marknorton Posted October 9, 2006 Share #21 Posted October 9, 2006 Advertisement (gone after registration) I'm especially looking forward to using the 24mm with the M8, so your priorities are exactly right. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 9, 2006 Posted October 9, 2006 Hi marknorton, Take a look here E Puts 28/2.8 M ASPH review. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
wbesz Posted October 9, 2006 Share #22 Posted October 9, 2006 I noticed a number of images taken with the Zeiss 25 around the corner from the Zeiss stand at Photokina, they were very nice (and sharp). Regarding the new Leica 28-M Elmarit asph, I have taken a lot of images with this lens on film, ..slides, negatives and B&W. I will have a close inspection in due course, ..after processing the film, but I like this small compact gem of a lens. My 28/2.8 asph has been checked for alignment and centering etc at Customer Service in Solms as an extra service, before departing back to Australia. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted October 9, 2006 Share #23 Posted October 9, 2006 absolutely excellent! any idea/aspiration for when these reviews may be ready? Not exactly, I'll just keep working at them once each set of lenses arrives. If the lenses arrive on schedule, I'm hoping to publish in the order shown on that list. Naturally, of course, real world testing of lenses takes some time, different conditions, etc. Cheers, Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted October 9, 2006 Share #24 Posted October 9, 2006 I'm especially looking forward to using the 24mm with the M8, so your priorities are exactly right. Hi Mark, I think that those of us who have been using digital rangefinders for awhile now (the Epsons) can really appreciate what it is to be able to see a 32 mm EFOV in the finder with parallax-corrected frame lines. The R-D1 gave us 42 at the widest and a 28 on the M8 gives us about a 37 mm EFOV which is wider than 42, of course, but not a lot wider. 32, however, is much wider and one notices that immediately using both cameras side by side. So, again, I think that a 24 is an important lens on the M8 and one that will see a lot of use. Cheers, Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gravastar Posted October 9, 2006 Share #25 Posted October 9, 2006 Have you got a link Bob? SH Photo Leica M8 Digital System That appears to be stock for a bundled package of lens plus body. For bodies only they say "Today order for first Delivery! " .... interesting! For the body only (VAT included) it's £200 less than what I've been invoiced for in the UK. Bob. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
waterlenz Posted October 10, 2006 Share #26 Posted October 10, 2006 Hi Robert, I'm curious myself because I obviously haven't done careful side by side comparisons with the various lenses on a production M8 yet. I sent my test request list to Leica earlier today and here are the sets (organized by time priority): 1. 24/2.8 (compared with Zeiss 25) 2. 28/2.8, 28/2.0 (comp. with Zeiss 28/2.8, CV 28/1.9, CV 28/3.5) 3. 35/1.4 and 35/2.0 (comp. with Zeiss 35/2.0, CV 35/1.7, CV 35/2.5) 4. 16-18-21 Tri-Elmar and 21/2.8 (comp. with Zeiss 21, Zeiss 15, CV 15) 5. 75/1.4 and 75/2.0 (comp. CV 75/2.5) 6. 50/1.4, 50/2.0, 50/2.8 Elmar and Noctilux 50/1.0 (comp. with Zeiss 50/2.0, Zeiss 50/1.5, CV 50/1.5) 7. Tri-Elmar 28-35-50 Obviously, the usability of the Zeiss 25 would improve with a change in the lens so that it triggers the 24 mm frame lines. I'm going to test it on the hunch that somebody will get that figured out. Cheers, Sean Can the M lens mount on a ZM 25mm be exchanged with one made for a ZM 35mm lens (i.e., a replacement part, no need to sacrifice a lens for its mount)? Tom Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
waterlenz Posted October 10, 2006 Share #27 Posted October 10, 2006 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi Mark, I think that those of us who have been using digital rangefinders for awhile now (the Epsons) can really appreciate what it is to be able to see a 32 mm EFOV in the finder with parallax-corrected frame lines. The R-D1 gave us 42 at the widest and a 28 on the M8 gives us about a 37 mm EFOV which is wider than 42, of course, but not a lot wider. 32, however, is much wider and one notices that immediately using both cameras side by side. So, again, I think that a 24 is an important lens on the M8 and one that will see a lot of use. Cheers, Sean Now we just need a 24mm faster than f/2.8!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted October 10, 2006 Share #28 Posted October 10, 2006 For the body only (VAT included) it's £200 less than what I've been invoiced for in the UK. Bob, I assume you are paying £2990, by my calculations that German price translates to £2867. Leica UK tend to overcook their prices which is why I buy my lenses in Hong Kong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted October 10, 2006 Share #29 Posted October 10, 2006 Can the M lens mount on a ZM 25mm be exchanged with one made for a ZM 35mm lens (i.e., a replacement part, no need to sacrifice a lens for its mount)? Tom I don't know for sure but I would think this is possible. Cheers, Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted October 10, 2006 Share #30 Posted October 10, 2006 Now we just need a 24mm faster than f/2.8!!! I agree and my lens wish list for Leica began with a 24/2.0. It will be a challenge making a lens like that compact. Cheers, Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gogopix Posted October 10, 2006 Share #31 Posted October 10, 2006 Bottom line, sounds line the 2.0 may be more useful if you can stand the weight. But remember, the 2.0 will make your wallet lighter, so, overall it may be a wash! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted October 10, 2006 Author Share #32 Posted October 10, 2006 Can the M lens mount on a ZM 25mm be exchanged with one made for a ZM 35mm lens (i.e., a replacement part, no need to sacrifice a lens for its mount)? Tom-- Remember that the viewfinder frames are moved mechanically by a specific flange of the lens bayonet. A 35mm lens has the shortest flange and the camera defaults to the 35mm lens position. Therefore, you can simply trim the flange down (with a Dremel tool or such) till it no longer keys the 50mm. The 28mm lens has the longest flange, so if you were trying to convert another focal length to show the 28 frame, you would need to purchase the longer flange. It may be that each lens is designed with its own bayonet, so they may not be interchangeable. Therefore, it might be less expensive to machine the lens to show your preferred frames, and later if you change your mind, just have the standard bayonet replaced. --HC Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted October 10, 2006 Share #33 Posted October 10, 2006 Hi Howard, As I mentioned in another thread, I spoke with my contact at Zeiss today about the ZM 25. It looks like the bayonet from the 35 might mount right up. In any case, Zeiss is likely to solve this problem for us in the (hopefully) near future. Cheers, Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted October 11, 2006 Author Share #34 Posted October 11, 2006 As I mentioned in another thread, I spoke with my contact at Zeiss today about the ZM 25. It looks like the bayonet from the 35 might mount right up. In any case, Zeiss is likely to solve this problem for us in the (hopefully) near future. Agreed on all points, Sean. Rather have Zeiss update to conform to Leica's design rule than have someone start filing on a lens. I saw your other post as well and simply wanted to offer this solution for the DIY market. Who knows--maybe Leica should buy Dremel Moto-Tool and market a version under the "Zeiss lens adapter special" moniker. --HC Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
zapp Posted October 11, 2006 Share #35 Posted October 11, 2006 Notice this is a no distortion lens. I abhore distortion. But this is now easily fixed with Photoshop or PTLens or Undestort. Why give up other corrections for something the user can accomplish himself? There are two ways to minimze lens distortion. The first is to use a lens with very low distortion (Leica way), the second is the calculation of a distortion free image (Photoshop). In my opinion, the best way is to start with a raw image that is as good as possible - going the Leica way. The more image "errors" you want to correct with photoshop, the more artefacts you will generate. Also, if you use film and don't want to scan for a correction in Photoshop, your best bet is a distortion free lens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosuna Posted October 11, 2006 Share #36 Posted October 11, 2006 The MTF curves of the new Elmarit at 1:2.8 are very eloquent. Quite similar to the curves of the Summicron until 16mm from the center. Really impressive. Erwin Puts says the same: At 3 meters distance (100 times focal length) the lens has excellent overall contrast and the micro-contrast is of a high order, at least till an image height of 15mm, beyond which one sees a gradual softening of detail and at the extreme corners the finest detail is not captured, compared to what can be seen at smaller apertures. But if this level of detail is required, one will stop down a bit. Even more, compare it with the curves of the 35/2 ASPH, the 24/2.8 ASPH and 50/2 at 1:2.8. The new Elmarit seems to be better. I was surprised when I read this from Puts: Overall the fingerprint of this lens wide open and at smaller apertures leans a bit in the direction of the Zeiss philosophy of lenses: reduction of flare and distortion is of more importance than striving for the maximum contrast wide open. If you need that high contrast performance wide open, Leica offers the Summicron 2/28mm ASPH. If you read it more carefully, it is right, because Puts is comparing the lens with the 28/2 ASPH. But it is not all the truth, just because the new Elmarit is much better than other famous M lenses in terms of contrast of fine detail. Puts only compares lenses with the same FoV, but a more general comparison would have been good for a correct understanding of the relative qualities of this new lens. Consider that the new Elmarit has an equivalent FoV on the M8 than the 35mm lenses on film. The new Elmarit (I have not tested it yet) is a incredible achievement. It is the smallest lens in the M line, one of the cheaper lenses and one of the best performers. This can be deduced from the MTFs graphs. Erwin Puts' conclusions seems to be much colder, and I don't understand why. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
waterlenz Posted October 11, 2006 Share #37 Posted October 11, 2006 Agreed on all points, Sean. Rather have Zeiss update to conform to Leica's design rule than have someone start filing on a lens. I saw your other post as well and simply wanted to offer this solution for the DIY market. Who knows--maybe Leica should buy Dremel Moto-Tool and market a version under the "Zeiss lens adapter special" moniker. --HC ROTFL!!!!! Red-dot Dremel!!! However, they are probably not too keen on the ZM25 ;->. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted October 11, 2006 Share #38 Posted October 11, 2006 The new Elmarit (I have not tested it yet) is a incredible achievement. It is the smallest lens in the M line, one of the cheaper lenses and one of the best performers. This can be deduced from the MTFs graphs. Erwin Puts' conclusions seems to be much colder, and I don't understand why. Hi Ruben, Yes, and even without any graphs I can tell you that it's a great little lens on the M8. Cheers, Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted October 11, 2006 Share #39 Posted October 11, 2006 ROTFL!!!!! Red-dot Dremel!!!However, they are probably not too keen on the ZM25 ;->. Competition improves the breed. They understand that and, like any business, they want to be the better competitor. Cheers, Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted October 11, 2006 Author Share #40 Posted October 11, 2006 Red-dot Dremel!!!However, they are probably not too keen on the ZM25 ;->. Tom-- The ZM25 is getting a lot of good response; I've met a couple owners who are delirious over it. I would guess Zeiss's reappearance is one of the reasons for the design and price/performance of the new Leica 28/2.8. But speaking practically: If Leica were to market a Red-Dot Moto-Tool, and if while modifying your Zeiss 25mm your hand were to slip and gouge the rear element, Leica would simply say sadly, "Ah, but we're not responsible for accidental damage--and the Moto-Tool did function properly, as you see..." Sort of a direct frontal attack (or should that be a surprise rear attack? ) while the lens designers plan their next sortie! --HC Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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