Help w M7 ISO please

[drtrm]

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After two trips to Kinderman (Leica Service in Canada) my six month old M7 purchased new from Tamarkin in New York refuses to correctly set the Dx code again. I was advised to set the ISO manually, but the viewfinder does not consistently display the correct ISO of the film in the camera.

 

I have another M7 body in Solms waiting for Leica to find a solution to the Dx problem.

 

Why does Leica continue to manufacture a camera with a design defect? And, come to think of it, why does Nikon continue to make the D200 with banding problems and why does Canon keep making the 5D with dust problems?

 

Something is rotten in the state of high end amateur photography!

[Findus]

When I first bought my M7 it had the same problem, sent it back to leica, it was fixed ... only for 2 weeks then it happened again. Eventually got the body replaced, with this body the meter failed and the iso was stuck at 400....

 

I managed to exchange the M7 for an MP and have vowed never ever to buy anything electronical again form leica, they do have a pretty bad reputation with electronics ....

 

My R8 was a fiasco too, upon reading the different fori everything elcronic ever made by Leica has never performed optimally .....

 

I wonder how the M-digital will perform, which will fully rely on electronics.

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[doubice]

I've had the same problem on my M7, had to send it to New Jersey twice. Seems to be fine now, but I use the manual setting and don't bother with it anymore.

 

Michaela, the M6 was also full of electronics, especially the TTL version and it never gave any problems. There simply is a problem with this particular part on the M7 and Leica is trying to fix it. There was a talk of an optical reader to replace the electrical contacts, but I don't know how far Leica got with its implementation.

 

Jan

[drtrm]

Hi Jan and Michaela,

 

Thanks for your responses. When I set the ISO manually on my M7, it alerts exposure compensation (lower red dot blinks) because the Dx does not pick up the same ISO. As long as the camera's electronic brain uses the manual ISO setting, the exposures should be fine, but I wonder why I should tolerate this on a Leica body.

 

I also have a Leica Dlux-2 which is plagued by noise at anything above ISO 80. My experience with Leica electronics makes me very reluctant to plan for a digital M despite a case full of superior Leica Lenses. Perhaps I should get a Zeiss M body while I wait for Leica to get its act together.

 

Leica should face up to the problem and install manual ISO coding in the M7, rather than continue to produce defective cameras and aggravate its loyal customers.

 

Tom

[wbesz]

I would prefer manual ISO setting too!

 

Just having the light meter and the AE option is all we really need for this camera.

(also, without the ISO spring-fingers, the film cannister would be easier to remove)

[Guest hagen]

I have one early M7 and had never problems with the DX iso setting. When my M7 was updated with the MP viewfinder I asked the customer service to modified my camera with the new infrared DX reader. It works perfect!!! Another advantage is that the film can be removed more easily.

The disadvantage is that one can't use an infrared film anymore (I never used on in the last 30 years :-))

 

If you have problems with your conventional DX reading ask your CS for the infrared reader.

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[wbesz]

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Wolfgang, thanks, your information is good timing for me! I have just sent my old M7 for the new VF, now I shall ring and ask for the optical sensor too!

[hm1912]

Fortunately I've never had any serious electronic troubles with my R9 or my previous R4. The few times something has gone amiss, I think it's been my fault and turning the camera off and on again sorts it out. I do sometimes wish, however, that the R9 had a mechanical option... just in case....

[drtrm]

Thanks to Wolfgang for the post regarding the optical ISO reader. I was given to understand from a representative at Solms, that Leica are still testing a solution to the Dx coding problem.I have a second M7 with the same Dx problem and in desperation, I've started taping over the codes on film cartridges with Scotch-Tape and setting the ISO manually. This shows a correct ISO display when the camera is turned on (with the shutter wound) and the lower red dot blinks in the shutter speed as advertised. While I am relieved that this works, it seems a rather primitive fix for a US$2000+ camera.

Tom

[wbesz]

I rang Customer Service yesterday and confirm that Leica will not carry out the modification to optical at this time until more testing, although they have completed a batch of M7s earlier.

 

Cheers, William

[ptomsu]

typical failure of M7 unfortunately

[drtrm]

OK, and now what?

 

Has anyone with the Dx coding problem had the defective reader disabled? I as one, would not mind at all setting the ISO manually as I did on the M6. It would seem to be a straightforward solution to an aggravating problem, certainly better than applying Scotch Tape over film cartridges to make a 2000+ dollar camera work properly.

 

In any event, as M7 owners, I believe that we should not let this issue die and that we should make prospective buyers aware of the problem.

 

Tom

[wbesz]

Perhaps the best thing to do Tom, is to ring and speak with Customer Service and see if you can fully understand the issues you are facing.

At least this will help you decide the next step.

[wizard]

Tom (and others having DX-coding problems),

 

I have these problems on my M7 as well. As an enginneer, after talking to the guys at Leica extensively, I now fully understand the problem and have to accept that it is difficult to come up with a proper solution. Fact is that the M body is still the same it ever was, in other words a one piece construction without a swing-open back. And THAT is the real probem. A DX-code reader needs contacts that reliably engage the film cartridge. With other cameras, that's no problem, as the contacts will be tightly pressed onto the cartridge once you close the swing-open back. Not so with the M body, here you insert the cartridge into the chamber of the body, and you also have to be able to remove the cartridge after exposing the film! So while a fairly high contact pressure would be desirable to make reliable contact, that would prevent easy removal of the exposed cartridge. Leica has desperately been trying to find the right compromise, experimenting with numerous kinds of contact materials, form of contacts etc., but in the end it is the old M body that prevails, it just does not lend itself to DX-reading. Another problem is that all cartridges are not equal , that is they differ slightly in size, and while the present solution may work well with one cartridge, it may still give problems with another one.

 

Setting ISO manually really is the only viable solution at the moment (BTW, no need to tape the DX-coding on the cartridge, if you set ISO manually, the camera will ignore the DX-code anyway [but will still flash the red dot in case of "bad" contacting]).

 

Also, I have found that whenver the red dot flashes (indicating malcontacting) it helps to tighten the film using the rewind crank. Apparently, that operation slightly moves the cartridge in the camera (thus engaging the contacts correctly), and voilá, no more flashing!

 

In retrospective, Leica should not have introduced the auto DX feature on the M7, it is unneccessary anyway in my view, but they probably tried to fulfill a 'market demand'.

 

Hope my explanation helps a bit, although it does not solve the problem.

 

Cheers,

 

Andy

[wbesz]

Andy, disregarding the current M7 mechanical contact system issue, the new optical device should work.

This new method should solve both issues simultaneously:

1) Electrical/mechanical contact problems,

2) Film canister mechanical removal problem.

[wizard]

William, oh yes, I do believe the new solution will work very well, I was just trying to offer some relief for those that still have to live with the old solution and encounter the "blinking" problem. In my view, if you know the reason for a particular problem (and if it turns out it isn't that much of a problem anyway), the world looks brighter...

 

Cheers,

 

Andy

[wbesz]

Of course, thank you Andy.

[Guest hagen]

Andy

 

The new optical solution works very well. I have enough experience with this optical reader as my camera was one of the first modified in Solms in November last year. Up to now I never faced any problem with this optical DX reader.

 

My result is that the M7 is a great camera and for me one of the best Ms ever build.

[fotografr]

You have all made me feel very lucky. I have never had the least kind of problem from my M7. I feel so confident about it I would, and have, take it on trips as my only camera body.

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[drtrm]

Excellent summary, Andreas. The simplest solution for Leica would be to say Sorry to its M7 owners and offer to disconnect the Dx coding altogether. I wouldn't miss it and there are several posts saying the same. I'll check w G. a very competent Leica repairman at Kindermann in Toronto, to see whether he can do this even if would invalidate the warranty.

Tom