A Type of Banding?

[Guest Walt]

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What are your thoughts on the "banding" (I hate to use the term) in Chaplin's suit? This is a plywood figure covered with cloth for the clothing. Note that the hat, also cloth, is free of banding, as is the similarly toned garbage can to the right. This was shot before I began routinely using IR filters for BW work. The banding is not visible in the scene.

 

Walt

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[ho_co]

What a fascinating effect! I like the shot, but the stripes are distracting.

 

The stripes seem either to radiate from the same point, or to have two sources. The trousers have stripes that slope downward to the left; on the coat, the stripes seem horizontal.

 

Could there have been a light source reflecting through the trash basket (only because it's the only thing I see with a stripe pattern)?

 

 

But then on second thought, does the fabric have a napped surface? Some areas of the surface may have taken on a bend different from the rest, so the light may simply reflect differently on some parts than on others. Maybe it's a second-hand suit which had been rolled up and gained a curl.

 

My guess is that it's IR-related, with differential reflection for some reason.

 

I don't see it anywhere else in the scene, so it's likely a property of the suit. Do you have a DNG to compare for color variations? Or could you re-shoot both with and without the IR filter?

 

Oops, sorry! There I go suggesting testing. I should say it's likely a property of the suit when seen by an unfiltered M8.

 

--HC

[Guest Walt]

Howard-

 

I hadn't thought of the trash can, but it is difficult to make sense of the angle that might put this pattern on the surface of the Chaplin figure. The original is a DNG and the lighter strips do have a *slightly* bluish (maybe slightly purplish) cast compared to the darker stripes, which seem very neutral. The jacket of the boy (visible just to the right of Chaplin's neck) has the classic, unmistakable purple color so dear to the M8.

 

This camera, incidentally, is one of my failed bodies, so I no longer have it. And I haven't seen anything like this on another shot. My guess too is some kind of IR reflection or some radiation related to what is under the fabric, but this is just speculation. I think the IR filters are a must on this camera, for other reasons.

 

Walt

[ho_co]

Gee, this thread died quickly!

 

I also don't see how the trash basket could have caused the stripes; just looking for connections. Now that we know of the M8's IR sensitivity, it's almost too easy to assign any peculiarity to that cause.

 

There must be someone out there with better ideas than mine.

 

--HC

[carstenw]

Is it possible that you were wearing a jail suit and that Chaplin is slightly reflective?

 

Strange problem. I have not seen it before, on the M8 or any other camera. If the surface of the figure was slightly reflective, is there anything in the environment which could have caused that?

 

Ah... perhaps it was a radio frequency problem. Perhaps there was a cell on the roof next to you or something. I recall now having seen threads about the D200 with similar problems, and they were often caused by standing near powerful radio transmitters.

[ho_co]

Ah... perhaps it was a radio frequency problem. Perhaps there was a cell on the roof next to you or something. I recall now having seen threads about the D200 with similar problems, and they were often caused by standing near powerful radio transmitters.

There's a possibility, Walt!

 

You said this was a singular result from a camera that later bit the dust. Maybe it went south due to interference, and this was the first sign? How soon after this image did the camera fail?

 

--HC

[Guest Walt]

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Howard and Carsten-

 

Yes, this item just scrolled off the bottom--not nearly as interesting as a Luigi case.

 

I always wear a jail suit!

 

Is the radio frequency idea serious or a joke, I can't tell. But would it only make stripes on the suits of famous actors?

 

I can't remember what this particular body failed of. I believe it was either the one pixel vertical line or the LCD that filled with dust. The serial number of the body is in the EXIF and I no longer have it. (Incidentally, when I used M film cameras, Marty Forscher filed a unique set of notches on the film gate to identify the camera. This was a big help when there was a problem.)

 

I more or less corrected the problem by "quick selecting" the suit, making a new layer of the selection and then burning in the lighter stripes. I then placed the layer in a normal group and reduced the contrast of the suit slightly. It still needs some more work. Perhaps others have an idea for another approach.

 

Walt

[ho_co]

Much improved, Walt. I wouldn't know how to do better and would probably just end up cloning the darker into the lighter stripes even though I know that would leave a worse mess.

 

I don't know whether the RF interference is to be taken seriously; it has the twofold advantage that: 1) Leica does warn about cosmic rays in the instruction manual, and 2) it's a new, non IR-related suggestion.

 

Seriously, I think Carsten and I are both grasping at straws. And since it seems to be a one-off, I doubt anyone can come up with an explanation. Sometimes I throw out an idea like the trash basket, just hoping that will spark someone else to introduce a new possibility. RF interference might also jog someone's memory, though it doesn't seem to be doing so.

 

Maybe if you remarked that you didn't become aware of the stripes until after Photoshopping the Luigi case off the Little Tramp's neck?

 

--HC

[Guest Walt]

Howard--

 

I hope I never see this again--a real nuisance and a bizarre one. It's difficult to believe this is a unique shot though. And yes, had there been a Luigi case in the shot I would have PS'd it out.

 

Walt

[ho_co]

(Software keeps reducing my caps to lower case unless I insert a prefixing sentence.)

 

LOL

 

--HC

[carstenw]

The jail suit was the joke; the RF problem is real, and was observed especially by some people taking pictures from tall buildings with a viewing platform, such as the Empire State Building, where there is lots of interference. It tends to be more visible in dark areas. It is a bit unpredictable, and one shot may have it and the next not. I don't know why the hat didn't show any. I just mentioned it because it is the only other case of banding like this I am aware of.