thrid Posted September 9, 2009 Share #1 Posted September 9, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Just got back from the dealer. I got to fondle a production M9 and X1 mockup. I'm probably late to the party, but maybe this will be helpful to someone... M9. It's a digital M4. There were a lot of people there so hands on time was limited. It looks and feels like an M camera. If I read the brochure correctly it may be 5-10mm bigger than the M8.x in some direction, but you don't notice it. The proportions look right and the new notch balances the silhouette nicely. It is an extremely good looking camera. This was a black paint body. The paint is duller and looks really good. Imagine the look of the vintage black paint bodies (M3/M2/M4). Very, very nice. 'Vulcanite' looks and feels great. The camera feels very snappy in operation. Several M8 shooters said that it was faster than their camera. Pretty impressive considering how much data they are pushing around. Framing accuracy is very, very good. The frameline mask is set to 1 meter like the old pre-M6 bodies. I shot both a 35 and 50 with it and framing was exactly what you expected it to be from 1 meter to the other side of the shop (circa 15 meters). The shutter is very smooth, and very, very quiet. Like M7 quiet. There were several people banging away with M8 bodies and they were much louder and more intrusive. I'm not sure if they all had the upgraded shutter, but the M9 was VERY quiet in comparison. It's a nice smooth 'snick'. To quote uncle HCB, 'like a kiss'. Not the 'tock!' we know from the M8. The shutter sound does not travel very far. It's not officially weather sealed, but they swear up and down that it will survive a lot of abuse. No IR filters. 5500 EUROS in your hands. Delivery starts now. My personal opinion: It was a little strange to use a full frame digital M. The DOF is as you would expect it to be, as are the framelines etc. Your 50 is a 50 again. The framing is dead on, just like with the old bodies. You don't feel like you are settling for a compromise compared to the analog bodies. It puts a smile on your face (until you turn the tag with the price over...). It feels EXACTLY like a analog M-camera. The 'Gestalt' is exactly the same. In terms of industrial design that is a very difficult thing to do and Leica knocked it out of the park. No word on the IQ, but does anyone actually think this is going to be a step backwards? We'll have to see if it has any technical quirks, but I'm pretty certain that with the rough launch of the M8 still being a vivid memory around Solms, that Leica went over this thing countless times. They know they can't afford another PR disaster, especially with the S2 on the way. X1: They only had a mock up that could not be powered up. What it is: 1) A very expensive P&S with the biggest sensor on the market and excellent ergonomics. 2) A Leica 1c with an autofocus mode. Basically a Ricoh GR-D with a huge sensor and 35mm lens. What it isn't: 2) It's not a digital CL, due to the lack of an optical viewfinder / rangefinder. This is not a cheap Leica M. My personal opinion is that it is a Leica 1c with autofocus mode. It is a very small camera. I can't say for certain, but in my hands it looked and felt exactly like a screwmount body. Imagine a IIIc without the rangefinder. Basically a Leica Ic. Totally pocketable. The controls are well laid out. At first the aperture dial appears to be in the wrong place, but once you discover the dial on the top back of the camera it makes sense. It is meant to be operated with your thumb. Index finger for shutter speed and release. The shutter release is perfectly placed and feels like it will be very smooth and sharp. The camera feels very good in your hands. Again, pick up an LTM. Feels the same, but probably heavier. The mock up did not have a battery, nor am I sure if it had all the guts. It was very light. The dials are metal, but may be aluminum or something similar to save weight. Build quality of the mock up was excellent. If I heard the dealer correctly the camera comes with a brightline finder. Can someone confirm this or am I hearing things? If it's true, then thank you Leica for not screwing everyone out of another $200-300 to make the camera fully useable. Not weather sealed, but once again Leica claims that it will withstand a lot of abuse. The million dollar question is how much lag will the LCD display will have? The follow up is how fast is the AF? This will determine just how versatile the camera will be. Will it be a P&S with a huge sensor and great ergonomics or will it be fast enough to do timing critical photography via the LCD? Overall I thought it was a very interesting camera. If it has a good scale focusing setup and the framing accuracy of the brightline finder is good enough for street photography it will be a totally useable tool for that line of work. If you can make pictures with an LTM, you should be able to make pictures with the X1. If you are an LTM shooter this will feel very familiar. If you are looking for a loaded point and shoot this could be all the camera you will need for a while. If you have ever used a Ricoh GR-D, this is very similar, but with a much bigger sensor. Due to the lack of a combined optical viewfinder and rangefinder, this is not a low cost M. It's also not manual focus. If Leica added the RF unit from the CL and charged another $500 - 1000 more they could probably not make enough of these. Call it an X2 1550 EUROS, ships in December. Merry Christmas. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 9, 2009 Posted September 9, 2009 Hi thrid, Take a look here M9 and X1 hands one impressions.... I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
patrick parker Posted September 9, 2009 Share #2 Posted September 9, 2009 thank you very much for sharing. How is the rewind noise compared to m8.2? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lxlim Posted September 9, 2009 Share #3 Posted September 9, 2009 Thanks Thrid for taking the trouble. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rondeb Posted September 9, 2009 Share #4 Posted September 9, 2009 Thanks for the hands on. I took a look at an M9 at EP Levine in Boston today also. I did notice the shutter being quiet, BUT not as quiet as my M8.2. Very close though. I did not notice the rewind - I always shoot in discreet mode anyway. There seemed to be an odd little "catch" before the shutter tripped. Anyone else notice this? Just an extra little sound. The view is great. Awesome to see 35 as 35. 1600 looks comparable to M8.2 640. Not a ton better than M8.2 1250, but a little. Dynamic range seems much better. The files seem to hold up better to processing. Other than than - feel pretty much like my M8.2. BTW - I was not alone in noticing that my M8.2 was quieter. Several in the store commented the same... Maybe I have a particularly quiet sample. Best, Ron Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrid Posted September 9, 2009 Author Share #5 Posted September 9, 2009 thank you very much for sharing. How is the rewind noise compared to m8.2? It's quiet. There were about 30 grown men crammed in to the dealership squeaking with delight, like a bunch of bobby sockers at a Beatles concert, so there was a lot of background noise. When I was shooting it was noticeable quieter than an M8. A lot quieter. And not just that, the character of the sound is different. It's more of a swoosh that dissipates quickly and doesn't travel far, than the TOCK! we know from the M8. The M8 makes a much harder and penetrating sound. Although the M8 is not that loud in terms of decibels, it does travel. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
patrick parker Posted September 9, 2009 Share #6 Posted September 9, 2009 Thank you thrid. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrid Posted September 9, 2009 Author Share #7 Posted September 9, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) BTW - I was not alone in noticing that my M8.2 was quieter. Several in the store commented the same... Maybe I have a particularly quiet sample. Best, Ron There were maybe 4 - 5 guys there with M8 bodies, banging away like the paparazzi. Unfortunately I have no idea if they had the shutter upgrade and I didn't want too get close enough to any of them to see what camera they were shooting. Everyone had this crazed look in their eyes... We'll know more in a few days, but off the bat it's quieter than at least SOME M8 cameras. ;-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrid Posted September 9, 2009 Author Share #8 Posted September 9, 2009 I just read the X1 preview on dpreview. It does not list the 36mm brightline finder as part of the kit. Looks like we will be paying for that extra. $300? Thanks Leica! I love you, too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted September 9, 2009 Share #9 Posted September 9, 2009 It's quiet. There were about 30 grown men crammed in to the dealership squeaking with delight, like a bunch of bobby sockers at a Beatles concert, so there was a lot of background noise. When I was shooting it was noticeable quieter than an M8. A lot quieter. And not just that, the character of the sound is different. It's more of a swoosh that dissipates quickly and doesn't travel far, than the TOCK! we know from the M8. The M8 makes a much harder and penetrating sound. Although the M8 is not that loud in terms of decibels, it does travel. I can confirm that it is a lot quieter than the M8 of a gentleman who clearly hadn't upgraded, and I think it is about the same as my M8u. I asked to use an M6 next to the M9, to compare the sounds, and they were shockingly close to being equally loud, with the M9 just having that extra little winding sound at the end. My impression of the X1 is mixed. The smaller dial looks really empty, and I wonder if it would make sense to move the numbers closer to each other, to reduce the angular movement necessary for changing the aperture one stop. The aperture dial was also pretty raspy in feel, but I guess this will be cleared up for production. The camera was really light, but it had no battery, so it might feel a little better when it is ready to shoot. The S2... well, there wasn't one there, sadly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrid Posted September 9, 2009 Author Share #10 Posted September 9, 2009 I probably saw you (carsten). I was the guy in the jeans and blue shirt with the beat up M6 and greenish waist pack slung over my shoulder... ;-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted September 9, 2009 Share #11 Posted September 9, 2009 A-ha, you were also in Berlin! I was the guy with black glasses, goatee and black long-sleeved T-shirt with the undefinable accent Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viktor Posted September 9, 2009 Share #12 Posted September 9, 2009 A-ha, you were also in Berlin! I was the guy with black glasses, goatee and black long-sleeved T-shirt with the undefinable accent I was the youngish dude in front, with the grey shirt. I'm a lurker by the way, don't post much. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted September 9, 2009 Share #13 Posted September 9, 2009 Wow, we should have a Digital Leica M meet sometime! Maybe just after we all rob banks and buy our M9 Holger F. was also supposed to be there, but didn't show up. Probably work got too busy or something like that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viktor Posted September 9, 2009 Share #14 Posted September 9, 2009 Wow, we should have a Digital Leica M meet sometime! Maybe just after we all rob banks and buy our M9 Holger F. was also supposed to be there, but didn't show up. Probably work got too busy or something like that. Could you shoot me a message should there be a meeting? I rarely check here. It doesn't require an M9 either, I'd say not even a Leica or a camera at all. You'd obviously have to comply to some extent, say, love Bresson and deeply admire Robert Frank but except for that I'm pretty much open to anything. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted September 9, 2009 Share #15 Posted September 9, 2009 Yeah, err... why do I feel like I just got implicitly put in charge of organizing it I will see what I can do. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrid Posted September 9, 2009 Author Share #16 Posted September 9, 2009 Wow, we should have a Digital Leica M meet sometime! Maybe just after we all rob banks and buy our M9 Holger F. was also supposed to be there, but didn't show up. Probably work got too busy or something like that. Holger was probably too busy robbing a bank. Check the dealership or news tomorrow. ;-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrid Posted September 9, 2009 Author Share #17 Posted September 9, 2009 I'm up for a 'Hello' oder 'Hallo' irgendwann einmal... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter_n Posted September 9, 2009 Share #18 Posted September 9, 2009 Thanks for the hands on. I took a look at an M9 at EP Levine in Boston today also.I also dropped into EP Levine's on the way home from work and fondled one. There was a 35 on it and the frameline was roughly where it is on my 0.85x MP, maybe just a smidgin smaller. As a photog there said to me, "very seductive, eh?" and indeed it is. I will wait and see but it is very understated and if it works as advertised and is reliable then I think Leica has a big hit on their hands. At least I hope they do. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viktor Posted September 11, 2009 Share #19 Posted September 11, 2009 Falls das einer von euch ist. Gruß Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/95975-m9-and-x1-hands-one-impressions/?do=findComment&comment=1030396'>More sharing options...
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