted November 19, 2009 Share #33 Posted November 19, 2009 Keep cool, last week I had the opportunity to visit the factory in Solms, full tour. <snip> Still waiting for my M9 steel gray, ... Hans Hans, did you point and say, "Just let me have that one and I'll be fine thanks." p.s. Are the M9s mentioned in this thread on the map? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
d2mini Posted November 19, 2009 Share #34 Posted November 19, 2009 You guys in the US need a bit of understanding sometimes ... when Apple came out with the Iphone, we got it almost a year afterwards. And it is the same for many products. So for once that a EU company has a hot product, I have no problem to see them ship first to Arras, small town of 42,015 and 30'000 cows in France instead of Chicago. Ha! Touché. Best post in this whole thread. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhoersch Posted November 19, 2009 Share #35 Posted November 19, 2009 This is hearsay and unfounded speculation. The facts are: 1. There are a trickle of people posting here to say that they have their M9s 2. This forum is by any standards statistically unrepresentative 3. There is nothing to indicate that Leica are not delivering 50 bodies a day Regards, Bill May I add "fact" no. 4? There is nothing to indicate that Leica are delivering 50 bodies a day But of course, your speculations are known to be better than anybody else's around here, that's what makes them "facts". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhoersch Posted November 19, 2009 Share #36 Posted November 19, 2009 My point is that Leica is a fragile small company, and one would expect them to be very careful and learn from past lessons. They did exactly the same thing with the M8, launch it in great fanfare, only to make their customers wait months to get one, thus creating disappointment, frustration and even anger. The lack of clear communication at the time didn't help matters. I'm sure many would be new customers shun Leica at that moment. Even diehard Leica fans. Don't you think they could have avoided repeating the same mistake, by waiting until they were sure to deliver on their pormises, and ship M9s at a normal pace? But no, they had to rush the announcement before the assembly line was ready. And to make matters worse, they have the exact same problem of communication now as they had at the time of the M8. I'm absolutely with you here, it is really sickening and heart-rending to see Leica make the same mistakes over and over again. It's something like a small miracle that they are still around. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted November 19, 2009 Share #37 Posted November 19, 2009 May I add "fact" no. 4? There is nothing to indicate that Leica are delivering 50 bodies a day But of course, your speculations are known to be better than anybody else's around here, that's what makes them "facts". Of course you may add no. 4. And you may also explain what makes my other points invalid? Y'know, I am really pig sick and tired of you people and your constant misery. Wallow all you like, if it makes you happy. There are more negatives around here than an old Fleet Street picture desk. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
UliWer Posted November 19, 2009 Share #38 Posted November 19, 2009 I'm absolutely with you here, it is really sickening and heart-rending to see Leica make the same mistakes over and over again. It's something like a small miracle that they are still around. That's just amazing! mhoersch goes sick by grieve about Leica's misfortune that there are more customers than they ever exspected! You made my day; I never laughed as much in this forum, as about this remark. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest EarlBurrellPhoto Posted November 19, 2009 Share #39 Posted November 19, 2009 I ordered mine on the 9/9 announcement day (and paid for it in full). Only ONE has been delivered to my local dealer, one of only three Leica dealers in Chicago. CHICAGO...six million people in the area. I'm now #1 in line and have been for at least two weeks. ...But since Stunsworth and Bill know there are 50 M9s being delivered daily , then we might have to conclude that Chicago Leica dealers are offering to sell M9s to the highest bidder in the same way senate seats have been offered-up in that state Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted November 19, 2009 Share #40 Posted November 19, 2009 ...But since Stunsworth and Bill know there are 50 M9s being delivered daily Did I say that? Try running your finger along under the words as you read them, or just try not to twist things to your own agenda. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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