The Price of Leica Products and Services

[stunsworth]

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Who is in control? Me as I have the money to spend as I choose. This sort of behaviour from a saleseman would also have me out of the door

 

I can't say I can remember being influenced by a salesman. The shopping 'experience' at Comet, Dixons or Currys means that I know what I want, or have a short list, before I walk into a shop. I certainly would buy something as expensive as a Leica without knowing before I walked through the door what I wanted to buy. If a salesman behaved like Michael's described I'd walk out.

[stunsworth]

That should have been "wouldn't buy something as expensive as a Leica"

[bill]

Why am I reminded of Swiss Toni...?

 

Regards,

 

Bill

[stunsworth]

Why am I reminded of Swiss Toni...?

 

"Checking the details of a second-hand Leica is very much like making love to a beautiful woman. First of all, verify her year of origin. She may look like she rolled off the production line in 1990 but who's to say the fellow before you didn't break her seal"

[bill]

:D:D ...a mental image has been formed...

 

Regards,

 

Bill

[Guest Ornello]

I can't say I can remember being influenced by a salesman. The shopping 'experience' at Comet, Dixons or Currys means that I know what I want, or have a short list, before I walk into a shop. I certainly would buy something as expensive as a Leica without knowing before I walked through the door what I wanted to buy. If a salesman behaved like Michael's described I'd walk out.

 

You don't understand. Back in the late 1960s things were different. Most of the clientele we had were professional people, business owners, doctors, etc. There were not as many of the 'little guys' as there were later, after cameras such as the AE-1 Canon came out. There was no have internet or anything like that. People came to the store to see cameras and learn about them. An M-4 cost something like $350. A Nikkormat was maybe $175 (just guessing).

 

People coming into the store were generally, though not universally, able to buy anything we had in the way of cameras.

 

And indeed, rather than 'shoving them down their throats' I did precisely the opposite. They would see the Leicas and Alpas on the shelf and ask about them.

[Guest Ornello]

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I can't say I can remember being influenced by a salesman. The shopping 'experience' at Comet, Dixons or Currys means that I know what I want, or have a short list, before I walk into a shop. I certainly would buy something as expensive as a Leica without knowing before I walked through the door what I wanted to buy. If a salesman behaved like Michael's described I'd walk out.

 

I was young then, 19 or 20. I remember vividly, though, when after showing a customer something like a Canon FTb or Nikkormat first, he asked to see the Leica or Alpa, and gently scolded me, saying something like:

 

"Show me the best first. Don't presume I can't afford it. I'll let you know if I can't afford it. You won't insult me by showing me the best first, but you run the risk of insulting me if you presume I can't afford it."

 

Those may not be all his exact words, but it's pretty close.

 

He was perhaps in his 40s or 50s, a self-made man, obviously, and (I can't recall now) may have been a foreigner. It was all so long ago now.

 

I took his words to heart and never made that mistake again.

[Guest Ornello]

Does anyone here have old Leica price lists from the 1960s and 1970s?

[Peter H]

Does anyone here have old Leica price lists from the 1960s and 1970s?

 

I have a photo of me when I used to work in a camera shop on Saturdays and holidays while I was at school 1968 - 1970, standing over a Leica M4 with a price tag quite visible: £321-19

 

At that time £1 sterling = 3.2 US$, = $1,020

 

But then US prices are often lower than European prices so it probably doesn't quite equate that simply.

 

 

PS The shop was called North London Cameras, in Stoke Newington High Street. Anyone remember it?

[Guest Ornello]

I have a photo of me when I used to work in a camera shop on Saturdays and holidays while I was at school 1968 - 1970, standing over a Leica M4 with a price tag quite visible: £321-19

 

At that time £1 sterling = 3.2 US$, = $1,020

 

But then US prices are often lower than European prices so it probably doesn't quite equate that simply.

 

 

PS The shop was called North London Cameras, in Stoke Newington High Street. Anyone remember it?

 

 

I don't think an M4 body sold for more than $500 until a surtax was imposed on foreign goods in 1971 during the Nixon administration. I could be wrong though.

 

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,943884,00.html

[bocaburger]

But the important thing is to hint, ever so subtly, so subtly that they are not consciously aware of it, that if they don't buy they cannot afford it.

 

"If it's more camera than you need, well I certainly understand...."

 

 

LOL, that's your idea of 'ever so subtly' eh? Don't get me wrong, I'm not disputing the efficacy of subliminal selling techniques. There are many, many books written about the psychology of selling. I've read quite a number. I wager so have a lot of businesspeople, doctors, lawyers, dentists...the type who buy luxury goods. That's not to say we are immune to being "worked", however more likely to pick up on it. At best I find it amusing, at worst offensive. Whenever I go in to buy a new car, the first thing I tell the salesman is "If you say 'I'll have to take your offer to my manager and see what he says', I won't be here when you get back."

 

I know one thing: if I were as skilled a closer as you claim to be, I'd be selling yachts, not cameras

[mmradman]

Why am I reminded of Swiss Toni...?

 

Regards,

 

Bill

 

Thanks for the reminder

tears inducing.

[Guest Ornello]

LOL, that's your idea of 'ever so subtly' eh? Don't get me wrong, I'm not disputing the efficacy of subliminal selling techniques. There are many, many books written about the psychology of selling. I've read quite a number. I wager so have a lot of businesspeople, doctors, lawyers, dentists...the type to buy luxury goods. That's not to say they are immune to being "worked", however they are more likely to pick up on it. At best I find it amusing, at worst offensive. Whenever I go in to buy a new car, the first thing I tell the salesman is "If you say 'I'll have to take your offer to my manager and see what he says', I won't be here when you get back."

 

I know one thing: if I were as skilled a closer as you claim to be, I'd be selling yachts, not cameras

 

As I said, I was very young, but I did learn fast. Don't get me wrong; I was not trying to 'work' anyone. He wanted the good camera, but to 'save face' we had to go through this ritual where he pretends to show sales resistance and I pretend he can't afford it. You learn to distinguish between 'sham' sales resistance and the real thing, between people who really cannot afford it and those who go through the ritual of acting like they can't or are not really interested.

 

But as I said, one customer gently scolded me for 'presuming' he could not afford it and not showing him 'the best' equipment first.

 

The point was we had to go through certain rituals. Hardly anyone walked in off the street and opened up his checkbook and said "I'll take that 10d and 50mm Micro-Switar. Wrap it up, please".

 

Again, he feigns disinterest (we both know he wants it), I pretend he can't afford it (we both know he can). It's a ritual, sort of like dating, LOL.

[asmith]

I have in front of me a receipt dated Nov 1970 when I bought from David Stephens' father:

Leica M4 body £208 :8 :11

90mm f2.8. £74

35mm Summicron £65

Leicameter MR4. £24

Benser case. £5

Total. £376 : 8. : 11

 

Although it was probably an expensive purchase at the time, I can't help feeling that Leica goods are more expensive now. All this equipment was new.

Alwyn

[Guest Ornello]

I have in front of me a receipt dated Nov 1970 when I bought from David Stephens' father:

Leica M4 body £208 :8 :11

90mm f2.8. £74

35mm Summicron £65

Leicameter MR4. £24

Benser case. £5

Total. £376 : 8. : 11

 

Although it was probably an expensive purchase at the time, I can't help feeling that Leica goods are more expensive now. All this equipment was new.

Alwyn

 

But US prices were lower, I think.

[giordano]

Advertised UK retail camera prices from the 1940s up to the introduction of VAT in 1974 included "purchase tax" which at the end of that time was I think 30%, having been much higher in the late 40s-early 50s.

 

As I understand it, advertised retail prices in the US don't include sales taxes.

 

In addition there were import tariffs at much higher levels than today's. I don't know how they compared between the two countries.

[Guest Ornello]

Advertised UK retail camera prices from the 1940s up to the introduction of VAT in 1974 included "purchase tax" which at the end of that time was I think 30%, having been much higher in the late 40s-early 50s.

 

As I understand it, advertised retail prices in the US don't include sales taxes.

 

In addition there were import tariffs at much higher levels than today's. I don't know how they compared between the two countries.

 

In 1971, a 10% surtax was introduced; it was imposed on certain foreign goods (coming into the US). I think it expired long ago.

[SteveYork]

Does anyone here have old Leica price lists from the 1960s and 1970s?

 

From January, 1972 -- list prices

 

Leicaflex SL ($675)

M4 ($450)

M5 ($627)

 

35mm Summicron M ($297)

 

X 5.45 for inflation adjustment

 

Still expensive. Today's prices are a bit more expensive.

[SteveYork]

From March, 1973 -- List Price

 

Leicaflex SL ($798)

M5 ($795)

M4 -- dropped

 

35mm Summicron M ($357)

 

Leica liked raising prices then too.

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Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[Guest Ornello]

From March, 1973 -- List Price

 

Leicaflex SL ($798)

M5 ($795)

M4 -- dropped

 

35mm Summicron M ($357)

 

Leica liked raising prices then too.

 

I believe the dollar was devalued around then. It had nothing to do with Leica wanting to raise prices. It was a period of inflation.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixon_Shock