john_f Posted September 15, 2006 Share #1 Posted September 15, 2006 Advertisement (gone after registration) A question to all: I have started looking at the various articles on the web about the M8 and noticed that SDHC is never mentioned. Does anyone know if the Leica M8 supports new SDHC cards ? Thanks John F. P.S. Also noticed that unlike the M7, the M8 does not support HSS mode Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 15, 2006 Posted September 15, 2006 Hi john_f, Take a look here Leica M8 & SDHC ??. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
marknorton Posted September 15, 2006 Share #2 Posted September 15, 2006 My understanding is that the M8 supports up to 4Gb SDHC cards, enough for about 400 raw images. Sounds good to me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhoutman Posted September 15, 2006 Share #3 Posted September 15, 2006 No SDHC support but to 4 GB only. The product info sheet says that at: http://www.leica-camera.us/photography/m_system/m8/ there soon will be a list of compatible cards. I suggest you stay with Sandisk Extreme III 4 gb as max. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
like_no_other Posted September 15, 2006 Share #4 Posted September 15, 2006 Why is the M8 limited to 4GB cards? Maybe next year there will be larger SD cards available. A 8 GB card should have a capacity of more than 999 jpg images. What will be displayed on the 3 digit image counter of the camera? 'ERR'? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhoutman Posted September 15, 2006 Share #5 Posted September 15, 2006 What will be displayed on the 3 digit image counter of the camera? 'ERR'? "VISIT SHOP AND BUY M9" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
like_no_other Posted September 15, 2006 Share #6 Posted September 15, 2006 "VISIT SHOP AND BUY M9" I understand! Leica's risk management will recommend customers not to use the larger 8 GB cards because the risk of loosing more than 999 images due to a card crash is not acceptable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemeng Posted September 15, 2006 Share #7 Posted September 15, 2006 Advertisement (gone after registration) There are a few people scratching their heads over this! The problem is that "standard" SD cards only go up to 2GB: What are SDHC Cards? Secure Digital card - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia The new SDHC standard starts at 4GB and theoretically goes up to 32GB. Therefore when Leica say they support cards up to and including 4GB - it implies they support the SDHC standard. Confused? Yes. Typo? Maybe... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_f Posted September 16, 2006 Author Share #8 Posted September 16, 2006 Andrew, I decided to call Leica USA this afternoon to "clarify" things. First, the Leica rep I spoke to did not sound like he had ever heard of SDHC (duh...). His quick and direct answer was "the biggest SD card that was available when we designed the M8 was 4GB and therefore that is the (max?) memory size that the M8 will support". When I mentioned to him that a new 8 GB card (albeit an SDHC card) was announced on Sept 1 (see http://www.dpreview.com/news/0609/06090101pretec8gbsdhc.asp), he was very surprised to say the least. I should add that the M8 can use FAT32 to store data, which allows in theory the use of SD cards bigger than 2 GB (such as those from Pretek). But SD and SDHC are not the same thing ... Back to square one. BTW, I also asked him about the promised v1.3 firmware update for the DMR. His answer was that he had never heard of such a firmware update nor was he told about a v1.3 update coming any time soon. Best bet would be to contact Leica Camera AG in Solm to get a clear answer. Let us hope that the M8 does indeed support the new SDHC standard. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gepetto Posted September 16, 2006 Share #9 Posted September 16, 2006 John the M8 must support the SDHC format including the new Pretec 8GB card. SD cards bigger than 2GB are SDHC cards. The M8 supports 4GB cards which must be by definition SDHC. The LX2/D-LUX3 FZ50/V-LUX L1/Digilux3 all support SDHC. The nice thing is the 150X 4GB SDHC cards are already selling for well under one hundred dollars US from online retailers. Some with rebates the final cost is as low as 60. It was not that long ago you could not touch a decent 60X 1GB SD card for below $150. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhoutman Posted September 16, 2006 Share #10 Posted September 16, 2006 John the M8 must support the SDHC format including the new Pretec 8GB card. SD cards bigger than 2GB are SDHC cards. The M8 supports 4GB cards which must be by definition SDHC. The LX2/D-LUX3 FZ50/V-LUX L1/Digilux3 all support SDHC. . in that case it ust be a typo in the brochure, although it really states that only cards till 4 GB max are supported Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoff Posted September 17, 2006 Share #11 Posted September 17, 2006 John the M8 must support the SDHC format including the new Pretec 8GB card. SD cards bigger than 2GB are SDHC cards. The M8 supports 4GB cards which must be by definition SDHC. The LX2/D-LUX3 FZ50/V-LUX L1/Digilux3 all support SDHC. The nice thing is the 150X 4GB SDHC cards are already selling for well under one hundred dollars US from online retailers. Some with rebates the final cost is as low as 60. It was not that long ago you could not touch a decent 60X 1GB SD card for below $150. 4GB SD memory cards are not the same as 4GB SDHC memory cards. There are a number of sources adding to the confusion over SDHC memory cards including whether non-SDHC cards can be used in SDHC host devices and subsequently what will work in the M8. As far as SD/SDHC memory cards are concerned, there are basically four variants to be aware of: • SD Specification Version 1.0 • SD Specification Version 1.1 • SD Specification Version 2.0 • Non-compliant SD memory cards SD Specification Version 1.0 provides for data transfer of 4bits at 25MHz. SD Specification Version 1.1 allows for data transfer of 8bits at 50MHz. SD Spec v.1.1 Secure Digital memory cards are usually denoted by speed ratings of 100X and above. SD Specification Version 2.0, aka SDHC, officially supports FAT32, which enables recognition of capacities beyond 2GB. To be more exact, FAT16 actually provides for 2.2GB. Of significant note is the fact that SDHC cards use sector addressing as opposed to the traditional byte addressing of previous SD cards. Additionally, speed ratings of SDHC memory cards are denoted by “Class” rather than an X factor. Host devices must be able to handle sector addressing in order to utilize SDHC memory cards. However, host devices that conform to the SD Spec v.2.0 can also accept SD Spec v.1.0 and 1.1 memory cards. The SD Card Association (SDA) is the governing body charged with setting industry-wide standards and ratifying specifications for Secure Digital products including cards and host devices. Unfortunately, there have been many occasions in which well known memory card manufacturers have ignored SDA guidelines and released products to market ahead of ratification. These cards have ended up not conforming to any ensuing standard. When introduced, the SanDisk Extreme III Secure Digital Card offered Spec v.1.0 4bit data transfer but at 50MHz. SD Spec v.1.1 speed. I do not know if the latest SanDisk Extreme III Secure Digital Cards are now fully SD Spec v.1.1 compliant or not. However, to date, I have not been aware of any rated usability issues. The real problem and current confusion is with the 4GB Secure Digital Cards that were release to market before the SD Spec v.2.0 was finalized. These cards are SDA non-compliant and do not offer sector addressing. They are not one-in-the-same as 4GB SDHC cards. I would not recommend and assume universal reliability of any cards which do not conform to SDA standards. More information can be found on the SD Card Association’s "About SDHC Memory Card" web page. With regards to the M8, I have repeatedly noticed general inaccuracies in posted PDF documents provided by Leica including brochures, technical data, and product information. For example, the original Leica C-Lux 1 Technical Data pdf listed RAW as a supported format. This was later corrected. Additionally, I have noted other varying versions of similar documents. Several technical data product information links provided by Stefan Daniel, Head of Product Management, Leica Camera, point to what look like preliminary documents which differ from those now available of the Leica website directly. Therefore, given case history, I do not take what is printed on Leica’s own materials as being 100% accurate or complete. However, it would be rather shortsighted if Leica supported non-compliant 4GB memory cards and not the SDHC standard itself. I do not believe this to be the case. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosuna Posted September 17, 2006 Share #12 Posted September 17, 2006 Dpreview.com has an extensive analysis of the camera. They say that SDHD cards are supported: http://www.dpreview.com/articles/leicam8/page2.asp Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemeng Posted September 17, 2006 Share #13 Posted September 17, 2006 Dpreview.com has an extensive analysis of the camera. They say that SDHD cards are supported: Leica M8 Hands-on Preview: 2. Specifications: Digital Photography Review It does?... Where? I couldn't see anything on that spec list which said anything about any card... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted September 17, 2006 Share #14 Posted September 17, 2006 Near the bottom of the page... "Storage • Secure Digital / Secure Digital HC • FAT / FAT32" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted September 17, 2006 Share #15 Posted September 17, 2006 My understanding is that the M8 supports up to 4Gb SDHC cards, enough for about 400 raw images. Sounds good to me. BTW, a 2 gig card in a DMR records 99 RAW images. Not sure where 400 per 4 gig card might come from on an M8... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemeng Posted September 18, 2006 Share #16 Posted September 18, 2006 Near the bottom of the page... "Storage • Secure Digital / Secure Digital HC • FAT / FAT32" Got it. Thanks. I notice they don't actually say in their review that they've tried it with SD-HC though, so the jury's still out... Mind you, not that I care :?) If the M8 truly supports SD-HC then good news. If not, then "plain SD" 2GB cards are relatively cheap and have room for more than enough images (@ 200x RAW). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FastFashnReloaded Posted September 18, 2006 Share #17 Posted September 18, 2006 Why is the M8 limited to 4GB cards? Maybe next year there will be larger SD cards available.A 8 GB card should have a capacity of more than 999 jpg images. What will be displayed on the 3 digit image counter of the camera? 'ERR'? Perhaps you should expect to use something a bit less expensive, if all you plan to do is shoot thousands of jpgs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosuna Posted September 18, 2006 Share #18 Posted September 18, 2006 If the M8 does not support SDHC cards, it is likely that the M8 will be silently updated soon (a M8 bis model). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitchell Posted September 18, 2006 Share #19 Posted September 18, 2006 Andy, The M8 files are half the size of DMR files despite the same megapixel count, some sort of raw lossless compression. I'm totally out of my depth here, but have it on good authority from another M8 thread. Sorry forgot which one. Best, Mitchell Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
like_no_other Posted September 18, 2006 Share #20 Posted September 18, 2006 If the M8 does not support SDHC cards, it is likely that the M8 will be silently updated soon (a M8 bis model). Ruben, how could Leica do that silent? There is still the problem with the the frame counter that displays only 3 digits according to the photos shown. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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