Ivar B Posted June 9, 2007 Share #1 Posted June 9, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) A while ago I found a Leica M4 Black Paint in really very nice condition, save a nasty dent and scratch in the top plate. I sent it to Leica in Solms to give the camera a thorough check up, and in the process Leica recommended to exchange the top plate for a new one. They did, and in the process engraved the original serial number etc. Now the camera is in 100 % condition mechanically, and also its outer appearance is lovely. Leica charged somewhat more than $1000 for the repairs. In ads etc for the M4 Black Paint I see that some sellers stress that all parts are original etc, probably indicating that no parts have ever been exchanged. I am not sure how to assess my camera - is it still original and with original parts if Leica exchanged the old top plate for a new Leica top plate for the very same camera model? Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/26282-leica-m4-black-paint/?do=findComment&comment=277093'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 9, 2007 Posted June 9, 2007 Hi Ivar B, Take a look here Leica M4 Black Paint. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
luigi bertolotti Posted June 9, 2007 Share #2 Posted June 9, 2007 I think you can stay sure: revamping has been made at the factory, i.e. it's ORIGINAL: as a collector, I'd simply suggest you to keep with care the written proof of Leica work (bill, docs about...) Let me say Your M4 is MAGNIFICENT. It's a longtime I plan to send my one (chrome, very close to yours in s/n) to Solms for a revamping/lifting but I fear both the bill and the absence of my beloved... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
echorec Posted June 9, 2007 Share #3 Posted June 9, 2007 I think Luigi is right and I agree with him. The camera looks great. Quite the opposite of mine: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/26282-leica-m4-black-paint/?do=findComment&comment=277231'>More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted June 9, 2007 Share #4 Posted June 9, 2007 ....but a "hard-lived" Leica keeps anyway its share of fascination... the brass at the edges speaks like "Time and use have taken their toll, but I'm still here to shot !" ...detach the Leicameter...it's disturbing the look... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
echorec Posted June 9, 2007 Share #5 Posted June 9, 2007 Ok Luigi, I will detach it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
josephgalilee Posted June 27, 2007 Share #6 Posted June 27, 2007 A while ago I found a Leica M4 Black Paint in really very nice condition, save a nasty dent and scratch in the top plate. I sent it to Leica in Solms to give the camera a thorough check up, and in the process Leica recommended to exchange the top plate for a new one. They did, and in the process engraved the original serial number etc. Now the camera is in 100 % condition mechanically, and also its outer appearance is lovely. Leica charged somewhat more than $1000 for the repairs. In ads etc for the M4 Black Paint I see that some sellers stress that all parts are original etc, probably indicating that no parts have ever been exchanged. I am not sure how to assess my camera - is it still original and with original parts if Leica exchanged the old top plate for a new Leica top plate for the very same camera model? Dear Ivar the black enamel is shine or matt? The shine paint is new version of thin film paint (like MP more prone to wear). The matt enamel is a old style version like M2/M3/M4, more thick film enamel more resistance to wear. The back door is a Black Chrome version for M4 Black Chrome (1974), more easy to find in stock on the Service Suppliers parts. The Black Paint door spare part it's very hard to find because too old (1968/1972). Anyway, your camera is a splendid example of "the last truly Leica" of the Leitz golden era. Please don't sell your M4, never, neither for a new one MP, M7 or M8. Best Regards, giuseppe Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wizard Posted June 28, 2007 Share #7 Posted June 28, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Please don't sell your M4, never, neither for a new one MP, M7 or M8. My guess would be that he owns those already . Ivar, very nice camera. I had Leica revamp a late M3 a year ago (also including a new top cover plate) and it came back like new. Enjoy your M4! Best regards, Andreas Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tummydoc Posted June 30, 2007 Share #8 Posted June 30, 2007 Collector value depends on the collector. To me as long as it's a factory replacement with an original black enamel top plate, engraved with the original body serial#, it should in my mind not be devalued. However it would be prudent to keep the paperwork intact so as to provide authentication that someone did not merely replace the top plate with one from another body. If you use the camera enough, in time the top plate enamel will probably wear-in to match the rest of the body. There's no telling how many Leicas out there had their top plates replaced at an official Leica service centre. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leitz_not_leica Posted July 13, 2007 Share #9 Posted July 13, 2007 If it were me, I would have kept the original finish. Like vintage cars, it is best to see what it had been through. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gvaliquette Posted July 17, 2007 Share #10 Posted July 17, 2007 Luigi, sorry, but I disagree. echorec, if you use the Leicameter with the M4, then leave the Leicameter on the M4. That is how it is meant to be! (I know, I have an M4-2 with the same Leicameter) Guy Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_livsey Posted August 11, 2007 Share #11 Posted August 11, 2007 Ivar Looks great. take look at this one, so very close in numbering to yours. http://www.mwclassic.com/acatalog/CE278L.jpg £2295 the price (inc VAT) ChrisL Note this link will expire when sold I suspect. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted August 11, 2007 Share #12 Posted August 11, 2007 Stephens in Manchester have a beautiful condition black M4 with meter, for less than half that amount, IIRC. Handled it yesterday. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_livsey Posted August 11, 2007 Share #13 Posted August 11, 2007 Stephens in Manchester have a beautiful condition black M4 with meter, for less than half that amount, IIRC. Handled it yesterday. Black paint ? Did you look at the 75mm 1.4 they just got in ? I have an eye to that or a 90mm ASPH reduced at Wey ? ChrisL Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annie135 Posted August 12, 2007 Share #14 Posted August 12, 2007 Sorry I think the re-painted one looks like a toy to be put in a display case. The 'brassed' example looks like a tool to be used for the purpose it was intended , it's got history, it's got a story to tell.. Would anyone here get a genuine piece of Chippendale and send it to IKEA for refinishing/ restoration ? In fact I was going to send a nice 111g off to be painted black, this has changed my mind. Re originality. Some years ago a rather famous Bentley was bouht for a staggering sum of £10,000,000! the purchaser refused to complete on the rounds that it wasn't original. Hubbard, the vendor took them to court in 1990. The judge agreed that the only thing on the car was the chassis plate. However in his findings for the plaintiff he declared that" It was perfectly acceptable that over the course of time every part of the car might be exchanged replaced etc. but doing this in no way changed the identity of it and in fact it was " Old No1" the most famous Bentley of them all. So I wouldn't worry about a coat of paint.........just get the 'Brasso' out. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted August 12, 2007 Share #15 Posted August 12, 2007 Black paint ? Did you look at the 75mm 1.4 they just got in ? I have an eye to that or a 90mm ASPH reduced at Wey ? ChrisL It's definitely black... I don't look at M lenses I'm afraid. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlancasterd Posted August 12, 2007 Share #16 Posted August 12, 2007 It's definitely black... I don't look at M lenses I'm afraid. Where are Stephens located these days? I looked for them in the arcade off St Annes Sq a year or so ago and 'met their absence' (to use a nice West African phrase!). I'd assumed that they had closed down, as seems to happen to all too often to small shops such as theirs... (Does anyone now remember Mathers - who also had a shop in the same arcade for many years?) Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cocker Posted August 12, 2007 Share #17 Posted August 12, 2007 Where are Stephens located these days? I looked for them in the arcade off St Annes Sq a year or so ago and 'met their absence' (to use a nice West African phrase!). I'd assumed that they had closed down, as seems to happen to all too often to small shops such as theirs... (Does anyone now remember Mathers - who also had a shop in the same arcade for many years?) John, Stephen are now in Barton Arcade (our moderators empire extends wide!) which is off St Anne's Square between the Square and Deansgate - they are on the first floor round the Gallery. well worth a visit though I do think their prices are on the steep side. Mather's I don't remember in St.Anne's Square but if they are the same business - "Mather's of Lancashire" who were early in the mail order business - they are still going strong in Bolton. I buy quite a lot of my film from them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_livsey Posted August 12, 2007 Share #18 Posted August 12, 2007 Where are Stephens located these days? I looked for them in the arcade off St Annes Sq a year or so ago and 'met their absence' http://stephensphotocentre.co.uk/ Sorry just off to bed this has directions very easy to find. ChrisL Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_livsey Posted August 13, 2007 Share #19 Posted August 13, 2007 (Does anyone now remember Mathers - who also had a shop in the same arcade for many years?) No recollection of Mathers but I do have a receipt fo an ALPA Model 7 plus 1.8 Switar for £59.50 from Dollonds of Deansgate in 1971. Still have the camera, great lens. Won a couple of competitions with it. Worth more than that now Stephens have a Leica dealership now and is not I think the eclectic mix it was but for Leica still a temple to worship at. ChrisL Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlancasterd Posted August 13, 2007 Share #20 Posted August 13, 2007 No recollection of Mathers but I do have a receipt fo an ALPA Model 7 plus 1.8 Switar for £59.50 from Dollonds of Deansgate in 1971. Still have the camera, great lens. Won a couple of competitions with it. Worth more than that now Stephens have a Leica dealership now and is not I think the eclectic mix it was but for Leica still a temple to worship at. ChrisL Ah yes! Dollonds of Deansgate was where I bought my first Leica - M2 No.1013064 - in December 1961 having drooled over the displays in their window for months beforehand... I've regretted disposing of that camera many times since I traded it on a Pentax system in the late 60s, but I couldn't afford Leica prices for additional M lenses and wanted something longer than 135mm in any case... Thanks for the directions to Stephens - I hadn't thought that they might have risen in the world! :) Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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