bill Posted October 26, 2009 Share #81 Posted October 26, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Ok... What if the M10 has no real architectural changes from the M9. Just a updated Kodak FF sensor, with better frame lines, faster processor, larger buffers? Based on Andy Barton's logic, that would not require a separate forum. M9/M10 would be still together... "What if..." The fact is that the M8 and M9 are different animals. One is an evolutionary dead end and the other is the world's first viable and functional full-frame rangefinder camera. There is a huge buzz of interest in the M9, not in the M8 any more. If I want to buy a new car, I don't want to wade through everyone's opinions on last year's model to find out about what interests me. Ditto TVs, mobile 'phones and any other consumer product I can think of. Keep 'em separate for now. Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 26, 2009 Posted October 26, 2009 Hi bill, Take a look here M9 & M8 Forum merge?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
swamiji Posted October 26, 2009 Share #82 Posted October 26, 2009 "What if..." The fact is that the M8 and M9 are different animals. One is an evolutionary dead end and the other is the world's first viable and functional full-frame rangefinder camera. There is a huge buzz of interest in the M9, not in the M8 any more. If I want to buy a new car, I don't want to wade through everyone's opinions on last year's model to find out about what interests me. Ditto TVs, mobile 'phones and any other consumer product I can think of. Keep 'em separate for now. Regards, Bill I mostly agree, however there is still commonality in M photography. Look at the thread on the 18mm super-elmar as case in point. No matter what crop factor we share the same lineage, lenses, skills, etc. What skill set do you need to watch TV? I did not join this forum just talk about camera features, but to draw on the skills on my fellow Leica Photographers. Often I get more insight from the film forum, than from the Digital forum, just for this very reason. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted October 26, 2009 Share #83 Posted October 26, 2009 ...the new M10 owners (late next year ?) to help us enjoy their new toy. Hi Frank, I've seen you mention this before. Do you have any evidence, or are you just making it up? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted October 26, 2009 Share #84 Posted October 26, 2009 Ok... What if the M10 has no real architectural changes from the M9. Just a updated Kodak FF sensor, with better frame lines, faster processor, larger buffers? Based on Andy Barton's logic, that would not require a separate forum. M9/M10 would be still together... Presumably you mean like the M8, M8.2 differences? Combining them was sensible. I suggest that such changes would not make an M10 but rather an M9.x so, keep them together. OTOH, a true M10 would require an new (for some period) sub-forum. That is the logic currently being followed on the forum as I see it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted October 26, 2009 Share #85 Posted October 26, 2009 I mostly agree, however there is still commonality in M photography. ... ...Often I get more insight from the film forum, than from the Digital forum, just for this very reason. I couldn't agree with you more. Which is why this Forum as a whole is such a great resource. It would also be true to say that the signal to noise ratio in some of the other sub-fora is far less; in fact up to today the M9 sub-forum had largely escaped some of the nonsense that sadly afflicted the M8 sub-forum. Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
swamiji Posted October 26, 2009 Share #86 Posted October 26, 2009 I couldn't agree with you more. Which is why this Forum as a whole is such a great resource. It would also be true to say that the signal to noise ratio in some of the other sub-fora is far less; in fact up to today the M9 sub-forum had largely escaped some of the nonsense that sadly afflicted the M8 sub-forum. Regards, Bill So I guess the question posed in this thread, How to separate the noise from the substance in the Digital side of things? Obviously the M8/M9/M10 forums is of limited success, and certainly caused a "we vs them" attitude. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted October 26, 2009 Share #87 Posted October 26, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Anone else find it mildly amusing that a proposal to merge the M8 and M9 forums has been posted in the M9 forum, rather than the "About the Leica Forum" forum? <grin>. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
swamiji Posted October 26, 2009 Share #88 Posted October 26, 2009 Anone else find it mildly amusing that a proposal to merge the M8 and M9 forums has been posted in the M9 forum, rather than the "About the Leica Forum" forum? <grin>. Or the M8 forum for that matter... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted October 26, 2009 Share #89 Posted October 26, 2009 I'm off to raise the 'froth' on a glass of water elsewhere now. Translated: Having lunch with a fellow forum member who wants me to sell my M9 to them. LOL. I will allow a little fondling to happen, but that's all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
redbaron Posted October 27, 2009 Share #90 Posted October 27, 2009 You have missed the point.......Solms are only going to be interested going forward in M9 and ideas for M10. They have no interest in M8 and providing M8 firmware for example will not be on their radar screen unless they are held to account on a forum read by all (ie M9 Forum) ....please think about it! Frank, this is a Leica User Forum. It is not an AGM. Nobody here, including you, is on Leica's board, nor are they shareholders. If they are, they are well aware that posting comments such as yours could be detrimental to their share price. Leica, like every other company around the world, as you should well know, is accountable to its bottom line. Not the rantings of a very, very few self appointed armchair critics. "But, but, but," I hear you say? There are no "buts", Frank. I know you own some Leica equipment and are therefore concerned about its value. This is not the place. Buy some shares and voice your opinions at the AGM. I'm quite sure that you would soon think twice about actions that could lower your returns. As for your predictions for an M10. Just to set the record straight, you have absolutely no idea if, or when a successor to the M9 will be made, or indeed, if it is even being planned. Is that correct? Apart from your own imaginings, your supposition about such a camera is purely hypothetical. Is that correct? As for the merge. The owner has spoken. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted October 27, 2009 Share #91 Posted October 27, 2009 This thread has set me wondering. Locally, we have two daily papers. "The Herald Sun" and the "The Age". Now they do have a lot in common, in that they report on some similar things, but generally their reporting has a different style. The Herald Sun is very photo oriented, The Age is more 'reportage' oriented. I wonder if they would consider merging to save me reading one, then the other. It would suit me, don't really care about anyone else. P.S. Lunch was good. In fact very pleasant. I managed to keep my M9 and arranged to meet in Mumbai for a shoot out in January. hopefully it will be M9's at 20 paces! Now what was that I had for lunch? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BigSplash Posted October 27, 2009 Share #92 Posted October 27, 2009 Frank, this is a Leica User Forum. It is not an AGM. Nobody here, including you, is on Leica's board, nor are they shareholders. If they are, they are well aware that posting comments such as yours could be detrimental to their share price. Leica, like every other company around the world, as you should well know, is accountable to its bottom line. Not the rantings of a very, very few self appointed armchair critics. . This is a Leica User forum and not an AGM: I agree completely. I guess you are telling me to talk about Leica issues and NOT about share price or worry about share price. Where have I discussed share price? All I have said is that Leica management will push out the M9 and its lenses and then will introduce an M10 .....as a Forum we may wish to consider that inevitability. As for your predictions for an M10. Just to set the record straight, you have absolutely no idea if, or when a successor to the M9 will be made, or indeed, if it is even being planned. Is that correct? Apart from your own imaginings, your supposition about such a camera is purely hypothetical. Is that correct? . Let me make it clear yet again that I have NO special priviliged access to Solms strategy for a successor to the M9 in terms of a simple firmware upgrade or a completely new camera (M10). If I did I would be subject to a NDA in any case so even asking the question is strange. That said it is obvious that this will happen for both commercial reasons and technology reasons.......I can give a long detailed list of the reasons, ranging from sensor technology availability (its now a 5 years old technology), through to a need for Leica to maintain M9 high volumes for longer than just one year etc etc As for the merge. The owner has spoken. Actually Andreas has listed the issues he would face to merge the Forums. He did not rule out however that this will never happen, and in fact that door remains open as I understand it.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfokevin Posted October 27, 2009 Share #93 Posted October 27, 2009 As for your predictions for an M10. Just to set the record straight, you have absolutely no idea if, or when a successor to the M9 will be made, or indeed, if it is even being planned. Is that correct? Apart from your own imaginings, your supposition about such a camera is purely hypothetical. Is that correct? Mark you calendar... 10/10/10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BigSplash Posted October 27, 2009 Share #94 Posted October 27, 2009 Mark you calendar... 10/10/10 Absolutely ...already done!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LUF Admin Posted October 27, 2009 Share #95 Posted October 27, 2009 Actually Andreas has listed the issues he would face to merge the Forums. He did not rule out however that this will never happen, and in fact that door remains open as I understand it.... OMG, so many posts about this issue interpreting my cryptic oracle. In order to keep you from wasting much more energy on this topic: Never say never - maybe the forums will be merged, but please don't bother the moderators or me before March 2010. Sorry to say that but this forum isn't ruled democratically but by a well-meaning dictator (that's me;) ) I'm listening closely to you opinions but I have to consider some more aspects (including traffic, income and several 1000 members having not voted here) Please trust me: Changing the structure of a forum or a website is not easy - I've planned and tested a whole bunch of communities, ecommerce shops and other websites and what I've learned is: Easy is hard. Making a website easy to use is really hard.... Andreas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted October 27, 2009 Share #96 Posted October 27, 2009 Thank you (again) Andreas. Let me just highlight one of your points for the hard of thinking: ...maybe the forums will be merged, but please don't bother the moderators or me before March 2010. ...sounds sensible to me, and should drop the signal to noise ratio here again, at least for a while. Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted October 27, 2009 Share #97 Posted October 27, 2009 Andreas, thanks for the clarification. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevelap Posted October 27, 2009 Share #98 Posted October 27, 2009 Thanks Andreas, that should be perfectly clear to all, surely. For myself I'm happy with the status quo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BigSplash Posted October 27, 2009 Share #99 Posted October 27, 2009 It is clear.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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