Is the M10 (still) a good (value) gateway to the Leica world?

[mujk]

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A used base M10 is probably the best value digital M right now, unless you can get a M10P for a marginally higher price. And you will probably be able to sell it for almost the same price if you find out that hou don't like the rangefinder experience.

The problem with digital Ms from a value point of view is that they become unservicable at some point because critical components, particularly the sensor, are not manufactured anymore. If you visit the M9 forum you can see that this is a big issue right now. The M10 should be on the safe side for quite some time, because the same sensor is still used in current production models.

[Labradorhund]

I'm also deciding between an M10 and an M10P. There are two offers on the table with app. 1000€ difference (one new, one used). 

It's a really difficult decision for me. I've been in the market for an M10 for quite some time, but haven't taken the plunge because it is a lot of money for me. I own the Q2 and an M6 with two lenses. My aim was to go full Leica, which means selling my Sony gear and having the Q2 with it's 28mm, the M6 with 35mm and an M10 with a 50mm (or vice versa). I've seen lots of offers come and go and swing between "I'm going to buy it right now" and "I'm not going to spend around 5k on a new camera". 

I like the top plate engraving on the P version a lot. And I feel like focus peaking in LV-mode would be quite nice. But is it with the extra money? 

 

Damn those people in the Leica store Wetzlar! When I bought the Q2 there, they already told me it's a gateway drug to the M system and I didn't believe them. Now I'm hooked. They should put up warning signs  

[mujk]

3 hours ago, Labradorhund said:

I  like the top plate engraving on the P version a lot. And I feel like focus peaking in LV-mode would be quite nice. But is it with the extra money? 

Both the M10 and the M10-P have focus peaking in LV mode. The main functional differences between the two is that the M10-P has a touch screen, level gauge and a more quiet shutter.

[Guest]

6 hours ago, Labradorhund said:

I'm also deciding between an M10 and an M10P. There are two offers on the table with app. 1000€ difference (one new, one used). 

It's a really difficult decision for me. I've been in the market for an M10 for quite some time, but haven't taken the plunge because it is a lot of money for me. I own the Q2 and an M6 with two lenses. My aim was to go full Leica, which means selling my Sony gear and having the Q2 with it's 28mm, the M6 with 35mm and an M10 with a 50mm (or vice versa). I've seen lots of offers come and go and swing between "I'm going to buy it right now" and "I'm not going to spend around 5k on a new camera". 

I like the top plate engraving on the P version a lot. And I feel like focus peaking in LV-mode would be quite nice. But is it with the extra money? 

 

Damn those people in the Leica store Wetzlar! When I bought the Q2 there, they already told me it's a gateway drug to the M system and I didn't believe them. Now I'm hooked. They should put up warning signs  

Hello Labradorund,

and welcome to our Leica M camera version of AA..........We are all in various stages of recovery and failing.

Here's my feedback on this.

I knew a revised M10 was going to appear this year, ( 2020 ), but I still decided to have my "old" regular M10 go through the Leica M10 upgrade programme to a M10-P and I've no regrets.

If I were you I'd look for a good M10-P rather than a M10 and here's why: The M10-P has the quieter shutter and frankly that was the only reason I went through with the upgrade. I don't care about the engraving differences, I don't care about the touch screen or the level gauge nor do I care about the focus peaking either because personally I have no use for any of those options but the improved shutter for me was worth the cost. 

As I said I had a "head's up" on the M10-R before I decided to upgrade my M10 earlier this year but there was nothing there in the R that I felt I needed right now. I did not, do not, need the extra resolution at this time and frankly looking at the results posted on this forum and other's around the web' neither did more than 90% of the people who've upgraded simply because of the resolution jump and posted their M10-R snaps. For most work. most images, there's little or no difference to my eye and I've been at this for a long time.......and yes, I've had the opportunity to test the M10-R myself for some weeks.

Again the M10-P is worth the step up from the M10 in my view, if only for the improved shutter and there has to be a number of them available out there as people have traded up to the M10-R, but try to get one that's been checked out and preferably one with a warranty too, Leica's can be finicky and a warranty is a good thing. My M10 to M10-P upgrade at Leica came with a year's warranty, a bonus not to be sneezed at. Your existing lens options, 28mm on the Q2 and the existing 35 and 50mm are perfect. Good luck with whatever you decide on

[Jeff S]

I prefer the sound of the M10 shutter release, which nobody else hears in my typical shooting anyway. Individual tastes and preferences. 

Jeff

[nuc001]

20 hours ago, Labradorhund said:

Damn those people in the Leica store Wetzlar! When I bought the Q2 there, they already told me it's a gateway drug to the M system and I didn't believe them. Now I'm hooked. They should put up warning signs  

I started with the Q2 as well, and sure enough an M10-P followed...gateway drug indeed. 😆

Got an M10-P over the M10 mainly because of the silent shutter and the engraving, and non-upgradable hardware such as level gauge and touchscreen. Can say that I have not used the level gauge once, but touchscreen I use all the time and it is such an intuitive and fast way to check focus (double tap)...a necessity for a manual focus camera IMHO, especially if one likes to use shallow DOF. Silent shutter is nice when you're behind the camera, but the subject can't hear when you've taken a photo so instead you have to speak, which leads to an unforeseen side effect of dry/sore throat after a long day of shooting 😅

[bilbrown]

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On 10/17/2020 at 9:05 AM, astrostl said:

Still base M10 here. If I were buying new I'd surely get an M10-R, but I felt no need to upgrade at any point and still don't. I expect that when I do, I will keep the base M10 as a second body.

I sold my original M10 that I had from day 1 of launch for the R. I don’t miss it. The R is just a better resolution, dynamic range and low light version or the P. The P is just an M10 with a quieter shutter and touch screen and no logo. The BASE M10 is just as good image quality as the P. Buy new, no question the R. Used. An M10. You will be happy.

[Labradorhund]

Thanks everybody for chiming in and giving feedback on that. Lots of good insight. I guess price-wise a used M10 would be a great option. But there's that itch with the M10P and the nice engraving and the level gauge and the touch screen. However, comparing prices of used M10s and this M10P I have my eyes on....oh boy... that's a hell of a lot more money. But maybe it will really be the last camera I'll ever buy?  

[Archiver]

16 hours ago, petermullett said:

Again the M10-P is worth the step up from the M10 in my view, if only for the improved shutter and there has to be a number of them available out there as people have traded up to the M10-R, but try to get one that's been checked out and preferably one with a warranty too, Leica's can be finicky and a warranty is a good thing. My M10 to M10-P upgrade at Leica came with a year's warranty, a bonus not to be sneezed at. Your existing lens options, 28mm on the Q2 and the existing 35 and 50mm are perfect. Good luck with whatever you decide on

The combination of Q(2) and M10-P plus 35 and 50 sounds like the perfect kit, at least for me. My usual street kit is a wide compact like the Sigma DP1 and the M9 with Summicron 50, or Elmarit 28 with Panasonic GM1 and Olympus 25mm f1.8. A Q with a M10-P and 50 Cron and 35 Lux would be the bomb.

[paulsydaus]

9 hours ago, Labradorhund said:

Thanks everybody for chiming in and giving feedback on that. Lots of good insight. I guess price-wise a used M10 would be a great option. But there's that itch with the M10P and the nice engraving and the level gauge and the touch screen. However, comparing prices of used M10s and this M10P I have my eyes on....oh boy... that's a hell of a lot more money. But maybe it will really be the last camera I'll ever buy?  

Based on what I’ve seen of the used market prices, I don’t think it’s worth spending the extra for an M10P right now, especially for someone buying their first M.  The M10 seems to be a far better value proposition.  Things probably won’t change until the M11...

Edited October 26, 2020 by paulsydaus

[Labradorhund]

I was too slow for the M10P anyways. I thought I'd stroll by the Leica store after work, but by then it was already gone. 😕 

[Archiver]

On 10/27/2020 at 6:36 AM, Labradorhund said:

I was too slow for the M10P anyways. I thought I'd stroll by the Leica store after work, but by then it was already gone. 😕 

As an aside: one of my local secondhand dealers has recently revamped their website and are listing as much of their gear as possible. In the past, they had literally years of back stock sitting in boxes, unseen by anyone who didn't come to the shop. When they started listing things, they had a couple of M8s, a M9 or two, and even a unique M240 with an uncoated brass top plate. Within weeks, these all disappeared. The plain brass m240 had been in the display cabinet for months and months, well over a year. They had a titanium Q with handgrip, also gone. They recently listed a M10-P that was only 6 months old. Gone in two weeks. Despite the dire financial straits that have happened in Australia, some people are still willing to spend money.

[Maverick1st]

On 10/25/2020 at 1:23 AM, Labradorhund said:

Damn those people in the Leica store Wetzlar! When I bought the Q2 there, they already told me it's a gateway drug to the M system and I didn't believe them. Now I'm hooked. They should put up warning signs  

LOL Fell for the same scheme you did. 

[Labradorhund]

Just to let you guys know. I am now the proud owner of a used black M10. 

The camera feels amazing and I can't wait to see and find out what it's capable of. 😁

 

 

[pedaes]

1 hour ago, Labradorhund said:

Just to let you guys know. I am now the proud owner of a used black M10. 

The camera feels amazing and I can't wait to see and find out what it's capable of. 😁

 

 

Congratulations!  Look forward to seeing what you achieve.

[LustingLeicaLover]

On 10/25/2020 at 4:23 AM, Labradorhund said:

I'm also deciding between an M10 and an M10P. There are two offers on the table with app. 1000€ difference (one new, one used). 

It's a really difficult decision for me. I've been in the market for an M10 for quite some time, but haven't taken the plunge because it is a lot of money for me. I own the Q2 and an M6 with two lenses. My aim was to go full Leica, which means selling my Sony gear and having the Q2 with it's 28mm, the M6 with 35mm and an M10 with a 50mm (or vice versa). I've seen lots of offers come and go and swing between "I'm going to buy it right now" and "I'm not going to spend around 5k on a new camera". 

I like the top plate engraving on the P version a lot. And I feel like focus peaking in LV-mode would be quite nice. But is it with the extra money? 

 

Damn those people in the Leica store Wetzlar! When I bought the Q2 there, they already told me it's a gateway drug to the M system and I didn't believe them. Now I'm hooked. They should put up warning signs  

I just bought a BNIB M10 and now want a M10R too..

[LustingLeicaLover]

2 hours ago, Labradorhund said:

Just to let you guys know. I am now the proud owner of a used black M10. 

The camera feels amazing and I can't wait to see and find out what it's capable of. 😁

 

 

congrats

[Jeff S]

2 hours ago, LustingLeicaLover said:

I just bought a BNIB M10 and now want a M10R too..

An M10, SL, SL2 and M10-R in a matter of weeks?  Leica likes people like you.

Jeff

[Paulus]

Am 17.10.2020 um 16:51 schrieb Jadcx:

Hi

Like so many others before me, I have long dreamed of a Leica, and now, I'm probably able to make that dream a reality.  However, money is not unlimited, so I still have some choices to make, which I'm hoping some of you can help with, or at least confirm that they might not be as tough as they appear.  My current thinking is that I can get a good used M10 (£4100) and 35mm Summilux ASPH II (£2300).  I'm mostly going to be using this for travel and street style, so I think that this seems like a good combination.  Photography isn't my profession, or even a money-making sideline, it's just for my own enjoyment.  And yes, I fully realise that there are many cheaper, newer, 'better' cameras out there.  I don't want one of those.

But then, the internet hinders as much as it helps.  Should I spend another £1000 for the M10-P?  The touch screen looks nice but isn't a big issue for me, and the quieter shutter is, well, nice?  I don't see hundreds of threads of people complaining about the outrageously loud shutter on the M10, so is it really worth it for me?  And it will take me another few months to save the extra cash.  Then there's the M10-R, obviously, but at least another £3000 on top of my M10 budget.  And an even longer time to save.  Ideally I could add in some actual real world experiences to my decision making.  However here in the UK it doesn't seem possible to hire any of these cameras so I can't try them out to see which I prefer, and I don't know anyone with one either.

I find it very easy to get caught up in the details, just because there's something newer, 'better', whatever.  So maybe my question is this; is the M10 still a good value introduction to the Leica world?

Thoughts, ideas, and help all appreciated. 

 

If you don't need a spirit level. IMHO the M10 is great. 

I waited for the M10P this time. Before I bought the M8, M9,M240, instead of the P version as an early adapter, but this time I waited. Just long enough to buy an M10 new for €5900,- in March 2019. No regrets.

 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[budjames]

There are a number of good deals on lightly used M10s available at Leica camera stores in the USA. This might be a good option for those considering their first M purchase.

Regards,

Bud James

Please check out my fine art and travel photography at www.budjames.photography or on Instagram at www.instagram.com/budjamesphoto.