bushmonk Posted August 17, 2011 Share #1 Posted August 17, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hello, This is going to be my first purchase of a more serious photographic equipment:D; I would like to obtain a Leica M6 (classic, No 223XXXX) as well as a used Voigtländer f1.7 (comes with adapter for M mount) from a trader in a local store for a reasonable sounding price (1050 EUR & 480 EUR, respectively). I will get a 1 month return policy. Regardless of what the trader claims (good condition): What are the main indicator clues, in terms of working condition and re-sell value, when holding the m6 or the Voigtländer lense in my hands in the store ? This questions also applies for M6 bodies and lenses quality checks in general. Keywords lense: fungus: what does it look like? How can I detect it?. Where would it be ? damaged interiour: detectable by eye ?. Can you feel it ? focus: aperture rings ? Can one feel the state ? body: light sensor state. Any way to see it while in the store ? Serial number: any clues here ? original packaging box & contents awailability: (is this important to maintain re-sell value ? ... in my case it is not available) I would be very grateful if someone could refer me to an appropriate link or tell me from his experience, regarding key indicators for good or bad state of M6 bodies (classic) and lenses. Replies in German would be equally helpful. Thank you very much in advance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted August 17, 2011 Posted August 17, 2011 Hi bushmonk, Take a look here key indicators for the state of M6 bodies (classic) and lenses. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
bill Posted August 17, 2011 Share #2 Posted August 17, 2011 Welcome, I shall comment by annotation in bold: I would like to obtain a Leica M6 (classic, No 223XXXX) as well as a used Voigtländer f1.7 (comes with adapter for M mount) from a trader in a local store for a reasonable sounding price (1050 EUR & 480 EUR, respectively). I will get a 1 month return policy. Make sure it is the right adaptor - it should bring up the right framelines. Deduct about 60 Euro if not Regardless of what the trader claims (good condition): What are the main indicator clues, in terms of working condition and re-sell value, when holding the m6 or the Voigtländer lense in my hands in the store ? This questions also applies for M6 bodies and lenses quality checks in general. Keywords lense: It's a lens fungus: what does it look like? spiderwebs or clouding How can I detect it? look, and smell - if the camera or the lens smell musty, avoid. Where would it be ? on the front and rear elements, possibly inside too. It would be unlikely on a lens of this vintage, however damaged interiour: detectable by eye ?. Can you feel it ? focus: aperture rings ? Can one feel the state ? should be firm, not too much play. Lens should not feel like it is falling apart body: light sensor state. Any way to see it while in the store ? no. Run a film through if possible and get it developed to look for exposure accuracy and any light leaks or problems with the film transport mechanism. You could also take along a light meter and compare readings Serial number: any clues here ? yes there are ranges available online. In general, early M6s had no anti rub inserts and have a Leitz roundel not a Leica one original packaging box & contents awailability: (is this important to maintain re-sell value ? ... in my case it is not available) Don't worry too much about that I would be very grateful if someone could refer me to an appropriate link or tell me from his experience, regarding key indicators for good or bad state of M6 bodies (classic) and lenses. The body should feel firm, the viewfinder should be clear. Try the frameline lever and make sure that the change is snappy. Press on the rangefinder cam (inside the lens throat at the top - it should spring back - follow your finger - and not get stuck. hold the camera up to the light and check the shutter for pinholes. Check the body for "Zinkfass" - corrosion of the zinc alloy that the top plate and rear door are made from - this is cosmetic but irritating. Check that the meter lights are working correctly. Check the battery compartment is clear with no sign of corrosion. Check that the shutter release is smooth and not "gritty". That's about all I can think of quickly Hope it helps! Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushmonk Posted August 17, 2011 Author Share #3 Posted August 17, 2011 Thank you for your advice Bill. Very helpful indeed ! I summarize: - ring adaptor: famelines - fungus: spiderwebs, clouding, smell - aperture: firm - lights sensor: lightmeter-check - packaging box: not too important - frameline lever: snappy change, springing back cam - shutter: check for pinholes - body: firm feel, no "Zinkfass" - meterlights: should work correctly - battery compartment: corrosion-free - shutter release: smooth, not gritty - lense: without second "e" This is already a very handy checklist to bring with me when entering the shop. If anyone can think of more, please feel free to add to this check-list. I am wondering what was meant by "anti-rub insert" and "Leitz roundel" (red trademark dot ?) Regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted August 17, 2011 Share #4 Posted August 17, 2011 :D Sorry, was being obtuse through speed of typing! "Anti rub insert" is a small plastic fillet on each side of the top plate, above the strap lug. It is there to stop rubbing from the strap, logically enough. The "roundel" I referred to is the red dot on the front of the top plate. Leica was still Leitz when the very earliest M6s came out. Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
myshkine Posted August 17, 2011 Share #5 Posted August 17, 2011 You could also check the state of vulcanite cover, no missing patches, no cuts. Also the firmness of bottom plate and its smooth opening. I also think that the packaging box and the documents would be an important plus, especially the latter. The original serial number certificate is important IMO, it adds value and I personally would not buy a Leica without its proper documentation (unless the dealer is willing to offer a substantial discount...). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted August 17, 2011 Share #6 Posted August 17, 2011 It's not vulcanite on an M6. I'd price accordingly with no documents. I'd not regard it as a problem, however. Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
spylaw4 Posted August 18, 2011 Share #7 Posted August 18, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) I think Bill has covered the essential points very well! Boxes are nice to have and certainly add to "saleability", as are documents, (they may add a small amount to value) but neither is essential - camera/lens condition is all. What has not been mentioned though it warranty. You indicated a 1 month return, is that all? You should be getting more warranty than that from a dealer - 6 months usually. Best of luck and choose well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushmonk Posted August 18, 2011 Author Share #8 Posted August 18, 2011 By the way, my quest for the M6 has led me into the realms of Stephen Gandy's website (see below) sporting an interesting checklist for the M Buyer. Although it includes much of what Bill has mentioned earlier we might add "Watching the closing edge of the second shutter curtain" and "listening to the whirling sounds of two different speed gears". (see website for detail) Furhermore, a German website (below) is stating two ways to test the range finder "Meßsucher": 1) at infinity: it should be possible to align at distant objects (evident). 2) at close range: mark a mirror with a tape. Adjust the lens at 1 m. Approach the marked position until focused in the "Meßsucher". Then focus on the mirror image of your lens. The focussing ring should now be at 2m (less evident). A long list including mirror-marks and alike might leave the dealer slightly bewildered and possibly offended ... but on the other hand, as was mentioned earlier, for a short return policy (1 month) a thorough first inspection should be the buyers right. Regarding the original packaging box and documentation, I have also contacted a renowned Leica Dealer in northern Germany (Berlin/Hamburg). To him, this makes no more than 40 Euros of a difference, which is in agreement to some comments above. Thank you all for your comments. I think I am more confident now and try to reach a less emotional but therefore more objective decision when visiting the shop today. With or without bewilderment. Cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushmonk Posted August 18, 2011 Author Share #9 Posted August 18, 2011 Leica M Buyer's Checklist Bei gebrauchter Leica M6 auf was achten? - DSLR-Forum Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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