designdog Posted August 31, 2019 Share #1 Posted August 31, 2019 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hello. My irrational need to beta test all major software available to me has led to yet another problem: somehow the "embedded" profile is no longer available when I work on my M9 files, either in Photoshop Camera Raw or Lightroom. This due to fooling around with Mac OS 15 Catalina, and having to reinstall it on a wiped iMac. Everything works fine with my M10 flies. I have looked through countless backups, etc for a M9 embedded profile, and find none. I am thinking that perhaps this is not really a profile after all, but a default for Adobe to read the M9 files. In any case, my only options for M9 processing appears to be Adobe or 3rd party profiles. Any thoughts? Thanks. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted August 31, 2019 Posted August 31, 2019 Hi designdog, Take a look here M9 "Embedded" camera profile Adobe Camera Raw. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
adan Posted August 31, 2019 Share #2 Posted August 31, 2019 (edited) Hmmm - have you tried this with a virgin M9 picture (one never opened before in any raw-processor)? Seems to me I recall issues at some point (the M9 being 10 years old next month) with metadata (including perhaps the profile to use) getting overwritten or changed when swapping an image between, for example, Capture One and Adobe products. The embedded profile is definitely a "profile" - it is what the camera uses to produce the color rendering of baked-in-camera jpegs. It is passed to Adobe or others - per picture - as shorthand code in the metadata for adjustments to apply behind the scenes - native WB, As Shot WB, contrast curve, RGB color hues and saturations, etc. I'd guess you may have to contact Adobe and see if they have made changes in how they provide access to embedded profiles. Maybe they have dropped support - or maybe it is now in a preference somewhere as to whether to enable embedded profiles for access. Just FYI - if you're curious - I still have the choice in my ACR 8.3. The embedded profile WB is greener/cyaner than the AS profile, and in a B&W conversion (luminance only) is a bit darker overall, but also with a bit more shadow separation (obviously a different curve, not just globally darker). If I had been more - informed - about these things back in 2009, I might have stayed with the Embedded profile. But I was a good little sheep back then, and followed the "Adobe Party line" under the impression they knew what they were doing. Top - Adobe. Bottom - embedded (these are with all the calibration sliders zeroed out - and you should allow for jpeg/sRGB conversion to create these screen shots. YMMV.) Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited August 31, 2019 by adan Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/300928-m9-embedded-camera-profile-adobe-camera-raw/?do=findComment&comment=3810362'>More sharing options...
designdog Posted August 31, 2019 Author Share #3 Posted August 31, 2019 Andy, thanks for the response. I have the latest versions of Lightroom and Camera Raw. I don’t get the “Embedded” option any more. Would you check user/library/application support/Adobe/Camera Raw/Camera Profile and see if there is an M9 file in there? (I bet not.) Thanks. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted August 31, 2019 Share #4 Posted August 31, 2019 I don’t have my LR opened, but as I recall, you can click on ‘manage profiles’ in the profile browser, then click on ‘Legacy’ to find the old embedded choices. Jeff Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
designdog Posted August 31, 2019 Author Share #5 Posted August 31, 2019 Just as I recall it. However, I don’t get a “Legacy” choice... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted August 31, 2019 Share #6 Posted August 31, 2019 (edited) I opened an old M8.2 file in LR (latest LR Classic), and the closest camera profile I see, after clicking the grid icon, is ‘camera matching’, which shows ‘standard’. Don’t know how closely that correlates to the actual embedded profile. The ‘legacy’ box opens several older ACR options. For an M10 file, the grid includes an option that is actually called M10. Jeff Edited August 31, 2019 by Jeff S Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adan Posted August 31, 2019 Share #7 Posted August 31, 2019 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hey, DD - nope, no stand-alone M9 profile in the location you specified. Just an "index.dat" file that lists 100s of cameras, including M8 and S2 but NOT M9 (that I can see - I ran a text search on "Leica"). File dated Jan. 2014 I do think the M9 embedded profile is not a separate "thing" to be found elsewhere on a computer, but is literally "embedded" in the metadata of every M9 .DNG. Which of course is why any image from a brand-new camera model using DNG can immediately be opened in ACR or LR without waiting until Adobe gets around to creating their own profile and publishing it in an update. M10 with a 5-year-old version of PS6? Opens right out of the Leica box. It can bootstrap itself because the profile already is right there in the DNG, alongside all the pixels. Probably 100 bytes or so (certainly less than 1kb) to list (in numeric code): color of top-left pixel (pixel order), image dimensions, base WB, base WB tint, contrast curve parameter, profile (hue/sat for red/green/blue, plus shadow tint) etc. etc. Everything ACR or LR need to know to open the image. Except your new versions won't do that for some reason. For grins, I tried opening a "virgin" M9 .DNG file in TextEdit, but of course all I see is a bunch of hexadecimal gibberish - not the right software to "read" even the metadata of a camera file. ______________ BTW, there appear to be quite a few of cases of problems with missing embedded or legacy profiles with LR/ACR updates - reported on the Adobe Help pages. And the sad part is that the Adobe techs don't always seem to know exactly what people are talking about, or how their own software operates. (e.g. " 'Embedded' profiles mean the file is JPEG/TIFF/PSD." - really!?). (of course, a DNG is basically a 16-bit TIFF in a special "wrapper.") One suggestion is to delete (or simply remove to the desktop) the cameraprofiles folder, and then restart or reinstall LR (check the posts for details - don't take my word for it literally!!) https://forums.adobe.com/thread/2530710 https://forums.adobe.com/thread/2506892 There is also this: 2 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
designdog Posted September 1, 2019 Author Share #8 Posted September 1, 2019 Adan, This was it! The "Legacy" profiles are hidden by default. Turn them on by clicking the "+" on the Profile Browser in Lightroom. I say in Lightroom, because there doesn't seem to be one in Camera Raw. However, if you fix it first in Lightroom, it magically appears in Camera Raw. Thanks!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted September 1, 2019 Share #9 Posted September 1, 2019 5 hours ago, designdog said: Adan, This was it! The "Legacy" profiles are hidden by default. Turn them on by clicking the "+" on the Profile Browser in Lightroom. I say in Lightroom, because there doesn't seem to be one in Camera Raw. However, if you fix it first in Lightroom, it magically appears in Camera Raw. Thanks!!! Yep, as I remembered and wrote above, click on ‘manage profiles’, then ‘legacy’. Of course you have to find the ‘manage profiles’ box first. I thought you did that, but just found no legacy profiles stored. All’s well. Jeff Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byluuvu Posted October 9, 2022 Share #10 Posted October 9, 2022 so!!! M9P user here and it’s my main camera along side Monochrome246. I looked for this M9 profile. There isn’t “one”. when imported to LR, it defaults to “Adobe Color” but! If you hit the “profiles” selector, you’ll get a whole list of profiles that isn’t available for any other Raw file from any other camera. it’s actually incredible! along side with all of Adobe’s profiles, the M9P raw DNG file has 11! Color FILM profiles!!!! from Agfa to fuji to Kodak. All slide film (positive film). (Kodak Portra is negative film) It’s incredible!! i was skeptical so I checked other raw files from other brands. And it’s only for M9 files (maybe M9p only?) I checked Fuji RAF files and it’s shows all the “film profiles” that it has in the camera like Classic Chrome and such. I check M10-R file and the profile shows up as “M10-R” monochome file shows up as “Monochrome” Jpeg files will have “color” or “monochrome” This is actually an incredible find! Even though, the colors that’s “Adobe Color” provides for the DNG file is already mind blowing. Colors there are still amazing and better than any other color profiles I’ve used for other brands. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/300928-m9-embedded-camera-profile-adobe-camera-raw/?do=findComment&comment=4528635'>More sharing options...
Adam Bonn Posted October 12, 2022 Share #11 Posted October 12, 2022 I'm not seeing that in either LR/ACR with my M9p... might this have something to do with your Mastin Labs pack? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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