Shopping Red River Paper, after selecting my priter model, only few papers show up, what does it mean?

[Einst_Stein]

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Ths is my first time shopping Red River paper, I start with the sample paper kits. I select my Epson printer model, then see only a few papers show up. 

I will stick with their recommended papers for now, but I am curious what it means to the no-show papers? Anyone has expereiences with the not recommended papers for whatever your printer?

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[pgh]

edit - misunderstood your query. 

AFAIK sample kids don’t include everything though. 

Edited July 1 by pgh

[Jeff S]

One of many reasons I use ImagePrint (Black version), which includes superb printer-specific profiles for virtually all papers, regardless of brand.  They will even make a free custom profile in the unlikely event a paper profile is not already available.

[Robert Ardinger]

Look at this Red River page. Scroll down a bit and enter your printer.  If they have an ICC profile for the paper you might want to try for your printer, then that paper should be compatible.  I noticed that for my printer (Epson P900) that if I used their "Shop Your Way" by Printer, I get only a few of the known compatible papers.  

If you get to the page for a specific paper there is a section that says " + Compatibility" and will tell you specifically if it should work with your general model of printer (basically distinguishes between aqueous and solvent based inks).  Almost all of their higher end photo papers are compatible with the modern pigment based ink printers.

I use either their papers or Epson papers (with an Epson printer and inks) and have very satisfactory results.  I do use a color managed work flow and use ICC profiles.  

In the past, it was much more of a challenge to get every thing to sync (lots of unit to unit equipment variation) but now I find the manufacture's profiles to be very, very good.  I have spent a lot of time and effort developing good printing techniques and it is easier now.  

A calibrated monitor is essential,  From past work, I have a nice set of index prints and corresponding index files and can match the index prints by using the Epson Print Layout (EPL) program that Epson provides.  For Red River papers, EPL will essentially default to using an ICC profile but for Epson papers (which have additional information about them stored in the printer - which is also available for printers like mine from Red River for their papers) I can use EPL and just have "Printer Manage" the printing (something I would never have done in the past) and get very nice results.

Red River papers are very good and they package them very well for shipping (I cannot get paper from places like Amazon without it frequently being damaged in shipping from poor packaging).  When I can, I buy Epson papers at a camera store but it is a bit of an effort to get there so having them shipped is very helpful).

Edited July 2 by Robert Ardinger

[Einst_Stein]

Thanks for the in depth wisdom.

I am still in the early stage of beginner printer. My knowledge are all based on the two books. Both recommend disable the printer management. Are you suggesting to use printer management when using RRP or Epson?

Thanks in advance.

 

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[Robert Ardinger]

Jeff Schewe is a great resource.  If you are on the beginning end of learning to print I would just follow his advice.  

My comments about the Epson Print Layout software was more a comment on how some things have changed over the years and can add a bit of "automation" to the process within certain constraints and that the ICC profiles now provided by the paper manufacturer for modern printers are quite accurate. 

Having a good understanding of color management, ICC profiles, the various (and at times cryptic) choices in the Print Dialog boxes is the best way to be confident in your results from whatever work flow you ultimately decide on.  The best way to learn would be to follow one of the guidebooks you mention.  

Jeff Schewe's book is a several years old but will give a good understanding of what goes into a making a good print.

If you are printing from Photoshop, Lightroom or other similar programs I would not let the printer manage color as my starting point, I would let the program manage (i.e. "Photoshop Manages Color") and use an ICC profile (an exception might be if you are printing black and white images I would absolutely try out Epson's ABW printing mode (Advanced Black and White - selection buried in the Printer Dialog box) which is printer managed). 

Printing can be very easy if desired and just using the printer manufacturer's paper and ink and leaving everything on "auto" will actually give a pretty good result.

However, to have full control over the process and be able to use the wide variety of papers avalible and be able to fine tune your results and develop a consistent ability to "duplicate" what you see on your monitor to what you see on a print (given the differences in viewing a back lighted image (monitor) verses a reflective lighted image (print)) it would be best to be familiar with the methods outlined in your guidebooks. 

[Einst_Stein]

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Previously I used low cost papers from Inkpress. I don't think I set up the ICC correctly. I am still not sure. So I switch to the papers that the ICC is more explicit to use, and of course more expensive. I take the extra cost as the beginner's tuitions, not necessary better papers. 

I have still some way to go before doing my own optimization. I guess I need to upgrade the monitor after I feel more confortable about my work flow. 

 

[Jeff S]

I agree that Schewe is a good resource, including his counterpart book, The Digital Negative.  I mentioned ImagePrint, which is expensive, and not something that will help you learn the basics, since it simplifies everything behind the scenes. One just identifies printer and paper, and the software uses its own print driver rather than Epson’s to optimize all necessary settings.  I prefer it to all other approaches I’ve used, including ABW, etc.  It always operates in soft proof mode, so provides a consistent basis for judging (of course backlighting is different from print viewing).

You might consider it once you’re up the learning curve.  Or sooner, if you want to skip ahead and don’t mind the expense. IP also has its own set of editing tools, so individual interpretation and judgment is still key, but one can avoid a lot of confusing basic settings, like print management controls, paper types, or printer setting details like platen gap, etc.

Edited July 2 by Jeff S