Is The M10-D Peak Digital M?

[satijntje]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

vor 21 Minuten schrieb RexGig0:

I think of the M10-R, especially the Black Paint M10-R, and the M10 Monochrom as being “peak” digital M, but have not yet convinced myself to buy either of them.. 

 

 

IMO, a black paint M10-R and a M10 Monochrom is the best M combo.

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[Peter Zapp]

I liked the idea, but not the dependency on a slow and unreliable smartphone app for essential settings (selection of lens profiles for uncoded lenses).

[evikne]

7 minutes ago, Peter Zapp said:

I liked the idea, but not the dependency on a slow and unreliable smartphone app for essential settings (selection of lens profiles for uncoded lenses).

This isn't even possible via the app, and that's my biggest objection to the M10-D. I really hope this improves with the M11-D, and an accompanying update to the Fotos app. 

[pippy]

On 6/15/2024 at 6:46 AM, LeicaM60 said:

...can we now conclude that the M10-D will be remembered as Peak Digital M?...

No; "we" can't.

Even when looking at the answers posted in this thread(*) by only a small number of members there is a mixture of individuals who, in addition to the nomination of the M10-D, state a preference for the M9; the M10-R B/P; the M11 (in a "tech-wise" sense) and the M-D Typ-262. This indicates that there are at least five cameras which might deserve the accolade of "Peak Digital M".

We all have our own ideas about what a Digi-M requires for our own personal set of needs. For some this might be a 60Mp sensor. For others a Rolling Shutter. An EVF / Viso capability. Better high ISO performance. Auto-Bracketing. The list goes on and on and on...

Not that it counts for anything at all but when the M10-D was released I went in to Leica Mayfair to check it out. The more the salesperson enthused about the 'improved  features' found on the 10-D in comparison to the outgoing D-262 the more strongly did I dislike the newer camera for my particular set of preferences.

Other photographers certainly do have a differing view. Such is Life!

Philip.

*In, obviously, the M10 sub-forum which could be thought to, just possibly, skew the results ever-so-slightly......😸......

Edited June 19, 2024 by pippy

[Peter Zapp]

The M10 was good enough for me, with only a small patch of black tape to achieve perfection.

[LeicaM60]

With the caveat that we don’t know whether M12 will be a “return to form”, in my opinion:

M9 family cannot be peak digital for two main reasons - shutter sound and high ISO performance.

M240 family cannot be peak digital for two main reason - body thickness and high ISO performance 

M11 family shouldn’t even be called an M

M10 family is just right. Black paint vs black chrome is subject to debate, but lack of back screen and added benefit of integrated fold-out thumb rest make the M10-D just perfect!

Just to be clear, my favorite Digital M is still the M60 but I can’t call it peak digital M…

Edited June 19, 2024 by LeicaM60

[3D-Kraft.com]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

vor einer Stunde schrieb LeicaM60:

M9 family cannot be peak digital for two main reasons - shutter sound and high ISO performance.

Shutter sound was one of the reasons, why I returned to M9 😉

[evikne]

39 minutes ago, 3D-Kraft.com said:

Shutter sound was one of the reasons, why I returned to M9 😉

I actually miss the shutter sound of my M9 from time to time. 😄 And if I wanted to be discreet, I could wait a bit to release the shutter button and delay the recocking sound.

But I don't miss the ISO performance and the thickness.

[patrickcolpron]

3 hours ago, LeicaM60 said:

M11 family shouldn’t even be called an M

True

[pippy]

9 hours ago, pippy said:

...We all have our own ideas about what a Digi-M requires for our own personal set of needs...

 

5 hours ago, LeicaM60 said:

...in my opinion...

M9 family cannot be peak digital for two main reasons - shutter sound and high ISO performance.

M240 family cannot be peak digital for two main reason - body thickness and high ISO performance 

M11 family shouldn’t even be called an M

M10 family is just right. Black paint vs black chrome is subject to debate, but lack of back screen and added benefit of integrated fold-out thumb rest make the M10-D just perfect!

Just to be clear, my favorite Digital M is still the M60 but I can’t call it peak digital M…

"Quod Erat Demonstrandum".

Those aspects are important to YOU and they form what is, as you say, your opinion on the matter.

Taking your own stated preferences in order;

I don't give a hoot about 'Shutter-Sound' and I almost never need to go above base ISO.

The difference - for me - between the body thickness of my M2 (which I've used since 1980) and my M-D Typ-262 has never even remotely been an issue in exactly the same way that the 'bloated' form of the M2 wasn't an issue in comparison to the IIIa which I had been using before I bought my M2. The ISO aspect has already been addressed.

I don't have any wish to buy into the M11 series of cameras but I understand that to be only my preference; but my preference doesn't have any bearing whatsoever on which camera deserves the epithet of "Peak Digital M". Many users who appreciate 60Mp files, rolling shutters (and all the rest) would be of a different opinion.

I fully agree that the M10 camera (and most of its offspring) was, in many ways, truly a wonderful range of cameras but for me the M10-D is an abomination. YMMV...😸...

The M60 really would have been a fantastic camera if only had it been given strap lugs......

As I said earlier;

"We all have our own ideas about what a Digi-M requires for our own personal set of needs."

You have your ideas as to what makes the M10-D the "Peak Digital M". Please accept that other folks will have differing views.

Philip.

Edited June 19, 2024 by pippy

[costa43]

I really liked the MD typ 262. They should have kept that design but slimmed it down to m10 size imo. I preferred the iso at the back, which I think is now.returning in the m11 variant but I also liked the fact that there was no visoflex compatibility or fotos sync with phone. A totally raw experience giving you no temptation to see what you are getting. A ‘D’ camera for me should be as close to a film camera experience as possible.

Edited June 20, 2024 by costa43

[Smudgerer]

5 hours ago, costa43 said:

I really liked the MD typ 262. They should have kept that design but slimmed it down to m10 size imo. I preferred the iso at the back, which I think is now.returning in the m11 variant but I also liked the fact that there was no visoflex compatibility or fotos sync with phone. A totally raw experience giving you no temptation to see what you are getting. A ‘D’ camera for me should be as close to a film camera experience as possible.

Yes, as a recently "ex M10-D" owner I agree with much of what you say here about the MD 262. The ASA on the back made perfect sense regarding placement, the on/off switching there on the M10-D I always disliked, stupid, it should have been where every digital M had/has that switch around the shutter release.........I went with the M10-D because of the slimmer profile, the better VF eyepiece and function, the shutter and of course the wonderful faux winder lever / thumb rest, I loved that. A genius move by Leica.......The M10-D's reliance on Fotos was a PITA, but luckily after the initial set-up it could be, and was in my case, ignored completely. I agree with you too that it would have been good not to have the EVF/Visoflex options, ( 60+ plus years behind one camera type, stills and cinema, and I still dislike EVF's in any form ), but let's face it there's a majority of people out that that have to have an electronic screen or two, or more, with them at all times this life now..........It was, still is, my favourite digital M camera to date but unfortunately my copy went wobbly too many times and had to return home to Mother at Wetzlar way too often, the recent failing of the digits in the VF signed the end of it's life with me, so I sold / traded it back to Leica.

Regarding the much rumoured and probably piling up in a store-room at the Mother Ship M11-D waiting I guess for the bizarre M11 firmware issues to be settled, fingers crossed, I would have no interest in, if only because of it's fellow M11's problems with firmware over the past couple of years, maybe hardware too. Any LCD-less M11 is going to be even more reliant on it's firmware than it's predecessors I'd guess so Leica must be trying to ensure that all's well in the State of Denmark before letting the new M11-D out into the wild......Good luck with that. I wonder how many are made and in-waiting?

Digital Ludditism maybe, but for me the M10P / M10M / M10R and yes despite my history with my late M10D too, are the best digital Leica M's to date by a long chalk and if I had bought one of the troubled M11's that would have driven me nuts in short order and I'd have given up and traded it in for a M film camera instead PDQ......Oh wait, there is that Leica M2 Black Paint that I just swooped on, rather that 60-ish year old than any M11 for me, but I'm somewhat odd with camera gear anyway, regressive.