erl Posted October 20, 2009 Share #41 Posted October 20, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Ro1and, a quick search turned this up. I haven't actually check if it is still active, but this is Jamie's original posting. http://private.james-roberts-photogr...8_profiles.zip Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 20, 2009 Posted October 20, 2009 Hi erl, Take a look here Some M8 advantages. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Ro1and Posted October 20, 2009 Share #42 Posted October 20, 2009 Ro1and, a quick search turned this up. I haven't actually check if it is still active, but this is Jamie's original posting.http://private.james-roberts-photogr...8_profiles.zip Thanks Erl, it worked. Roland Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coup de foudre Posted October 20, 2009 Share #43 Posted October 20, 2009 Ro1and, a quick search turned this up. I haven't actually check if it is still active, but this is Jamie's original posting.http://private.james-roberts-photogr...8_profiles.zip thanks, Erl, it's gone midnight and i was lazy... bonsoir! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelos Viskadourakis Posted October 22, 2009 Share #44 Posted October 22, 2009 some M8 merrits in real life photography 1st/ M8 BW 2500 iso 2nd/M8 BW 1250 iso 3rd/M8 ifrared in colour. 4th/M8 just in colour ,no UV/IR cut filter. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/100560-some-m8-advantages/?do=findComment&comment=1084791'>More sharing options...
SJP Posted October 22, 2009 Share #45 Posted October 22, 2009 Angelos, Great pictures!! Did you use an exposure compensation at 2500 iso for the fist picture or over expose in any way? So far I have never managed to geat really nice results at 2500 and 0EV. thanks Stephen Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
viramati Posted October 22, 2009 Share #46 Posted October 22, 2009 Hi Thanks for the profile link but not sure where I should be putting them. Am using MacOs 10.6. Thanks David ------------------- Zenfolio | David Sampson Photography Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelos Viskadourakis Posted October 23, 2009 Share #47 Posted October 23, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Angelos, Great pictures!! Did you use an exposure compensation at 2500 iso for the fist picture or over expose in any way? So far I have never managed to geat really nice results at 2500 and 0EV. thanks Stephen I realy dont know if i did it the right way but the way i create profiles in NOISE NINZA is as follows:the program has a profile chart ,i bring it up in my Apple calibrated screen and i photograph it from the screen-5000 kelvin for printing- very slightly out of focus to avoid the screen texture and then i use " profile chart" comand and save that profile and recall it when i need it,for Leica M8 i had created a profile with the chart at 650 iso and that is the one i use for my 2500 iso M8 images,i did the same with even CLUX 1 -now sold.If someone has to sugest a better workflow please do so. If i remember well all images above are shot in JPEG.The original size looks very close to the image above -is not the case that we see less noise because of downsizing. PROFILING FOR NOISE IN M8. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbgeach Posted October 24, 2009 Share #48 Posted October 24, 2009 Hi Thanks for the profile link but not sure where I should be putting them. Am using MacOs 10.6.Thanks David ------------------- Zenfolio | David Sampson Photography copy them to: library/ColorSync/Profiles Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Double Negative Posted October 24, 2009 Share #49 Posted October 24, 2009 One advantage of the M8 is precisely *because* it has a crop factor... Your long lenses are just that much longer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicaiste Posted October 24, 2009 Share #50 Posted October 24, 2009 2 reasons I have given in threads asking about keeping the M8 are that I like having 24mm framelines and having a 1/8000 shutter speed. A recent trip in New England for foliage shooting saw both of these advantages. The first shot is with a favorite lens, the 24/2.8 asph. I just love the crispness and colors of this lens, and not having to use an external finder is more valuable to me than having a "true" 24mm FOV. The second shot utilizes the 1/8000 shutter. It's with the 28 cron wide open. Now I was at iso 640, so with an M9 could have been at 160 and still used F2, but I like the look of the M8 at iso 640, and a little cloud cover would have made it impossible to get this shot on the M9. best....Peter Peter, If you could start from scratch again would you choose : the M8 + 24/2.8 (= 32) + 28/2 (= 37) 10 Million Pixels or the M9 + 28/2 + 35/1,4 18 Million Pixels for those pictures ? Lucien Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
markgay Posted October 24, 2009 Share #51 Posted October 24, 2009 Is that another "more pixels are better" question? In that case I'd not use an M9 but a H3DII-31. However, I've firmly decided that unless you need the pixels to create a billboard sized advert (which is nothing to do with a good picture but a technical requirement of the trade) having more of them is irrelevant to the whether its a good picture. Let's just state it once again: pixels have nothing to do with taking a good picture. After all, if you are going to fall for that argument, why take a picture at all? Just save the location on your Tom Tom, wait for the "ultimate pixel crunching camera" to come along and only then, take the picture. You'd save yourself the problem of deleting all those pictures which are clearly no longer any good because a "better" camera has come along. By the way, let's also dump this acronym IQ. It took me a while to realise what it stood for, because i couldn't imagine people would be reducing "whether it is a good picture" to that snappy little gnome-like phrase, IQ. Tongue in cheek, Mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicaiste Posted October 24, 2009 Share #52 Posted October 24, 2009 Is that another "more pixels are better" question? Okay, same question without the pixels. Peter, If you could start from scratch again would you choose : the M8 + 24/2.8 (= 32) + 28/2 (= 37) or the M9 + 28/2 + 35/1,4 for those pictures ? Lucien Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelos Viskadourakis Posted October 25, 2009 Share #53 Posted October 25, 2009 Okay, same question without the pixels. Peter, If you could start from scratch again would you choose : the M8 + 24/2.8 (= 32) + 28/2 (= 37) or the M9 + 28/2 + 35/1,4 for those pictures ? Lucien After reviewing some test photos of M9 i notice that above 640 iso there is a phenomenon at the periphery of the image with wide angles -including 35 & 28-where it looks like a vignete correction that causes some very visible noise when you choose that function from menu-it looks that the new microlenses in the periphery of the sensor are not correcting 100%.Maybe is something that can be improved in future firmware,maybe. Also DOF is reduced as the sensor becomes bigger forcing the photographer to use higher iso with smaller aperture enhancing the above phenomenon with M9.In proffesional applications periphery is very critical and separates the pro from amateur especially in architecture and industrial imaging not so much a problem in street photography but if you plan to publish photos on a well print book you will see that from M9.Also there are couple of softwares that i have use for exibition enlargements with amazing algorithms that gave super big sizes -3 meters wide- from M8 with results identical to the original file without having the need of super huge hard disks for all the files in the computers/external disks. I know it takes some time for M photographers to adopt the crop factor but from what i see most of them they did so succesfuly after sometime using the M8.24X36 sensor is a good thing in general but is far from a complete solution in M system for the moment.To avoid misunderstandings i totaly support and expect on 24x36 M ,i dont thing is vital though and i have the filling that M digital has to develop more in 1,33 or 24x36 because is not the size of the sensor that needs more is the internal processing that can be advanced and didn't happen this time to the needed extend so we M photographers will have very soon to buy the next,next model because the M9 is not the ONE.:)After all M8 & M9 are surely excellent cameras for the photographer ,both demanding a good technique in developing DNG files and i remind to myself that i dont photograph only dark skin boxers in white satin clothes with a background of colonial textured enviroment and earthy colour subjects in Cuba waiting for the perfect light like a tv commercial-M9 promotional images- as under these conditions all descent cameras would perform more than excellent.:eek:We can be happy for the first 24x36 M digital-i am-but i can also see the drawbacks in the hurried introduction-for marketing reasons-of that model,again hurried. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicaiste Posted October 25, 2009 Share #54 Posted October 25, 2009 I know it takes some time for M photographers to adopt the crop factor but from what i see most of them they did so succesfuly after sometime using the M8.24X36 sensor is a good thing in general but is far from a complete solution in M system for the moment.To avoid misunderstandings i totaly support and expect on 24x36 M ,i dont thing is vital though and i have the filling that M digital has to develop more in 1,33 or 24x36 because is not the size of the sensor that needs more is the internal processing that can be advanced and didn't happen this time to the needed extend so we M photographers will have very soon to buy the next,next model because the M9 is not the ONE. From the Leica M9 test in Réponses Photo "Avant d'entrer dans notre test, signalons que le M9 fourni par Leica pour ce test fonctionnait avec un Firmware temporaire 1.002, en attendant celui qui equipera les boîtiers mis dans le commerce en octobre. Leica nous indique que le prochain firmware améliorera la balance des blancs automatique, notamment pour les lumières florescentes. La durée de formatage de la carte sera accélérée. Le bruit dans les hautes sensibilités sera réduit, avec moins de vignettage dans les basses lumières. etc... Ce test n'est donc qu'une première évaluation ... " "Before entering our test, we note that the M9 provided by Leica for this test worked with a temporary Firmware 1.002, pending the cameras placed on the market in October. Leica tells us that the next firmware will improve the auto white balance, especially for fluorescent light . The duration of formatting the card will be accelerated. The noise at high sensitivities will be reduced, with less vignetting in low light. etc.. This test is therefore an initial evaluation ... " The current M9 firmware is still the 1.002. If one remember how were the results with the first firmware on the M8... You may want to test yourself the M9 with the next firmware. Lucien Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
viramati Posted October 25, 2009 Share #55 Posted October 25, 2009 Hi Angelos. I find your last post interesting and wonder if a full frame sensor (and I am now Technical fiend) with a lens so close to it is a technical step to far. I use the tri elmar 16-18-21 on my M8 and am pretty happy with the results but would have liked the extra stop that I could have maybe gained from the M9 as it is only f4. So am wondering if I should just stick to D700 and 14-24/2.8 for the really wide stuff. apart from this in a way I'm glad that there is this production delay in being able to get a M9 as we can see what problems lie ahead. written before Lucien's post ------------------ David Sampson Photography Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelos Viskadourakis Posted October 25, 2009 Share #56 Posted October 25, 2009 From the Leica M9 test in Réponses Photo "Before entering our test, we note that the M9 provided by Leica for this test worked with a temporary Firmware 1.002, pending the cameras placed on the market in October. Leica tells us that the next firmware will improve the auto white balance, especially for fluorescent light . The duration of formatting the card will be accelerated. The noise at high sensitivities will be reduced, with less vignetting in low light. etc.. This test is therefore an initial evaluation ... " The current M9 firmware is still the 1.002. If one remember how were the results with the first firmware on the M8... You may want to test yourself the M9 with the next firmware. Lucien Thank you Lucien ,i'm aware of the first firmware and i believe there will be some kind of improvements-within the limitations of the sensor and existing boards in M9-i do tests my self and dont worry i will test the next and the next firmware but i was talking about the merrits of M8 mostly.:)of course judging from the company sales strategy towards M8 i dont expect many firmware upgrades for M9 as very soon we have to prepare to accept the M10 that will solve some of the M9 issues,.. M8 is capable with the proper technique and software knowledge to deliver close to excellent results in street and professional applications photography ,i do expect something that will deliver better with less post effort,when it comes i will point it out as fast as i can. If someone though is using 28 asph. f2 for most of his work at f2 with LEICA M6/7/MP then he desperately needs one M9 as all available 21 mm lenses that give the same fov in M8 are starting either at f2,8 Leica asph. or at very high price-21 leica f1,4 -and he needs an outside viewfinder on the top. But Lucien -as you are mentioning -if the noise can be reduced via the new firmware in M9 i suppose through a similar effort in firmware- only- will reduce the noise in M8 with the next M8 firmware in October,right????? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelos Viskadourakis Posted October 25, 2009 Share #57 Posted October 25, 2009 From the Leica M9 test in Réponses Photo If one remember how were the results with the first firmware on the M8... You may want to test yourself the M9 with the next firmware. Lucien I do remember very well how it was the first firmware in M8 there were some bug fixes-i sense that was a little change in WB and some colour recognition for Tungsten when the IR/CUT filters appear and two additions to the menu functions-discreet mode/auto iso-but nothing change regarding noise in M8 and i dont expect magic in M9 either,we became more efficient using M8 ,the photographers with their efforts and talent advance the M8. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Henry Posted October 25, 2009 Share #58 Posted October 25, 2009 As Angelos, here is a shot i made few days ago, inside of the Cathedrale of Nantes (France) at 640 iso with my M8 and the summilux 50mm : the real possibility of M8 is seen taken in DNG - Tiff and posted in Jpeg. picture uncorrected M8 advantage ..... and certainly also M9 but more expensive Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/100560-some-m8-advantages/?do=findComment&comment=1088896'>More sharing options...
dante Posted October 25, 2009 Share #59 Posted October 25, 2009 Use a little more imagination? 1. The M8 is completely debugged by this point - which means you are free to take pictures without learning about some new unknown failure mode that will tie up your camera for a month or two of service. 2. The M8, when used with a UV/IR, doesn't have the light IR contamination that the M9 does (which, oddly, is acknowledged in one of the initial M9 FAQs but without any explanation as to a cure). 3. The M8, with a visible-cut filter, will shoot IR - and can do so handheld on a sunny day with an f/1.4 lens. 4. At 1/3 the price of an M9, the M8 is more likely to get used as opposed to fondled. 5. The M8's dynamic range is slightly better. Erwin Puts posted the data showing this. It might be very small, but it's there. Dante Adan is fundamentally right. Using the 24 on an M9 while composing with the outside of 35mm frame lines will exactly duplicate the M8. That is as much framing precision as we have anyway. Since I hardly ever sell anything, I have struggled mightily to come up with scenarios where the M8 has a real advantage over the M9, and failed. The 1/8000 shutter might be one, but I have never used it on my 2 M8's. That aside, I can always replicate the 8 with the 9, but not vice versa. I currently plan to use my M9 for anything 50mm or below, and the M8's for backup and longer lenses ( which are never long enough) and where I would usually crop anyway. When I ultimately get a second Leica FF body (M9, M10, M9.n etc.) it is ebay for my M8's. I now have the 75 apo cron semi-permanently mounted on an M8. Regards ... Harold Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelos Viskadourakis Posted October 25, 2009 Share #60 Posted October 25, 2009 Doc Henry excellent image and technically speaking zero noise ,superb color rendering and tonal range and at the top zero zero IR contamination in a subject full of red. I will wait until late October when the M9 upgrade in Firmware will come that corrects the noise problems in M9 and obviously will come the same time with M8 Firmware that improves noise in high iso as mentioned in a post above ,very happy to know that a firmware upgrade will solve the problem of high iso noise in both cameras. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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