Old shrimp boat

[Photoskeptic]

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First one: M3, 50 cron, Efke 25.

Second one: M8

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[timothy]

So, the first picture shot on film appears to be much more three dimensional than the second shot on the M8. Why is that? Is it because of the tone curve? Because the midtones appear much brighter? Because of increased microcontrast? Or is there something hidden, esoteric, mystical going on here?

[timothy]

To eliminate the field of view as a reason, I have cropped the first picture and downsampled the second to match more closely.

[Photoskeptic]

Well, Timothy, you got me to re-look at my own images with a better eye! First of all, I notice the blacks are better in the M8 version. I find that surprising. The marsh grass (spartina) is sharper in the film image. Efke 25 is probably the slowest film available today and I've gotten some terrific shots with it. I give it credit for the more 3-D look. Then again, with both re-sized for the web who knows? And I apologize for not posting these at the same size, thanks for doing that:) As for the midtones, I suppose I could play with both using Curves and the results could be anything I wanted. However, once each shot was introduced to PS I worked each image to produce the best outcome. Now that I have CS3 I would probably do each one a tad differently with the M8 image getting the better processing than the previous effort.

[timothy]

I notice the blacks are better in the M8 version.

 

On the contrary, I noticed the black are "better" in the Efke 25 version.

 

Fortunately, the blacks in the M8 version were easily "enhanced" in Photoshop (Duplicate Layer then Filter > Sharpen > Unsharp Mask; Amount: 20; Radius: 40; then Blending Mode: Darken; Opacity: 80).

 

Overall, that improves the M8 version somewhat, but it still looks like a gloomy day rather than a sunny one; there is still very little contrast in the mid-tones; and there is still almost no tonal variation in the water. Look at it! It's just an empty gray, eh?

[timothy]

There is still very little contrast in the mid-tones.

 

The contrast in the mid-tones can be increased, among other ways, with use of the High Pass filter.

[timothy]

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There is still almost no tonal variation in the water. Look at it! It's just an empty gray, eh?

 

With a lower but not infinitesimal radius, some tonal variation can be brought out using the High Pass filter once again.

[timothy]

With selective application of Curves, the mid-tones can be made less muddy without affecting the brightest highlights.

[timothy]

Something is still missing. It still doesn't look convincing. Compare the Efke 25, the revised M8 version, and the original M8 version.

[fotohuis]

The only conclusion I got is that a CCD can not registrate what a classical B&W film can.

Something is done in the conversion to the grey tones in each digital camera and it can never be compared with a real B&W film. It not only happens with this M8 but also with a 5D or whatever.

 

However Efke 25 seems to be rather "crappy" compared with a more modern slow speed B&W film:

Slow speed film comparison

 

So on both sides reasons for improvement

[Photoskeptic]

Robert, the Efke image was shot with my last roll and the expiration date was six months ago! Even so, I do find for a 25 speed film, the Efke still has some grain. I bought this Efke when it was the only 25 rated film to be found. I haven't tried any others yet, but I will.

Thanks to all for their replies and Timothy for his work on this image.

[fotohuis]

For an iso 25 film it doesn't matter if it is a few years over it's expiration date. I only want to emphasize that slow speed B&W film is increadible good comparing with a digital camera.

Also with Efke (25) you can minimize grain, the same you can do with a Rollei PAN 25 film, which is more sturdy, slightly finer grain, flat, PET layer and non-curling layer.

It's in fact an improved OrWo NP15 film.

 

For neglectible grain you can develop in CG512/Rollei L.S. developer, which is an ultra fine grain developer and then I can tell you of my own experience even with a 40x50cm print you will see no noticeble grain.

 

All these slow speed B&W film have a resolution (ln/mm) just over the max. resolution of a Leica Summicron, around 200-220 ln/mm and a Summicron is one of the best lenses available.

 

But your photo is OK, even with the M8, it was just remarkable you put the same picture from your M3 and M8 under simmilar conditions for direct comparision.