M8 Flash: 3 Choices

[MartinL]

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Which of my 3 flashes should I use on my M8? I know that only I can decide on the trade-offs and that will come with experience using each, but I not sure I'm aware of what the trade-offs actually are, and I'd appreciate your thoughts on the matter.

 

These are my flashes: Canon 580 EX; Metz 54 MZ3; and Nikon SB-28.

 

The Metz was my original "1st choice," and I purchased the SCA 3502 module. This is one fine flash, but it's big and top-heavy (with batteries, it's 531g and 8 1/8 inches). I could probably get used to handling it, but I also worry about tweaking the M8 frame. It's nearly an inch taller and it's 80 grams heavier than the Canon 580 EX.

 

I bought the 580 EX to replace the Metz because I prefer the ETTL and one or two other features for my Canon Mk II. The 580 EX will remain my "go-to" lens for my work (event and documentary--often with 70-200 lens) It's not a big deal to switch flashes to double with the M8, and while still large, it offers a size advantage.

 

I hadn't even considered my 7 yr-old Nikon SB-28. But at 415 grams and 6 3/4 inches it's almost a reasonable size and throws a pretty good light. Are you familiar with this flash? What and how important is the functionality that you think I would lose with respect to the other flashes?

 

Thanks for thinking about this.

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[garyvot]

I believe you can use your 580 EX on manual mode with the M8. The 580 EX II has an old-school auto-thyristor mode, which would work, but I don't believe the original 580 had this feature.

[robertwright]

no brainer, get the 580exII, it has an auto exposure mode (they call it E) that you set via custom function. You can dial in any iso, aperture and it will expose correctly.

 

one flash for leica and canon.

[MartinL]

I believe you can use your 580 EX on manual mode with the M8. The 580 EX II has an old-school auto-thyristor mode, which would work, but I don't believe the original 580 had this feature.

Don't take any of the following as flash gospel (if it were, I wouldn't be as confused as my posts reveal:) ), but these are my impressions:

 

Canon flashes are designed to be system components, and that's why I set aside my Metz and bought the 580 EX----to take fullest advantage of the 1D Mark II's ETTL (IMO, a worthwhile move). The Metz has an auto-thyristor which gives it a very competent camera-independent light reader for A mode (Canon or M8.)

 

But the 10 or 11-year-old Nikon SB-28 (smaller, lighter, but still decent power) also has the auto-thyristor. I've been playing with this flash, and noticed two things: First, the A mode works pretty well, but not as flawless as ETTL. Second, with the M8 I'm paying much more attention both to manual and priority settings, and it's just a slight jump to rely on the camera's metering verified with a check of the monitor and to manually tweak the flash (usually for bounce or fill) in order to get that "spot-on" perfection I'm looking for.

 

Does it sound like I want to be validated for never selling a flash that I last used with my Coolpix 990 (and still own)? - - - - -like I'm really hoping not to find a reason to use the Metz or Canon on my M8?

 

What am I overlooking?

[robertwright]

if you have the time to get a second capture then the 580V1 will do the trick in manual mode.

 

If you need auto and want one flash get the V2. Plus you get slave ability with two canon flashes for when you want to on the canon cameras.

 

I would dump the metz and nikon flashes.

 

If you want something small and pocketable get the sf24d.

 

lineup: 580ex, v1 and v2. V1 on the mkIIcanon, V2 on the Leica for event coverage. put the sf24d on the leica when you have a beer later on:)

[MartinL]

no brainer, get the 580exII, it has an auto exposure mode (they call it E) that you set via custom function. You can dial in any iso, aperture and it will expose correctly.

 

one flash for leica and canon.

Yikes! You mean could solve my dilemma by buying a 4th flash? OK, steady now. Take a deep breath. Help me stay focused. I intend to use a flash on the M8 for walk-around, family, hobbiest moments when fill, bounce, or boost for available light is desirable.

 

Question: Can you think of a reason to use on the M8, my Metz 54 or Canon 580 instead of the Nikon SB-28?

Thanks.

[robertwright]

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Yikes! You mean could solve my dilemma by buying a 4th flash? OK, steady now. Take a deep breath. Help me stay focused. I intend to use a flash on the M8 for walk-around, family, hobbiest moments when fill, bounce, or boost for available light is desirable.

 

Question: Can you think of a reason to use on the M8, my Metz 54 or Canon 580 instead of the Nikon SB-28?

Thanks.

 

I'm sorry, I thought you need the M8+flash for work, then it would make sense to have one flash, the 580v2 for both.

 

the SB-28 will do it all I believe, there is a long thread on flashes here somewhere. I don't know how many auto ranges the nikon has, the advantage to me of the new canon is that you can set any aperture down to f1.0 (caveat: the working range changes, but the canon flash has a 7-stop range of adjustment) I am not sure the nikon does that. That is if you want fill flash at f1.4, you can do it on the canon. You would know better about the nikon.

 

other than that I can't think of a good reason to get the newer canon. But those two reasons were key for me. Plus wireless flash on the canons with two units. different set of considerations. It added to my ability to get the newer flash, so I got it. But for what you want it for, the nikon will do the job I believe.

[Guest tummydoc]

All of the contacts on the flash foot of Nikon flashes coincide with contacts on the shoes of Leica bodies. Whether that could spell problem for either or both since they serve different functions, is perhaps a question to ponder. I do recall anecdotes at the outset of the M6TTL that Nikon flashes would drain the camera batteries quickly...whether that was ever substantiated with proper testing, I do not recall.

 

Personally I would use the MZ-3. Firstly it is a flash dedicated to the M8 with the proper module, and even if one chooses not to use it in TTL mode, it will communicate the camera's set ISO to the flash and actuate the flash-ready signal in the finder, and by flashing that signal, whether the exposure was adequate according to the flash's sensor. The flash foot is plastic and weaker than the flash-shoe so any sudden impact will break the foot before it can do major damage to the camera...however, even minor damage to an M8 would undoubtedly be expensive to sort, so some care in handling would be well-advised. As an alternative the SF24D is a handy, light-weight flash...not that powerful of course, and needing some aftermarket ingenuity to compensate for its lack of bounce facility.

[Jamie Roberts]

{snipped}I intend to use a flash on the M8 for walk-around, family, hobbiest moments when fill, bounce, or boost for available light is desirable.

 

Question: Can you think of a reason to use on the M8, my Metz 54 or Canon 580 instead of the Nikon SB-28?

Thanks.

 

No--for your purposes you should just use the SB28 in auto mode (unless it's so old it has lost some of its output, but that's the one I'd try first).

[nryn]

I've got three flashes for the M8: The SF-24D, the Metz 54MZ-3, and the Metz 40 MZ-3i. I'm with Vinay on this one. The 54MZ-3 becomes, in effect, the only dedicated large flash on the M8 with the right SCA adapter. Its auto mode is excellent. For compactness, the SF-24D is generally what I end up taking with me, if I take anything at all. When I do take it, though, I take an sFill for a diffuser.

 

Haven't had time to play with the 40 MZ yet. I like that it's squatter, but it's definitely a lot larger than I was expecting. Can't say I'd take it over the 54 right now.

[chris_tribble]

Why bother with flash? For me, part of the point of the M8 is a shooting style that dispenses with this aspect of photography...

[Jamie Roberts]

Chris,

 

There's all kinds of reasons for using flash(es) with the M8, especially at events where the lighting can be less than wonderful.

 

Now, it's true that's not within the tradition of M cameras, but truthfully the M8 is more than just the descendent of some fine street shooters. The quality of the M8 at events where existing lighting needs to be augmented (and not simply overpowered) is too good to pass up on principle.

 

Consequently, for my uses, the 580v2--used in conjunction with pocket wizards and other flashes--is superb. It's easier to use by far than the comparable Metz flashes, has more consistent output, has a wider range of adjustments in A mode (though not in manual) and is more compact (a little smaller).

 

For someone not tweaking light quite as much as I do, the SB 28 is a great choice, especially in bounce mode.

 

So I shoot in "available light" whenever I can, but as someone once said, "sometimes the best available light is my flash"

[MartinL]

Thanks for all these views. Not exactly a consensus here, but that also helps clarify my thinking.

 

As I mentioned in a different recent thread, my SB-28 dates back to use with my 1st digi, the Coolpix 990. There, it required the SK-E900 bracket, and that "package" kicked me off film entirely. But attaching two instruments to a bracket made for a large and overall clumsy apparatus, and I soon dispensed with the bracket, and I hand-held the flash.

 

Wow! did I ever learn a lot about bounce and fill---particularly, developing my intuitive (as distinct from metered) skills. When I found my Metz ungainly (and maybe risky) perched on the M8, I tried the more accommodating SB-28. It works "well-enough," but then I started thinking about my hand-held experience.

 

It's unlikely that I can ever use my M8 as my work camera unless I feel more comfortable with hand-held flash or an M8 compatible and quite powerful flash becomes available. This view can change as I become more familiar with the M8.

 

So here's where I stand (with the forum's help). If I can find a fully functional cable to hand-hold the Metz, I'll go for it. (Googling and recommendations suggest there might be one, but I won't believe it until I see it). I'll be in NYC next week and give it a look at Adorama/B&H. If there's no cable that allows the additional functions of the Metz (over the SB-28), I might just as well go with the more compact and adequate Nikon flash.

 

Stay tuned, and thanks for listening.

[skimmel]

I have never thought about flash on an M-camera, being pretty happy shooting without one, but looking over some old photos from my SLR with flash I realize that there are times when flash really does help (fill flash, add a little twinkle to an eye...) and maybe I should try on my M8.

 

With the Canon 580exII: can this just go directly on the M8? Do I need an adapter? Probably dumb questions, but this thread just got me thinking -- always a mistake!

[Jamie Roberts]

{snipped}

With the Canon 580exII: can this just go directly on the M8? Do I need an adapter? {Snipped}

 

Yep--you can put the flash in E mode (custom function 5 if I remember correctly) then put the flash right on the hot shoe. The Canon won't even turn on if there's a short.

 

If you're worried about doing that anyway, you could use a Wein hot-shoe-to-hot-shot safe-synch, or put the flash on a cold-shoe bracket and use a Paramount hot-shoe to PC synch cord (because the 580v2 has a PC synch).

[skimmel]

Yep--you can put the flash in E mode (custom function 5 if I remember correctly) then put the flash right on the hot shoe. The Canon won't even turn on if there's a short.

 

If you're worried about doing that anyway, you could use a Wein hot-shoe-to-hot-shot safe-synch, or put the flash on a cold-shoe bracket and use a Paramount hot-shoe to PC synch cord (because the 580v2 has a PC synch).

 

Thanks Jamie!