Indecisive Posted November 2, 2009 Share #1 Posted November 2, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Given the 15% VAT is due to end soon .. and most people won't get their M9 until 2010 .. will that mean most will pay £4955.43? Or will the prices remain what they are, in effect a slight price decrease? I suppose it will happen to everything in the catalogue? Did Leica prices get adjusted when the VAT fell to 15%? I know many non photographic retailers didn't make adjustments. Or did for a few weeks/months and then slowly the prices crept back to 17.5% levels but with only 15% going to the VAT man. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted November 2, 2009 Posted November 2, 2009 Hi Indecisive, Take a look here M9 UK prices. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
marknorton Posted November 2, 2009 Share #2 Posted November 2, 2009 Leica like to raise their prices on 1 January as a sort of self-congratulatory pat on the back for another year of on-time introductions of bug-free products, things like the M9, Noctilux and the S2. I expect this year will be no different and given the demand for the M9, I'd expect to see some sort of modest price increase. I doubt very much Leica UK will hold prices across the VAT increase, so my money would be on an M9 costing £4990. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
microview Posted November 2, 2009 Share #3 Posted November 2, 2009 Isn't the solution to order one now and even pay the full price, so that's the outlay regardless of any delays in getting one or VAT changes? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overgaard Posted November 2, 2009 Share #4 Posted November 2, 2009 What is the change going to be. The VAT is 15% now, and then in the future [what]? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indecisive Posted November 2, 2009 Author Share #5 Posted November 2, 2009 What is the change going to be. The VAT is 15% now, and then in the future [what]? That was a govt initiative to boost retail sales in the UK. They lowered VAT from 17.5 to 15%. This stops at 31 Dec 2009. Just wondering as there was the thread about Harris not honouring discounts. Do people remember that there will be VAT increase? No doubt lots of thread about people thinking they would pay the price at the time of order rather than time of payment. My understanding is that if the price stays at £4850 then in effect the dealer is giving a discount. As the VAT man will take 17.5% of the non VAT price. If I was Leica .. I would advice all on the massive waiting list NOW. For some it maybe financially insignificant but some people are a stickler for pinciples Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonoslack Posted November 2, 2009 Share #6 Posted November 2, 2009 What is the change going to be. The VAT is 15% now, and then in the future [what]? HI Thorsten Interesting point that. In theory it'll go back to 17.5 . . . in practice I wonder whether they won't put it up to 20% (or even more). The VAT will be chargeable on the price at the time of purchase, so I'd guess that you're okay if you pay in full before the end of the year. If you haven't, the point at which you ordered it would be irrelevant. As for price increases - I think it would be an unpopular move to put the price up for people who've been waiting for 3 months for their camera! I would have thought it more likely that they would do a price increase after they've got rid of the backlog (or at least held the price for existing orders). However, I know nothing, just guessing here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted November 2, 2009 Share #7 Posted November 2, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) That's the dealers' job, not Leica's. Don't forget that no one knows what VAT will go up to in January - no one at Nr 11 have told us. My bet is that it will be 20%, which will bring us in line with some of our friends in Europe, and be much easier to calculate So, a £4,900 product with VAT today, would equal £5,113. Call it £5,100. What would you rather do with the £200? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted November 2, 2009 Share #8 Posted November 2, 2009 Don't forget that no one knows what VAT will go up to in January - no one at Nr 11 have told us That's not true, Andy. The current rate is a temporary reduction so the rate will return to 17.5% on January 1st. No more, no less. It is inconceivable for even this government to increase the rate from 17.5% without warning. I would think a further increase to 20% will be announced in the next budget (March?) with the increase to take place in 2011. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted November 2, 2009 Share #9 Posted November 2, 2009 It's a temporary reduction, but AFAIR, he hasn't said what he will put it back up to. He needs to squeeze every last penny out of you. And me. I will see if I can find out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted November 2, 2009 Share #10 Posted November 2, 2009 Didn't take long. Blame the drugs... But watch for some sneakiness in the mid term review that they like to do later this month Increase in the standard VAT rate The standard rate of VAT was temporarily reduced to 15 per cent on 1 December 2008 and it will return to 17.5 per cent on 1 January 2010. For any sales of standard-rated goods or services that you make on or after 1 January 2010 you must charge VAT at the rate of 17.5 per cent. If you have a cash business and calculate your VAT using the VAT fraction you must revert to the VAT fraction of seven fortysevenths from 1 January 2010. The change only applies to the standard VAT rate. There are no changes to sales that are zero-rated or reduced-rated for VAT. Similarly, there are no changes to the VAT exemptions. Any sales you make at these rates are unaffected by this change. This guide tells you how to account for the change to the standard rate of VAT. It also tells you where you can get further information . That's from the HMRC website by the way, which reminds me that I must complete my tax return... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted November 2, 2009 Share #11 Posted November 2, 2009 He needs to squeeze every last penny out of you. And me. Andy, I don't disagree with the gist of your argument but the standard rate will be returning to 17.5% in January. I'm VAT registered and would have been informed by now if the rate was not going to return to the expected 17.5% (HMRC are pretty good at sending out even the most arcane VAT news). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted November 2, 2009 Share #12 Posted November 2, 2009 But watch for some sneakiness in the mid term review that they like to do later this month I'm sure you're right but I think a further increase will be scheduled for 2011. The government won't risk the impact such a move will have on consumer spending until we are expected to be well out of recession. Getting back on topic, I'd be amazed if Leica don't raise prices on January 1st. £5250 (including 17.5% VAT) for the M9 wouldn't surprise me. It's just not Leica's way to see in the New Year without raising prices. M9 aside, Leica lens prices will presumably ratchet further into the stratosphere (I believe that a 'bog standard' 35 Summicron now has a RRP of over £1900; who want's to bet it won't be £2000+ come January). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
spylaw4 Posted November 2, 2009 Share #13 Posted November 2, 2009 <snip> Getting back on topic, I'd be amazed if Leica don't raise prices on January 1st. <snip> I believe that a 'bog standard' 35 Summicron now has a RRP of over £1900; <snip>. £1819 actually IIRC I think we can expect an increase throughout the Leica price list come 1 Jan. apart from the VAT reverting to 17.5%. What dealers choose to do is up to them. I would guess that some at least may absorb the VAT increase for pre-orders. Existing stock - no increase. I expect there will be some "discussion" with Leica re M9s pre-ordered (with deposit) but not delivered! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted November 2, 2009 Share #14 Posted November 2, 2009 £1819 actually IIRC I'm sure it was something like £1946 when I was in the Mayfair store in September. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
spylaw4 Posted November 2, 2009 Share #15 Posted November 2, 2009 I'm sure it was something like £1946 when I was in the Mayfair store in September. It may well be but 1819 was the highest figure I could find in a rapid dealer search. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
yanidel Posted November 2, 2009 Share #16 Posted November 2, 2009 People pay £4900 for a camera and worry about a 2.5% price increase Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted November 3, 2009 Share #17 Posted November 3, 2009 It's not a price increase, it's giving money to the taxman to squander - that's what hurts... Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpattinson Posted November 3, 2009 Share #18 Posted November 3, 2009 It's not a price increase, it's giving money to the taxman to squander - that's what hurts... Regards, Bill Well, someone has to fund those bonuses... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
george_b Posted November 3, 2009 Share #19 Posted November 3, 2009 People pay £4900 for a camera and worry about a 2.5% price increase Oh no. If I choose to order mid January I would accept the offered price. What grabs me by the throat is that I am willing to purchase today, should I be at the be at the back of the queue and Leica choose to supply after January 1st THEN I am disadvantaged! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
yanidel Posted November 3, 2009 Share #20 Posted November 3, 2009 Oh no. If I choose to order mid January I would accept the offered price. What grabs me by the throat is that I am willing to purchase today, should I be at the be at the back of the queue and Leica choose to supply after January 1st THEN I am disadvantaged! I would think that when you order a good and leave a deposit, then the agreed price becomes a commitment for up to a legal time limit. Now make sure the quote includes VAT from the start. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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