I like film...(open thread)

[A miller]

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Henry - You now say "most cases" but before you made a flat statement that it was ALWAYS better.  I am a lawyer and I tend to nit pick on words like this  

As I said, "most cases" sounds like a reasonable statement.  But the example of Ektar converted that I shared a couple of weeks is proof - at least to me - that a conversion can indeed be successful:

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t

 

 

Adam , I say most cases because I compared in several tests

first with digital color converted to b&w when I shoot in digital

secondly now color film converted to b&w

 

I cannot find the post I share here but just find pictures

respectively

1-color Kodak Portra 160 crop 100%

2-converted b&w LR and SE crop

"loss of details in the shadows"  if you don't care of details

you can convert ....

3-Kodak TX400 crop

4-Kodak Portra 160 original Tiff >Jpeg no correction

5-Kodak TX400 original Tiff>Jpeg no correction

 

I have original pictures in Kodak Portra 160 and Kodak TX400

at your disposal  I can send you

 

 

Technical conditions : same lens 50 Summicron

Leica R4S and Leicaflex with tripod

taken at the same place , same moment

 

 

Pic 1 : Kodak Portra 160 (dev myself in Tetenal) crop

 

 

Image3racathkp16lxslcipredrlfht+++500.jpg

 

 

Pic 2 : color converted to b&w

notice loss of details in the shadows under the foot

 

 

Image3racathkp16lxslcipredrlfht+++-500cropcolor.jpg

 

 

Pic 3 : Kodak TX 400 (dev myself in Kodak D76)

 

 

Image2catrskodtx4r4scipredrlfht+++500-2.jpg

 

 

Pic 4 : Original pictures

 

Kodak Portra 160

 

 

Image3racathkp16lxslcipredrlfht+++550 (2).jpg

 

 

Pic 5 : Kodak TX400

 

 

Image2catrskodtx4r4scipredrlfht+++550.jpg

 

I also see the difference  when I crop with the enlarger and print with Ilford paper

That said you can convert color to b&w if you want !

In my case I avoid... it's the reason I always have 2 cameras one with color roll

and one with b&w roll

 

I understand now why Leica produces M Monochrome without the Bayer Filter

 

Best

Henry

[philipus]

This is an awesome series, Adam. Was this Portra 400 at EI 800? 

 

I wish we had freezing weather so I could shoot people suffering in the cold.

 

Oh yes, it was brutal.  it felt like -30C.  But it makes good shooting material with people decked out in very heavy clothes and looking all distressed!  Like this!

 

This is very nice, I think. 

 

Fog in late autumn

 

LeicaM6_0070.jpg

 

Leica M6, Summicron 35

 

Thanks for the interesting comparison Henry. It's really a testament to your true love of film that you take the time to shoot comparisons like this. I'd only add that in a hybrid workflow it is usually quite easy to adjust things like loss of detail in the shadows. I'm not saying that such a tweaked image will surpass one shot on black and white film, but for most intents and purposes it will be 'good enough', and probably quite a lot better than that. 

 

Adam , I say most cases because I compared in several tests

first with digital color converted to b&w when I shoot in digital

secondly now color film converted to b&w

 

I cannot find the post I share here but just find pictures

respectively

1-color Kodak Portra 160 crop 100%

2-converted b&w LR and SE crop

"loss of details in the shadows"  if you don't care of details

you can convert ....

3-Kodak TX400 crop

4-Kodak Portra 160 original Tiff >Jpeg no correction

5-Kodak TX400 original Tiff>Jpeg no correction

 

I have original pictures in Kodak Portra 160 and Kodak TX400

at your disposal  I can send you

 

 

Technical conditions : same lens 50 Summicron

Leica R4S and Leicaflex with tripod

taken at the same place , same moment

 

 

Pic 1 : Kodak Portra 160 (dev myself in Tetenal) crop

 

 

Image3racathkp16lxslcipredrlfht+++500.jpg

 

 

Pic 2 : color converted to b&w

notice loss of details in the shadows under the foot

 

 

Image3racathkp16lxslcipredrlfht+++-500cropcolor.jpg

 

 

Pic 3 : Kodak TX 400 (dev myself in Kodak D76)

 

 

Image2catrskodtx4r4scipredrlfht+++500-2.jpg

 

 

Pic 4 : Original pictures

 

Kodak Portra 160

 

 

Image3racathkp16lxslcipredrlfht+++550 (2).jpg

 

 

Pic 5 : Kodak TX400

 

 

Image2catrskodtx4r4scipredrlfht+++550.jpg

 

I also see the difference  when I crop with the enlarger and print with Ilford paper

That said you can convert color to b&w if you want !

In my case I avoid... it's the reason I always have 2 cameras one with color roll

and one with b&w roll

 

I understand now why Leica produces M Monochrome without the Bayer Filter

 

Best

Henry

[philipus]

Our dear leader with a backpack full of Tri-X plus tripod and two Billinghams (no doubt shooting a micro-selfie of course).

 

Ghent

 

Flickr

50/1.4A Portra 160 (EI80)

[philipus]

I remember thinking when I saw this photo that it is a wonderful photograph with luscious tones and wondering which B&W film you used. And then I realised that it was a conversion. 

 

 

Henry - You now say "most cases" but before you made a flat statement that it was ALWAYS better.  I am a lawyer and I tend to nit pick on words like this  

As I said, "most cases" sounds like a reasonable statement.  But the example of Ektar converted that I shared a couple of weeks is proof - at least to me - that a conversion can indeed be successful:

 

t

 

[philipus]

Another attempt at a bus shot in Ghent.

 

Flickr

Same roll as above

[Steve Ricoh]

Steve a certain style in your two pictures, grain gives the picture like a painting

Very nice

 

 

 

Superb picture nicely done X_Bel

 

Best

Henry

Thank you Henry

[SunnySixteen]

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Train Stop along the Hudson, July 2017

 

Tri-X M6 Summicron 50

 

Happy Holidays everyone!

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[SunnySixteen]

at the same place

 

Cayeux sur Mer

2017

 

 

 

Image5cayeuxkp160m7fecbwluglfht++++-1000.jpg

 

 

Kodak Portra 160-Leica M7-35 Summilux Asph

 

I develop myself Portra in Tetenal

 

Best

Henry

 

Lovely photo Henry! Portra 160 is something special ...

[becker]

at the same place

 

Cayeux sur Mer

2017

 

 

 

Image5cayeuxkp160m7fecbwluglfht++++-1000.jpg

 

 

Kodak Portra 160-Leica M7-35 Summilux Asph

 

I develop myself Portra in Tetenal

 

Best

Henry

 

 

Nice how the water ist magnetic to the couple, I think Beuys with his " everyone is an artist " was not failing, he ment , that we need something more

than just beeing money making tools, to be complete, I just looked in the Catalogue from an far away exheb. in the Martin Gropius Bau

where I saw his work.

Then it was new surprising, irritating, now its still beautiful but in a way common. Still great powerful Art. 

Edited December 29, 2017 by becker

[A miller]

Thanks, Philip.  Yes, these were all pushed one stop.

This is an awesome series, Adam. Was this Portra 400 at EI 800? 

 

[Steve Ricoh]

Lady Viking spotted in York #BelieveInVikings

Pen F Tri-X 400

 

Lady Viking in York by -Steve Ricoh-

[stray cat]

Pen F 40 f/1.4 Tri-X Plustek Scan

 

York Minster by -Steve Ricoh-

 

Not sure what the vertical line(s) are and how they may have occurred. (Lab developed)

 

Steve - what a superb moment you have caught here. From one perspective, it is a moment overflowing with historical complexity, given the history of the emperor Constantine and the juxtaposition of the young lady in front who apparently is of the Islamic faith - perhaps even with a heritage from the area once covered by Byzantium. From another, it provides a worthy juxtaposition of the ages. So well seen, and so beautifully nuanced in the sumptuous greys provided by the Pen camera and Tri-X. A wonderful moment indeed.

 

The vertical lines are scratches on the film - and I'd guess they were produced in the camera by a bit of grit either on the pressure plate or in the felt of the cassette itself, or perhaps by the lab during development. Does the same roll contain similar scratches - if not, whatever caused it has probably ceased to be a problem, and if so you might like to carefully blow any parts of the camera that contact film with a powerful blower brush. As a scan, these lines are easily obliterated with careful use of the repair tool in photoshop. As a print, careful spotting will eventually make these lines invisible.

 

(Edit) ... and I've just seen the wonderful picture you posted as I was writing the above of the young lady in the viking helmet. you could do an amazing series, Steve, of such anachronistic historical oddities.

Edited December 29, 2017 by stray cat

[B.Toews]

M7, Zeiss 50/2 Planar, HP5 @ 1600, D76:

 

Untitled by Brendan | Toews, on Flickr

 

M7, Zeiss 50/2 Planar, Tri-X @ 1600, D76:

 

Untitled by Brendan | Toews, on Flickr

[Wayne]

Rooster Crossing. Rural. For Henry. In case he is becoming bored with city life.

 

In SE Indiana we do love our chicken, and never needlessly waste a bird.......Even if it means being late to the job.

 

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M5, 50mm 2.0 VC Heliar Classic, Bergger Pancro 400.....Swiftly becoming my favorite.

Edited December 30, 2017 by Wayne

[Steve Ricoh]

Steve - what a superb moment you have caught here. From one perspective, it is a moment overflowing with historical complexity, given the history of the emperor Constantine and the juxtaposition of the young lady in front who apparently is of the Islamic faith - perhaps even with a heritage from the area once covered by Byzantium. From another, it provides a worthy juxtaposition of the ages. So well seen, and so beautifully nuanced in the sumptuous greys provided by the Pen camera and Tri-X. A wonderful moment indeed.

 

The vertical lines are scratches on the film - and I'd guess they were produced in the camera by a bit of grit either on the pressure plate or in the felt of the cassette itself, or perhaps by the lab during development. Does the same roll contain similar scratches - if not, whatever caused it has probably ceased to be a problem, and if so you might like to carefully blow any parts of the camera that contact film with a powerful blower brush. As a scan, these lines are easily obliterated with careful use of the repair tool in photoshop. As a print, careful spotting will eventually make these lines invisible.

 

(Edit) ... and I've just seen the wonderful picture you posted as I was writing the above of the young lady in the viking helmet. you could do an amazing series, Steve, of such anachronistic historical oddities.

Wow Phil, thank you greatly for your analysis, and as always so eloquently stated!

I was out in York just before Christmas running a test roll through the Pen. Not too bothered what I captured so I sort of entered into a state of mind where I clicked on gut feel rather than my usual thoughtfull state of wondering whether the exposure was worth the money. So in the case of the Minster shot with the statue of Constantine I saw the lady entering stage right and I left the rest to remorse control. I think it works best for me when I don't over think things.

 

The Pen F spits the 36x24 frame into two18x24 half rames, so each shot is captured in portrait with the camera in the normal landscape orientation. As a consequence the vertical scratches are at 90 degrees to the direction of film travel, and it seems to be an isolated frame affected. It sort of points to a lab process issue. As it is I'm not too fussed as I think it adds authenticity to the frame being analogue.

 

The Viking lady - well I missed the best shot, but by the time I wound on she had moved. Quickly focusing I risked the exposure as she was walking away. Light wasn't good, so a combination of shutter speed and DoF produced what is seen. But it's the horns that get me, so unexpected.

 

Rule #1 always have your camera primed and ready. If I'd had my M6 with me instead I would probably have taken a better shot. But having two cameras with me at any one time leads to discussions in my own head, and thus indecisions and I'd miss the shot anyway.

Edited December 30, 2017 by Steve Ricoh

[stray cat]

Wow Phil, thank you greatly for your analysis, and as always so eloquently stated!

I was out in York just before Christmas running a test roll through the Pen. Not too bothered what I captured so I sort of entered into a state of mind where I clicked on gut feel rather than my usual thoughtfull state of wondering whether the exposure was worth the money. So in the case of the Minster shot with the statue of Constantine I saw the lady entering stage right and I left the rest to remorse control. I think it works best for me when I don't over think things.

 

The Pen F is spits the 36x24 frame into two18x24 half rames, so each shot is captured in portrait with the camera in the normal landscape orientation. As a consequence the vertical scratches are at 90 degrees to the direction of film travel, and it seems to be an isolated frame affected. It sort of points to a lab process issue. As it is I'm not too fussed as I think it adds authenticity to the frame being analogue.

 

The Viking lady - well I missed the bestbshot, but bto the time I wound on she had moved. Quickly focusing I risked the shot as she was walking away. Light wasn't good, so a combination of shutter speed and DoF had produced what is seen. But it's the horns that get me, so unexpected. Rule #1 always have your camera primed and ready. If I'd had my M6 with me instead I would probably have taken a better shot. But having two cameras with me at any one time leads to discussions in my head, and thus indecisions and I'd miss the shot anyway.

 

Thanks Steve for an interesting analysis of your working methods. Overthinking - thinking about it - is always a bad thing. Sufficient thinking is what's required or, better still in the case of photography "on the spot" - preparedness and gut instinct. A good point made, too, about familiarity with your gear - ideally it will be able to be so invisible that your instinctive recognition of "the moment" will be immediately sourced through eye-brain - hands - camera - photo. Of course it doesn't always work like this, but as the Constantine photo shows (and I forgot to mention the serendipity of her looking down at her phone echoing his looking down at - what - perhaps his sword? What volumes can we make of that?) it sometimes does, and it's just great when that happens. And at least you recognized the kind of absurdity of the viking helmet - you might not think you got the money shot, but to us you did.

 

Here's a shot where I did have the luxury of having some of those discussions in my head - the two people were oblivious to me shooting (a nice quiet and unobtrusive Leica!), so I just had to wait until they were positioned (with regards to my static position at a table having a very nice breakfast) in a favourable way - not overthinking it, just waiting for the choreography to be pleasing. This is the best of the four or five I took:

 

 

Upper West Side, New York 2016

M6TTL, 28mm Elmarit, Tri-X

[EoinC]

vorhang.jpg

I like this a lot, Becker - It would look great printed.

[EoinC]

 

 

Oh yes, it was brutal.  it felt like -30C.  But it makes good shooting material with people decked out in very heavy clothes and looking all distressed!  Like this!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yes! - Adam's Winter Season is on. We just need some snow...

I love seeing these shots, Adam - Particularly the wind-blown furry face-frames (otherwise known as hoods).

[Wayne]

Just chaos. And........a traffic cone.

 

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M5, VC 50mm 2.0 Heliar Classic, Bergger Pancro 400 (Rodinal 1/50 22 minutes)

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Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[Wayne]

Wow Phil, thank you greatly for your analysis, and as always so eloquently stated!

I was out in York just before Christmas running a test roll through the Pen. Not too bothered what I captured so I sort of entered into a state of mind where I clicked on gut feel rather than my usual thoughtfull state of wondering whether the exposure was worth the money. So in the case of the Minster shot with the statue of Constantine I saw the lady entering stage right and I left the rest to remorse control. I think it works best for me when I don't over think things.

 

The Pen F spits the 36x24 frame into two18x24 half rames, so each shot is captured in portrait with the camera in the normal landscape orientation. As a consequence the vertical scratches are at 90 degrees to the direction of film travel, and it seems to be an isolated frame affected. It sort of points to a lab process issue. As it is I'm not too fussed as I think it adds authenticity to the frame being analogue.

 

The Viking lady - well I missed the best shot, but by the time I wound on she had moved. Quickly focusing I risked the exposure as she was walking away. Light wasn't good, so a combination of shutter speed and DoF produced what is seen. But it's the horns that get me, so unexpected.

 

Rule #1 always have your camera primed and ready. If I'd had my M6 with me instead I would probably have taken a better shot. But having two cameras with me at any one time leads to discussions in my own head, and thus indecisions and I'd miss the shot anyway.

So Steve.......I have to ask. Is the statue of Constantine an article of plunder?