Kodak Double-X 5222 film?

[AndrewK]

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Hi all, i just picked up my first Lecia film camera (M-A) over the past weekend and just discovered Kodak double-x 5222 film by accident. On the product description, the guy who sells it say the recommended ISO is between 200 ~ 800.   In this case, how do i make the M-A to shoot this film at ISO speed of 400?

Has anyone else shoot with this film at all? I'd love to learn what you think. Thanks a lot

[Fotoklaus]

If you set the right aperture and speed due to your lightmeter readings, which is set to 400 ISO. Then you have to choose the right

developer and developing time to get a good result out of the film.

Your M-A is just a simple tool which does not care about film speed.

As it is a film produced for cinema, I would not expect too much.

Will not get better than a HP5, Tri-X or Tmax.

[Siriusone59]

If you don't have a light meter there are some iPhone apps that are free or very inexpensive...such as "mylightmeter" that will help you check the available light on the scene. 

[Fotoklaus]

I woild recommend to read about the basic knowledge of photography.

[sometimesmaybe]

4 hours ago, AndrewK said:

how do i make the M-A to shoot this film at ISO speed of 400?

per the comments of other LUF members, you'll need a lightmeter. you have 3 options:

1. phone / app based
2. small hot shoe reflect meter 
3. handheld incident meter 

i use an old sekonic incident meter. meter for the subject - add the ISO and shutter speed, and the meter tells me the aperture to use. this is a slower way of metering but more accurate. it's a matter for you which one to use, depends on what you shoot and your own preferences 

you might also be able to use a digital camera, but just be mindful digital sensors has limited highlight latitude while film has limited shadow latitude 

[Rollei35]

M-A doesn't have light meter, and it doesn't care what film you have. You set aperture, shutter speed according to the film ISO and lighting condition, and fire. That's all.

As simple as that.

Over or under exposure, it has nothing to do the camera, it's all on you.

 

[Mute-on]

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Apparently Double-X has a nominal iso of 250 in daylight (200 under tungsten). In any case if you shoot at 200 you should get decent results. If you want to try pushing +1 (400) or +2 (800), you will need to develop accordingly.

As others have said, cheapest light meter is a free app on your phone, however that will always be a reflected light meter. I prefer incident metering if possible. You will need a separate light meter with incident capability for that. A Sekonic L-308 is available new, for example.

Enjoy your new Leica!

Edited April 9, 2024 by Mute-on

[Tom R]

If you do not have or do not know how to use a light meter, you can, depending upon the film, find “suggested exposure settings” in the company’s literature for that film. For example, Kodak TriX is a 400 ASA film, and the company’s data sheet for TriX has exposure recommendations. Of course, these tables are most helpful if you know how to move between f-stops and shutter speeds. For example, in bright, hazy sun, with distinct shadows , Kodak (Alaris) says: 1/500 @ f/16. Meaning you dial in 1/500 seconds on the shutter and 1/16 on the lens opening. Now, suppose that you want to use 1/1000 sec. because you want to freeze the action, then set the shutter speed to 1/1000 and use 1/11 as your lens opening. Of course, these are “estimates” but are often “close enough” for “traditional” black and white films.

At the end of the day, you really should invest in an inexpensive iPhone (or similar) light meter. Start with one film, stick with it, and keep notes on your results. I’ve used Leica rangefinders (with no built-in meters) for nearly 40 years. A little practice and some knowledge of the relationships between shutter speed and lens opening (speed and how much light strikes the film)  goes a long way. 

Edited April 9, 2024 by Tom R

[AndrewK]

6 hours ago, Fotoklaus said:

I woild recommend to read about the basic knowledge of photography.

Thank you Fotolaus! That’s what I initially thought but wasn’t certain if there’s anything else I should do on my M-A.

Every type of B/W film has its own character, it’s fun to learn the pros/cons of each type of film 😊

 

I believe I have at least the sufficient amount of basic knowledge of photography and passion, otherwise I would never purchase an expensive camera like a Leica M-A.

[AndrewK]

Yes i have a Sekonic L-308X portable light meter and found very useful video on Youtube on learning how to use it for different scenario (indoor vs outdoor).

With the help of portable light meter, i'm also trying/learning the sunny 16 method. Hope i can master it soon

[AndrewK]

56 minutes ago, Mute-on said:

Apparently Double-X has a nominal iso of 250 in daylight (200 under tungsten). In any case if you shoot at 200 you should get decent results. If you want to try pushing +1 (400) or +2 (800), you will need to develop accordingly.

As others have said, cheapest light meter is a free app on your phone, however that will always be a reflected light meter. I prefer incident metering if possible. You will need a separate light meter with incident capability for that. A Sekonic L-308 is available new, for example.

Enjoy your new Leica!

Thank you!  I've read the ISO speed for double-x is at both 200 and 400. And yes, i've watched video explaining how one to push the film by soaking the film in the chemical for a longer time. That will be done when i send the film in for developing. 

[Fotoklaus]

vor 4 Stunden schrieb AndrewK:

Thank you Fotolaus! That’s what I initially thought but wasn’t certain if there’s anything else I should do on my M-A.

Every type of B/W film has its own character, it’s fun to learn the pros/cons of each type of film 😊

 

I believe I have at least the sufficient amount of basic knowledge of photography and passion, otherwise I would never purchase an expensive camera like a Leica M-A.

Alright then. Let's go.

[otto.f]

12 hours ago, AndrewK said:

In this case, how do i make the M-A to shoot this film at ISO speed of 400?

You own a M-A and don’t know about exposing a film? Is this a troll?

[AndrewK]

12 minutes ago, otto.f said:

You own a M-A and don’t know about exposing a film? Is this a troll?

Doesn't that show you how much passion i have for Leica film camera & film photography? 😅

[sometimesmaybe]

29 minutes ago, otto.f said:

You own a M-A and don’t know about exposing a film? Is this a troll?

we all gotta start somewhere 😇

@AndrewK is just starting from the top end 

[Viewfinder_vandals]

vor 6 Stunden schrieb AndrewK:

Thank you!  I've read the ISO speed for double-x is at both 200 and 400. And yes, i've watched video explaining how one to push the film by soaking the film in the chemical for a longer time. That will be done when i send the film in for developing. 

I would not recommend to Push Double x. This Film have a very Strong Tone curve and contrast. So you have a very Little Range to Meter correctly. Shoot at iso 250 and take the Right developer. Hp5 is okay to push 

[AndrewK]

3 minutes ago, Viewfinder_vandals said:

I would not recommend to Push Double x. This Film have a very Strong Tone curve and contrast. So you have a very Little Range to Meter correctly. Shoot at iso 250 and take the Right developer. Hp5 is okay to push 

Thank you. I'll take a note of that. 

I was initially attracted by the B/W result from HP5, then i saw Tri-X and i was like... wow. Now i see double-x, it made me wow again. 😂

[Viewfinder_vandals]

I think every picture you See and liked is going through lightroom… shooting Film is way more work than digital to get the real nice results. Even the Scanner you use have a big impact to the endresult. 
bytheway. You can shoot every Film at every iso and „correct“ it in Development. It Depends on how you want your endresult. 

[Fotoklaus]

vor einer Stunde schrieb Viewfinder_vandals:

I think every picture you See and liked is going through lightroom… shooting Film is way more work than digital to get the real nice results. Even the Scanner you use have a big impact to the endresult. 
bytheway. You can shoot every Film at every iso and „correct“ it in Development. It Depends on how you want your endresult. 

But not every Film at any speed in any developer will work. 

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[Anbaric]

18 hours ago, AndrewK said:

Thank you!  I've read the ISO speed for double-x is at both 200 and 400. And yes, i've watched video explaining how one to push the film by soaking the film in the chemical for a longer time. That will be done when i send the film in for developing. 

I think Kodak rates 5222 at 250 ISO for daylight work, but that's for cinematography and may not directly apply to your use (shooting stills and presumably scanning them).

If you're not developing it yourself, I'd start by shooting some otherwise identical test pictures at both 200 and 400 and perhaps a few other settings (noting which you used for each frame) and just get standard processing done with no special instructions. You might find that (e.g.) you prefer the look at 400 ISO with normal development. See for example:

https://jonoshields.com/post/double-x

With the developer and timing used in this test, a higher ISO setting than 200 might well be preferable (though this may not be true for the developer used by your processing service). Your results will give you a baseline for any further adjustments (e.g. requesting push processing).

If you do want to try developing yourself, you might start with the suggestions here:

https://www.digitaltruth.com/devchart.php