audidudi Posted September 3, 2008 Share #1 Posted September 3, 2008 Advertisement (gone after registration) Last week, a co-worker sold me a Macbook Black for a very attractive price (long story short, her rock-star son gave it to her after upgrading to a Macbook Air, but she didn't want it and offered it to me). I've been a DOS and Windows user for 25+ years now and know next to nothing about Macs, so bear with me if my ignorance shows. Anyway, while experimenting last night, I downloaded some photos I shot with my LC1 yesterday and was surprised to see that the RAW photos were visible in the Preview window. The color balance is different than the .jpg versions the camera saved simultaneously and they are also less sharp, which suggests they are different than the .jpg version, which would be corrected for white balance and sharpened a bit. When I saved the originally 9.5MB RAW files, they were saved as 16-bit .tif files approx. 28MB in size, which is about right based upon my experience. So, am I to deduce from this that the Macbook's software has, in fact, decoded the RAW files from my LC1? I'm not sure this is a big deal either way (fwiw, the .jpg versions looked better!) but I am curious as to what's going on here... (Oh, and after 25+ years of working exclusively on DOS and Windows boxes, learning to use a Mac is like learning to write with my other hand. I've been told how easy and intuitive they are to use, but this apparently applies only to people who have no prior experience working with Windows, as I'm finding it to be a very confusing and sometimes frustrating experience...) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 3, 2008 Posted September 3, 2008 Hi audidudi, Take a look here My "new" Macbook decodes the RAW files from my LC1?!. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
AlanG Posted September 3, 2008 Share #2 Posted September 3, 2008 Raw functionality has moved from the application level to the system level in Macs. Windows has the same capability in Vista and XP SP3 via a system called WIC. Windows Imaging Component - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia I don't use a Mac but here is a discussion about this: http://discussions.apple.com/message.jspa?messageID=6204275 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted September 3, 2008 Share #3 Posted September 3, 2008 audu-- As Alan said, the Mac OS and now with WIC, Windows as well, incorporate raw decoding functionality. With the Mac, software updates may include new RAW formats. But the main RAW software manufacturers are avoiding tying themselves to these system-resident hooks, and develop their own RAW algorithms. Sorry you find the Mac difficult. I've worked with both Mac and Windows, though not for as long as you. Working with Windows always annoyed me, but since you're having the opposite experience, you might just decide to pass the MacBook along. Don't let it frustrate you. As to why your images are turning up in colors different from what you expect-- Remember, Adobe has never supplied "Adobe Gamma" for Mac because the OS has the same functionality built in (under Displays in System Preferences). Your Mac and PC may be differently set in that regard. And since some Mac software (I don't know about Preview) is color-profile aware, it may be that some of your files were stored as Adobe RGB (say), but that you're reading them back as sRGB (or the opposite). And of course, laptop screens are generally not up to the same quality standard as desktop screens. Anyway, I hope the computer works out for you Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
audidudi Posted September 3, 2008 Author Share #4 Posted September 3, 2008 As Alan said, the Mac OS and now with WIC, Windows as well, incorporate raw decoding functionality. Live and learn! I'm afraid I'm happily still using XP Pro and haven't paid attention to the latest developments in OS... Sorry you find the Mac difficult. I've worked with both Mac and Windows, though not for as long as you. Working with Windows always annoyed me, but since you're having the opposite experience, you might just decide to pass the MacBook along. Don't let it frustrate you.Remapping the mouse so both buttons work and "ctrl" replaces the "option" key has helped quite a bit, but I've learned so many Windows habits and shortcuts over the years that having to think about how to do things is a major PITA. On the positive side, I paid only $500 for the Macbook, so if I do decide to pass it on, I'm not likely to lose any money! As to why your images are turning up in colors different from what you expect--Actually, that isn't a problem, as I'm pretty well dialed-in on color management and am using an Apple Cinema Display via an adapter on my Windows PC. My comment was that the decoded RAW image didn't look as good as the .jpg version due to the difference in white balance (which the .jpg version that was created simultaneously took into account and the RAW version didn't). Unfortunately, although the Macbook is intended to become my portable "photo computer," I don't have Photoshop installed on it yet because mine is a Windows version and I haven't yet decided which emulator software I'm going to use to turn the Macbook into a dual-boot machine. I certainly don't intend to buy replace all of my Windows-based software in one fell swoop! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted September 3, 2008 Share #5 Posted September 3, 2008 Sorry about referring to color instead of WB. My error. You were clear. (And I probably came across as a Mac snob--you're obviously no newcomer in the field. ) As you said, you got a good deal on the MacBook. Hope it works out, but it may not with that much DOS and Windows time under your belt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemalk Posted September 3, 2008 Share #6 Posted September 3, 2008 I don't have Photoshop installed on it yet because mine is a Windows version and I haven't yet decided which emulator software I'm going to use to turn the Macbook into a dual-boot machine. I certainly don't intend to buy replace all of my Windows-based software in one fell swoop! You can get a "cross-license" from Adobe and get a Mac version for a nominal fee. And working in an emulator (other than BootCamp and natively booting into Windows) is still less than ideal, especially for intensive apps like Photoshop. I've been on a Mac now for about 7 years. And it was definitely difficult to get used to it after so many years of Windows. Pretty soon, you'll become ambidextrous. Give yourself the chance to ease into it. And the addition of a three-button mouse will make it much, much easier for you to adjust. The MacBook is a great little machine (i'm on a MacBook pro as we speak). As far as the RAW files, you'll slowly end up driving yourself crazy with JPEG+RAW versions of all yr shots. Lightroom helps me keep my sanity by pairing the files up. Good luck Audi, I'm sure you'll do great. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruhayat Posted September 3, 2008 Share #7 Posted September 3, 2008 Advertisement (gone after registration) You can use the Macbook as simply a dual-core Windows laptop if you install Windows XP on it and tell the machine to boot that every time, if I'm not mistaken. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bernd_muc Posted September 3, 2008 Share #8 Posted September 3, 2008 (Oh, and after 25+ years of working exclusively on DOS and Windows boxes, learning to use a Mac is like learning to write with my other hand. I've been told how easy and intuitive they are to use, but this apparently applies only to people who have no prior experience working with Windows, as I'm finding it to be a very confusing and sometimes frustrating experience...)In my experience, Windows users tend to think too complicated when starting to use a Mac as on Windows many simple things are that complicated (don't ask me for examples - I can't think of any right now ). I've worked in both worlds and prefer the Mac without question. Of course, the experiences get closer over the years, nevertheless, even having had some exposure to Vista, Mac OS X is plainly much easier and faster to use... just open yourself to it Bernd Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
audidudi Posted September 3, 2008 Author Share #9 Posted September 3, 2008 You can use the Macbook as simply a dual-core Windows laptop if you install Windows XP on it and tell the machine to boot that every time, if I'm not mistaken. True, except that as I understand it, to get Boot Camp to work, you must 1) have a later version of Mac's OS than I do (10.4.XX) and 2) you must install XP with Service Pack 2 from Microsoft CDs. Unfortunately, I don't have any friends with Macs who might let me "borrow" their CD with Mac's Leopard OS and my genuine XP Pro CD (as well as those CDs in the possession of any friends who would agree to let me "borrow" them) pre-dates SP2. The end result is that I would have to purchase copies of both OS to make what you propose work and cheapskate that I am, this isn't an option I'm willing to pursue. Instead, I'm looking into Parallels, VMware, etc. as alternatives ... I may give up a bit of performance by comparison, but I'll also save myself a couple of hundred bucks, so the trade-off seems worthwhile. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruhayat Posted September 4, 2008 Share #10 Posted September 4, 2008 Audidudi, this might work: Install Vista on a MacBook WITHOUT BootCamp - Derek Hatchard blogs on In this one, the guy's friend apparently sold him a Macbook with just Windows XP installed, which he did by simply booting from a Windows CD: MAC OSX 10.4 Reinstall [Archive] - Notebook Forums and Laptop Discussion This article seems to confirm that you can install WinXP by simply wiping the hard disk clean and then booting from the Windows CD: Running Windows on a Mac without Boot Camp | NetworkWorld.com Community And here's how you can have both installed without needing BootCamp: Installing OSX and Windows paralell on a Mac without using Boot Camp - InsanelyMac Forum Good luck! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
audidudi Posted September 4, 2008 Author Share #11 Posted September 4, 2008 Good luck! Thanks for the pointers! I don't have time to address this any further right now (deadline at work, unfortunately), but I will do so as soon as the logjam clears ... thanks again! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tobey bilek Posted September 5, 2008 Share #12 Posted September 5, 2008 David Pogue`s book Switching to the Mac. He goes thru all the ends and outs . This one should come with every new Mac Mac has some online forums. My brother tells me it used to be more simple, but it has gotten more complicated lately. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted September 5, 2008 Share #13 Posted September 5, 2008 ... My brother tells me it used to be more simple, but it has gotten more complicated lately. I'll agree there. Windows has done the same. But if you started with DOS and then advanced to each new flavor of Windows, the Mac will smell funny. When I first switched from "System 8" to "OS X," I could still discern the earlier parts underneath, but it was a big jump. Same with any system. Each new iteration of the Mac OS brings new features that I never knew I needed, and some of them I never learn. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruhayat Posted September 5, 2008 Share #14 Posted September 5, 2008 But if you started with DOS and then advanced to each new flavor of Windows, the Mac will smell funny. When I first switched from "System 8" to "OS X," I could still discern the earlier parts underneath, but it was a big jump. True. When I first switched to Mac 6 years ago it took me 6 months before I was finally comfortable with the system and could see why it was simpler than Windows. But since OS X I think they threw the old GUI rulebook out the window and consequently each new cat specie has subtle differences from the preceding one. It's getting complicated because they are trying to do too much with a single device. The best OS I have used is/was the BeOS, which is similar to the Amiga OS I started off with. True multitasking on a single floppy-- who woulda thunk? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted September 6, 2008 Share #15 Posted September 6, 2008 When I first switched from "System 8" to "OS X," I could still discern the earlier parts underneath, but it was a big jump. Big jump, granted, but that was 7 years ago, now. And, there was nothing carried over from OS8/9 into OSX, as OSX is Unix based and previous Mac OSs weren't. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
psamson Posted September 6, 2008 Share #16 Posted September 6, 2008 A few simple things to remember that are different on the Mac (in no particular order): For any open application, the set of menu items doesn't appear at the top of that window. Instead, look on the very top left of the entire Mac screen. Moreover, the set of menu items will always be relevant to the highlighted/active application. About, Updates, System Preferences, Restart or Shutdown, etc. Easy. Click on the Apple logo in the top left corner at any time. - Software Update is similar to Windows Update - System Preferences is like Control Panel Applications don't completely exit if you close the window. You need to explicitly quit them (I got used to doing the command-Q keystroke). You'll see what applications are active in the Dock since they'll have a little blue light under them (at least in OS 10.5). You can move and change applications on the Dock. Drag a new application to the Dock and put it in the desired order. Drag an existing item off the Dock and release it to remove. If the OS is 10.4 or higher, click on your middle mouse button or press F12. Up pops the Dashboard. Click the same mouse button again or press F12 to have it go away. You can get various "widgets" and display them on the Dashboard. Note that each widget takes a bit of memory, so don't go crazy if you don't have a lot of memory/RAM on the computer. I have things like weather, stocks, dictionary, calendar, Wikipedia quick reference, Seattle traffic, and a system-utilization tool that is somewhat like Task Manager. Lots of good, free software out there. My Moving to Mac blog wasn't overly active, but you may find some interesting links. Activity Monitor if you need something like Task Manager to monitor or kill an application. In Finder, look in Applications -> Utilities -> Activity Monitor I prefer the latest 3.01 Firefox browser to the default Safari browser. Get it from Firefox web browser | Faster, more secure, & customizable Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted September 6, 2008 Share #17 Posted September 6, 2008 Activity Monitor if you need something like Task Manager to monitor or kill an application. In Finder, look in Applications -> Utilities -> Activity Monitor alt-AppleKey-Esc gives you the ability to Force Quit applications. No need to go to Activity Monitor Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted September 6, 2008 Share #18 Posted September 6, 2008 Big jump, granted, but that was 7 years ago, now. And, there was nothing carried over from OS8/9 into OSX, as OSX is Unix based and previous Mac OSs weren't. Sorry, Andy, I wasn't clear. I realize there was no code carried over, but the same basic ideas were. Example: "KeyCaps" was replaced by "Keyboard Viewer," both contained in the OS. With Windows at the time, the equivalent software was available as a free additional download. My point was that to a user, although early Macs are still recognizable as Macs (where DOS bears little resemblance to Windows), there are still major jumps within the continuity. How long ago it was really isn't important: It still looked and felt like Mac but required user adjustment. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted September 6, 2008 Share #19 Posted September 6, 2008 alt-AppleKey-Esc gives you the ability to Force Quit applications. No need to go to Activity Monitor Now don't get a newcomer started on the wrong foot! It's not "AppleKey" but "Cmd" (for 'Command'). :) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
audidudi Posted September 6, 2008 Author Share #20 Posted September 6, 2008 Now don't get a newcomer started on the wrong foot! It's not "AppleKey" but "Cmd" (for 'Command'). :) LOL! As it happens, I have learned enough about Macs to know what he meant. That said, I think what I'm going to do is buy a larger 2.5" harddrive -- my MacBook came with only 80GB, which is a bit tight for my purposes -- and, at least initially, convert it to a pure Windows box as described in some of the links above. This way, I'll have the benefit of a newer, faster processor and a much better display as compared to my present notebook (although the MacBook is both larger and quite a bit heavier, which are big negatives in my book) and if I decide to explore the Mac side of the fence further down the road, I can simply reinstall the OEM 80GB drive and/or wipe the replacement drive and copy the OS over to it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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