Meredith Posted April 3, 2011 Share #1 Posted April 3, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Here’s a question for Leica historians. I’m trying to identify some A36 and E29 filters I inherited and have been stumped by an A36 yellow No. 2 filter. It’s different from the other A36 filters in that it is a slip-on, but has no clamp. It is marked “Ernst Leitz Wetzlar” “Germany” “2”. And it separates into three parts -- a screw-in ring, the filter, and the marked base that slips on to my Elmar f/3.5 50mm or Summar f/2 50mm lens. I have a Leitz box clearly marked FIGAM. I’ve Googled “Leitz FIGAM” and have found varied filters claiming to be FIGAM. Some have clamps, some don’t. One that doesn’t has a slightly different marking -- ”E. Leitz”, instead of Ernst. One is described as No. 2, but is clearly marked with a “1”. None say they separate into three parts. And several are described as a “Type B” filter, but I cannot find any definition of what that means. I know there may be slight variations in early Leitz items. Is that the situation here? Can anyone help me identify this filter? http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v141/chandolin77/LLFIGAM005.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v141/chandolin77/LLFIGAM006.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v141/chandolin77/LLFIGAM001.jpg Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted April 3, 2011 Posted April 3, 2011 Hi Meredith, Take a look here Is this yellow No. 2 filter an authentic FIGAM?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
luigi bertolotti Posted April 3, 2011 Share #2 Posted April 3, 2011 The first A36 filters were of the kind you post, to say, without the clamping screw, which was added sometime after (I'm not sure, but would say around 1930) ; FIGAM was the code of a yellow filter with density "2" (medium); so, I'd say that it can definitely identified as a FIGAM, and a "very old" one. No surprising it can be dismounted... they were surely assembled manually, maybe with the aid of some simple tool. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meredith Posted April 3, 2011 Author Share #3 Posted April 3, 2011 Grazie, Luigi -- and do you know what a Type B filter is? I thought perhaps it was one that separated, like my FIGAM. Was there ever a Type A? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted April 3, 2011 Share #4 Posted April 3, 2011 (edited) Type B stands for exactly the kind of filter your FIGAM is, a 36mm filter of the pressure type : the type A was an even older design for the Elmar, always fitted by pressure, but with the glass element much smaller : 23 mm, sufficient for the front element of the Elmar, but not for the front element of some of the lenses made when the Leica with interchangable lenses was announced (Elmar 9 and 13,5) : they standardized the mount diameter to 36mm and the well known breed of "clamp screw" filters entered. There is a bit of confusion for the fact that this kind of filters were later identified as "A36" filters (whilst the "Exx" filters were the screw-on ones), which is unrelated to the "A" type, which was abandoned about 1930.... there was also the "C" type (Hektor 7,3), the "D" (Thambar 9 and Telyt 20) and so on up to "P" (which is the "E43" for Summilux). The story of the filters is complex... Laney writes of a total of 265 filters with 24 different mounts...... and with several small variants within the same (see the example of the engraving you quoted). Edited April 3, 2011 by luigi bertolotti Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted April 3, 2011 Share #5 Posted April 3, 2011 Just for illustrating some variations a screw in type G 1931 FIXTA and a slip on type B 1931 FIHEL Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/148083-is-this-yellow-no-2-filter-an-authentic-figam/?do=findComment&comment=1634773'>More sharing options...
Meredith Posted April 3, 2011 Author Share #6 Posted April 3, 2011 Again, thanks to both Luigi and jc! I appreciate your help in solving the mystery. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted April 4, 2011 Share #7 Posted April 4, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Just for illustrating some variations a screw in type G 1931 FIXTA and a slip on type B 1931 FIHEL Isn't the FIHEL a type A, JC ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted April 4, 2011 Share #8 Posted April 4, 2011 Isn't the FIHEL a type A, JC ? Here you have a large part of them : Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/148083-is-this-yellow-no-2-filter-an-authentic-figam/?do=findComment&comment=1635074'>More sharing options...
Meredith Posted April 4, 2011 Author Share #9 Posted April 4, 2011 That's a great chart, JC, much more complete than the best one I have -- in the Leica Catalog No. 36, c. 1962. It doesn't show the Yellow No. 2 filters at all. Am I right that both the filter I originally described and my black Yellow No. 2 filter with a chromium clamping screw are both FIGAMs? And is chromium the correct description of the clamping screws and the non-black filters? The only thing I find confusing on the chart is that there seem to be two "Date of first introductions" -- the Type B, for example, was introduced in 1931, but the FIGAM, a Type B, was introduced in 1925. Am I reading it wrong? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted April 5, 2011 Share #10 Posted April 5, 2011 Here you have a large part of them : Nice chart indeed, but... sorry to insist, JC (you know, I trust you as a very reliable source... )... are you 100% sure that the FIHEL box you depicted matches the filter in front ? I mean... FIHEL is a "0" grade - very light yellow, see the FIXTA - and that filter looks of a rather "strong yellow"... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted April 5, 2011 Share #11 Posted April 5, 2011 Nice chart indeed, but... sorry to insist, JC (you know, I trust you as a very reliable source... )... are you 100% sure that the FIHEL box you depicted matches the filter in front ? I mean... FIHEL is a "0" grade - very light yellow, see the FIXTA - and that filter looks of a rather "strong yellow"... Luigi you are right, thank you : the filters and boxes were mixed, the filter is a 2 = FILGE. Have to make them turn in their right places. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted April 5, 2011 Share #12 Posted April 5, 2011 (edited) Luigi you are right, thank you : the filters and boxes were mixed, the filter is a 2 = FILGE. Have to make them turn in their right places. So well... and FILGE is a type "A"... indeed my previous question (# 7) ought to have been posed as "isn't the yellow filter on the right a type A ? " . A bit of pedantry isn't out of place, sometimes... ... just to make things well clear to the gentle Mrs. Meredith (with whom I sympathize, being she a "Retired Computer Professional", a cathegory I will join within some years... ) Edited April 5, 2011 by luigi bertolotti Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meredith Posted April 5, 2011 Author Share #13 Posted April 5, 2011 Hey, guys, I'm enjoying your little back-and-forth -- but no one has answered the questions in my last posting! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted April 5, 2011 Share #14 Posted April 5, 2011 Hey, guys, I'm enjoying your little back-and-forth -- but no one has answered the questions in my last posting! I use to post picts and let Luigi chatting ..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted April 5, 2011 Share #15 Posted April 5, 2011 (edited) Hey, guys, I'm enjoying your little back-and-forth -- but no one has answered the questions in my last posting! Ok, so it's my turn to chat... given that "Godfather JC" declares this is my role... 1) Your filters are both named FIGAM, if both are 36mm in diameter (and the one you posted is surely so, and, almost surely, also the clamp screw version you quote) : it's normal, in Leitz history, that a certain code corresponds to different versions of a certain item... good example is the Elmar 90 ELANG with underwent many changes during its long life. 2) "Chromium" is correct ? Uh... subtle question... ... indeed, I'm not so sure that the ring of the "non-black" A36 filters is really chromed, in strict metallurgy terms.. 3) Dates : interpretation of a matrix legenda... my understanding is that the dates in the top row represent the year in which Leitz introduced a certain filter (the Yellow 2, in 1925), which was made in different mounts for various lenses sarting from a certain year (left column - the Yellow 2 named FIGAM in 1931) : do you find it reasonable ? Of course, it must be interpreted logically... ... the yellow 0 was, as a "color", introduced in 1933... the "A" type in 1925... so the yellow 0 in "A" mount (FIUNS) was introduced not before 1933... Edited April 5, 2011 by luigi bertolotti Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meredith Posted April 5, 2011 Author Share #16 Posted April 5, 2011 Grazie tante, Luigi, for the good iformation. And your interpretation of the dates on the chart sounds very reasonable. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted April 5, 2011 Share #17 Posted April 5, 2011 2) "Chromium" is correct ? Uh... subtle question... ... indeed, I'm not so sure that the ring of the "non-black" A36 filters is really chromed, in strict metallurgy terms.. The term to use is "chrome plated". Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/148083-is-this-yellow-no-2-filter-an-authentic-figam/?do=findComment&comment=1636966'>More sharing options...
Meredith Posted April 6, 2011 Author Share #18 Posted April 6, 2011 Thanks, JC. I always like to have the correct words to describe things. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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