Shootist Posted October 14, 2010 Author Share #21 Posted October 14, 2010 Advertisement (gone after registration) Based on what facts (data, documents) can you make this statement? So are you suggesting the Leica firmware in both the DL4 & 5 address the same exact camera hardware in the corresponding Panasonic models in a different way? It is my option that the only thing different between the 2 cameras firmware, LX3-DL4/LX5-DL5, is the users interface and that under the hood there is no difference. And until clearly stated differently I will stick to that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 14, 2010 Posted October 14, 2010 Hi Shootist, Take a look here Opted out of DL5-got LX5. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Ecaton Posted October 14, 2010 Share #22 Posted October 14, 2010 So are you suggesting the Leica firmware in both the DL4 & 5 address the same exact camera hardware in the corresponding Panasonic models in a different way? It is my option that the only thing different between the 2 cameras firmware, LX3-DL4/LX5-DL5, is the users interface and that under the hood there is no difference. And until clearly stated differently I will stick to that. I'm the one fully agreeing with you. My post you quote is actually challenging someone who seems to believe differently. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted October 14, 2010 Author Share #23 Posted October 14, 2010 I'm the one fully agreeing with you. My post you quote is actually challenging someone who seems to believe differently. OK Sorry for the confusion. But you know the Leica fanboys will dispute this. I love Leica but not to the point of stupidity. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guido Posted October 14, 2010 Share #24 Posted October 14, 2010 It is my option that the only thing different between the 2 cameras firmware, LX3-DL4/LX5-DL5, is the users interface and that under the hood there is no difference. Since the user interfaces are different and the firmware drives the user interface, it follows that the firmware has to be different too. Nothing special there. The vital question is whether this is simply one common firmware core with limited customizations for the two cameras, or if each company has independently developed its own firmware version based on a very small part of shared code. In the latter case, the chances for significant functional differences in areas which determine image quality would be much higher. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted October 14, 2010 Author Share #25 Posted October 14, 2010 Since the user interfaces are different and the firmware drives the user interface, it follows that the firmware has to be different too. Nothing special there. The vital question is whether this is simply one common firmware core with limited customizations for the two cameras, or if each company has independently developed its own firmware version based on a very small part of shared code. In the latter case, the chances for significant functional differences in areas which determine image quality would be much higher. Well look at Win XP. You could have the newer, cartoon type, desktop and start menu or the classic Win 2000/98 type. Nothing changed under the hood just a different user interface. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted October 15, 2010 Author Share #26 Posted October 15, 2010 Got the LX5 yesterday. Had/having a little hard time understanding the menu system Panasonic uses but after reading most of the manual I'm getting the hang of it. Images are much better then the Canon S90 it is replacing. But not up to the M8 (of course). Also got a email from Dale photo that the D-Lux5 I originally ordered and then canceled will ship out on Monday. I called and sent email about the cancellation, haven't heard anything back yet. I'm happy with my choice and the $350 savings. With the savings I upgrade Photoshop to CS5 as I never really liked Lightroom. Images to follow, when I actually have the time to take some of any worth. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bnelsch Posted October 15, 2010 Share #27 Posted October 15, 2010 Advertisement (gone after registration) I also picked up the LX5 a couple of weeks ago from Amazon for $449 (which may be why B&H lowered their price) along with the Lumix electronic viewfinder. This is the finder that is advertised with the GF1 but it also works quite nicely on the LX5. A word of caution - if you turn on the iZoom the images will not be able to be read in LR3. Bill in Denver Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted October 15, 2010 Author Share #28 Posted October 15, 2010 I also picked up the LX5 a couple of weeks ago from Amazon for $449 (which may be why B&H lowered their price) along with the Lumix electronic viewfinder. This is the finder that is advertised with the GF1 but it also works quite nicely on the LX5. A word of caution - if you turn on the iZoom the images will not be able to be read in LR3. Bill in Denver Are you using the latest version of LR? Something like 3.2. I've taken several pictures today with the iZoom on so I'll see tonight if ACR 6.20xx can read those files. Have you tried the supplied software, Silkypics, and if so do that program read the files? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjonsalt Posted October 18, 2010 Share #29 Posted October 18, 2010 My D-Lux5 should be in my hands this week. ...even Leica's head guy (Stefan Daniel) says IT IS the same camera. Could you post a link to this quote? Thanks The deal maker for me was the separate, BIGGER hand-grip, instead of the vestigial one on the Panasonic. Not a "deal maker" for me but an important consideration. From Steve Huff's review: I read that review as well. It certainly was a deciding factor for me. I can say this, although I have not used either the D-Lux5 or the LX5, I have both the C-Lux3 and the FX37 (why? that's another story). There is a build quality and firmware difference in favor of the Leica. I believe that is also a factor between the two subject cameras. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted October 18, 2010 Author Share #30 Posted October 18, 2010 This link was originally posted in the Customer forum. \ In that interview Stefan says all LX & D-lux 5's have the exact same lens, made in Japan by Panasonic, the same hardware inside the camera and go through the same quality control. The only difference is the body shape, Leica's conforming more to the Leica style, and the user interface. No mention of different JPG engines. The only other difference is that the LX saves RAW files as RW2 and the D-Lux as DNG's. I'm going to rename one of my RW2 files to DNG and see if ACR can read it. Tried that but all I have at work is CS4 which doesn't read the newer RW2 files. So even leaving the files alone or after changing the extension to DNG Bridge/CS4 and PS/CS4 couldn't read them. Using the newest DNG converter then I could see the files. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted October 19, 2010 Share #31 Posted October 19, 2010 If the processing tale was really true, why did Leica never officially confirm it? ... LFI confirmed it. According to them, all the Leica Panasonic siblings except the D-Lux 2 had different firmware from their sisters. I think the article in question appeared with the D-Lux 3, but it may have been later. Of course, that was before the LX5 and D-Lux 5. And in the video link Ed mentions (previously posted on the forum at http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/customer-forum/145256-stefan-daniel-interview-photokina-2010-a.html), Stefan Daniel says they're both identical. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPJMP Posted October 19, 2010 Share #32 Posted October 19, 2010 The LX5 and D-LUX 5 do have slightly different firmware: 1) When you turn on the D-LUX 5 the screen will show a Leica logo, not a Panasonic logo as the LX5 would. 2) The D-LUX 5 wrirtes RAW files in the DNG format, while the LX5 writes in a proprietary Panasonic format (RW2). 3) The file naming conventions are different. 4) EXIF data will be different (camera will identify it self as a D-LUX 5, not an LX5). Other than these sorts of things, though, I'd be really suprised if there was any real difference in the image processing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BB W Posted October 19, 2010 Share #33 Posted October 19, 2010 I convert my RAW2 files to DNGs in LR. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackTheRipper Posted October 20, 2010 Share #34 Posted October 20, 2010 Today is my birthday and I bought the D-lux 5! For me, even though it is more expensive it is hands down better. Leica is a great name brand, Like Mercedes, BMW, Rolex... The firmware is different, the lightroom will be awesome, the look is better, the accessories are better (the d-lux case is just sweet), and the warranty is awesome! No question about it, it's extra money well spent! I've been waiting for years to get one, I'm so excited! I even paid for next day air! :-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJP Posted October 20, 2010 Share #35 Posted October 20, 2010 Happy birthday & have fun! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecaton Posted October 20, 2010 Share #36 Posted October 20, 2010 Today is my birthday and I bought the D-lux 5! For me, even though it is more expensive it is hands down better. Leica is a great name brand, Like Mercedes, BMW, Rolex... The firmware is different, the lightroom will be awesome, the look is better, the accessories are better (the d-lux case is just sweet), and the warranty is awesome! No question about it, it's extra money well spent! I've been waiting for years to get one, I'm so excited! I even paid for next day air! :-)[/quote Happy birthday, first of all. And because it's your birthday, I don't want to spoil your anticipation to much. However, the D-Lux is nothing but a lipsticked Panasonic. You know, the pretty brunette, who pretends to be a real blonde. And all for a meanwhile 80% higher price (in the US), i.e. the Pana goes for about $450 versus $ 800 for the "would like to be Leica". Without necessary handgrip for the slippery latter, that is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted October 20, 2010 Share #37 Posted October 20, 2010 Happy birthday, first of all. And because it's your birthday, I don't want to spoil your anticipation to much. However, the D-Lux is nothing but a lipsticked Panasonic. You know, the pretty brunette, who pretends to be a real blonde. And all for a meanwhile 80% higher price (in the US), i.e. the Pana goes for about $450 versus $ 800 for the "would like to be Leica". Without necessary handgrip for the slippery latter, that is. Not everyone buys purely on the basis of cost (or even performance if it comes to that). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted October 20, 2010 Author Share #38 Posted October 20, 2010 Today is my birthday and I bought the D-lux 5! For me, even though it is more expensive it is hands down better. That just isn't true. As stated by Stefan Danial. Leica is a great name brand, Like Mercedes, BMW, Rolex... True but. If there was a car sold under a different name that only included some body mods and a different voice in the GPS system for 40% less which one would you buy. The firmware is different, the lightroom will be awesome, the look is better, the accessories are better (the d-lux case is just sweet), and the warranty is awesome! I have LR already and the upgrade is only $89. Yes the user interface of the camera is different. Image processing is the same. Extra warranty is nice. I bet the LX 5 would fit in the Leica branded case, but then who cares. No question about it, it's extra money well spent! I've been waiting for years to get one, I'm so excited! I even paid for next day air! :-) Good luck with your camera. Hope you enjoy it as much as I do the LX5. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjonsalt Posted October 20, 2010 Share #39 Posted October 20, 2010 Happy birthday, first of all. And because it's your birthday, I don't want to spoil your anticipation to much. However, the D-Lux is nothing but a lipsticked Panasonic. You know, the pretty brunette, who pretends to be a real blonde. And all for a meanwhile 80% higher price (in the US), i.e. the Pana goes for about $450 versus $ 800 for the "would like to be Leica". Without necessary handgrip for the slippery latter, that is. Your description of the DL5 is way too technical for this forum. However, your ability to discount factors important to others is to be admired. And your motive is sincere. I get my DL5 this week (please pass the lipstick). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjonsalt Posted October 20, 2010 Share #40 Posted October 20, 2010 Today is my birthday and I bought the D-lux 5! Enjoy! For me, even though it is more expensive it is hands down better. Steve Huff thinks so too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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