Jeff S Posted November 4, 2009 Share #1 Posted November 4, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Love my printer, and love Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Pearl 320gsm for my bw work. But, the printer struggles to feed the paper properly. I adjusted the platen to its widest setting, which seemed to do the trick for a while. But, recently, the paper feeds ok until it gets to the last inch or so, then gets hung up, shifts laterally a bit, and I end up with double inking on the end of my prints. Ugggh. The printer works great (using standard platen setting) with my Ilford Gold Fibre Silk, which I use primarily for color work. I've been using the top feeder for both papers. The Hahnemuhle has a different feel than the Ilford (not as slick), and comes out of the box a bit curled (not as flat as the Ilford), so I generally fold it gently to eliminate the curl before putting in the feeder. The Epson manual refers to some custom paper settings, but I thought the platen adjustment, from the LCD, would have handled any paper thickness issues. Maybe not so, or maybe something else is going on besides just paper thickness. This is the only Hahnemuhle paper I've used, so I don't know if others would have similar issues (a friend likes Photo Rag Baryta for bw work on a different printer). I want to keep using this paper if at all possible on the 3800. Oh, one more thing. A couple of times after I changed the platen to its widest setting for the Hahnemuhle, it really struggled to feed (worse than usual), only to find at end of print that the platen was still on its standard setting. I swore I changed the setting properly, but maybe not. In any case, could this have screwed up the feed mechanism? Before I call Epson technical support, does anyone have any similar feed problems with this or other papers, or any suggestions? I'm bummed. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted November 4, 2009 Posted November 4, 2009 Hi Jeff S, Take a look here Epson 3800 doesn't like my Hahnemuhle...help. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
stunsworth Posted November 4, 2009 Share #2 Posted November 4, 2009 Jeff, have you tried using the rear feed? So far the only paper I've had a problem with is Hahnemuhle Bamboo, but that's because it's not flat. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted November 4, 2009 Author Share #3 Posted November 4, 2009 Jeff, have you tried using the rear feed? So far the only paper I've had a problem with is Hahnemuhle Bamboo, but that's because it's not flat. Have used auto feeder only. Not sure on front vs back feed as alternative...the manual lists Epson papers for front feed; "thick media" for rear. For latter, I'd have to move some furniture around and get printer further from wall, which I hope to avoid. Have you used other Hahnemuhle through auto feeder without problems? Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted November 4, 2009 Share #4 Posted November 4, 2009 Have you used other Hahnemuhle through auto feeder without problems? I'm afraid not. Rather like you I wouldn't find using the rear feeder convenient. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
zonevt Posted November 4, 2009 Share #5 Posted November 4, 2009 I am using the Epson 3800 with Han Photo Rag Bright White 310 gsm in 8.5x11 to 17x22 inch sheets. I have tried both the top auto feeder and back manual but find the auto top the best. I do have to help the paper get started by holding at the top corners and applying slight pressure as feeding. I also use this paper with the Epson 4000 and it also needs a little help when manual feeding. I think these thicker art papers are at the limit for these Epson printers and you need to live with the inconvenience of having to guide the paper feeding a little. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted November 4, 2009 Author Share #6 Posted November 4, 2009 I am using the Epson 3800 with Han Photo Rag Bright White 310 gsm in 8.5x11 to 17x22 inch sheets. I have tried both the top auto feeder and back manual but find the auto top the best. I do have to help the paper get started by holding at the top corners and applying slight pressure as feeding. I also use this paper with the Epson 4000 and it also needs a little help when manual feeding. I think these thicker art papers are at the limit for these Epson printers and you need to live with the inconvenience of having to guide the paper feeding a little. Thanks, I appreciate the feedback, but my situation seems different. There's no problem getting paper started or feeding through until the paper is well into the printer, but then it goes nuts in the last inch or so before releasing. Think I'll call Epson. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
delander † Posted November 4, 2009 Share #7 Posted November 4, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Jeff, for what it is worth I'm using Epson traditional photo paper at A3+ which is 330gsm using the rear feeder, without problems. The platen gap is on auto. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
delander † Posted November 4, 2009 Share #8 Posted November 4, 2009 By the way the distance between the top edge of the rear feeder and the wall in my case is 11cm. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted November 4, 2009 Author Share #9 Posted November 4, 2009 Jeff, for what it is worth I'm using Epson traditional photo paper at A3+ which is 330gsm using the rear feeder, without problems. The platen gap is on auto. Jeff Thanks, Jeff. Before you posted this, I called Epson technical support and they suggested rear feeder. So, after hiding it away, I attached it and was surprised how little space it consumed. Now the next problem. Every time I went to print with it, printer message showed paper loading error. Call #2 to Epson. He had me change page setup setting in LR (using my Mac Pro) to A4, manual rear feed. But, when I tried it (after hanging up phone, naturally), same error message. I've got a call into my computer whiz friend. Meanwhile, any other suggestions welcome. Sometimes (not often), I miss my darkroom. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
delander † Posted November 4, 2009 Share #10 Posted November 4, 2009 When using the rear feeder you have to make sure the paper goes right down into the machine, give it a little help and then the machine will take over and come up with a ready indication. Also dont make the paper guide too tight. it does not like it. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted November 4, 2009 Author Share #11 Posted November 4, 2009 When using the rear feeder you have to make sure the paper goes right down into the machine, give it a little help and then the machine will take over and come up with a ready indication. Also dont make the paper guide too tight. it does not like it. Jeff Yeah, I guided it in as far as it would go, but instead of saying ready, it said paper error. I'll try moving paper guide more...didn't try that. But I did put paper right up against right hand side of feeder, and paper guided easily into machine where white rollers appear. Can't imagine I didn't attach feeder correctly...seems pretty straightforward. I'm still thinking it's a communication error with my computer for some reason. Do you by any chance use Mac/LR configuration? Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoppyman Posted November 4, 2009 Share #12 Posted November 4, 2009 Jeff, although thicker papers CAN feed via the auto position, the rear feed is recommended. It can be fiddly to start the paper straight as you noted. Be careful to just push gently and symmetrically on the top edge of the paper just until the paper is engaged. This helps reduce skewing. Sometimes you just have to hold your tongue right for the stars to align. The lateral shift you are describing for the last inch of travel means that you are getting contact with the print heads on the edge of the paper after it is no longer supported fully on the way through. You may note ink marks on the paper edge at that point. Dependant on the severity of the head strike this can even damage your printer. Factors that influence this problem are: Paper curl, often caused by humidity. Some papers are more prone than others. The fix there is to make a real effort to reverse curl the corners with gloved fingers just prior to insertion. Really flex paper in reverse curl EVERY time you insert. Platen gap set. Do not assume that a wider setting will be kept between print sessions. (I use 'wider' for that particular excellent paper) Margin set for the print. In my experience small borders are the most prone to this problem. With a generous border (e.g. 50mm) you are not printing obviously for the last and most vulnerable unsupported part of the paper path. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted November 5, 2009 Author Share #13 Posted November 5, 2009 Jeff, although thicker papers CAN feed via the auto position, the rear feed is recommended. It can be fiddly to start the paper straight as you noted. Be careful to just push gently and symmetrically on the top edge of the paper just until the paper is engaged. This helps reduce skewing. Sometimes you just have to hold your tongue right for the stars to align. The lateral shift you are describing for the last inch of travel means that you are getting contact with the print heads on the edge of the paper after it is no longer supported fully on the way through. You may note ink marks on the paper edge at that point. Dependant on the severity of the head strike this can even damage your printer. Factors that influence this problem are: Paper curl, often caused by humidity. Some papers are more prone than others. The fix there is to make a real effort to reverse curl the corners with gloved fingers just prior to insertion. Really flex paper in reverse curl EVERY time you insert. Platen gap set. Do not assume that a wider setting will be kept between print sessions. (I use 'wider' for that particular excellent paper) Margin set for the print. In my experience small borders are the most prone to this problem. With a generous border (e.g. 50mm) you are not printing obviously for the last and most vulnerable unsupported part of the paper path. I'm beginning to think that I should restrict this thread only to those named Jeff, or Geoff. Thanks much for your feedback. I have been flexing the paper each and every time, and setting the platen gap each time (although, as noted, once or twice it seemed to change back to standard as it printed). I hope I didn't damage anything. My Ilford still prints fine through auto feeder. Are you saying that you use auto feeder for this same paper? I did successfully for 4 or 5 months, but now having more trouble. I'd actually prefer using rear feed if that's what it's there for, and to avoid damage. And, the tech rep said I shouldn't need to change the platen gap with the rear feed since it's designed for thicker paper. If you don't get rear feed just right, do you get paper load/error message? Or, does it just not do or indicate anything until just right. No matter what I do, the error message appears before I have a chance to realign anything, even carefully. The Epson tech said it was due to my page setup, i.e., not set to rear feed. I expected everything to work well once I changed that. But, same result. I'll keep trying...but very frustrating, especially since this is my go-to paper for bw. Do other Hahnemuhle papers have this same finicky nature? Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted November 5, 2009 Author Share #14 Posted November 5, 2009 Sometimes you just have to hold your tongue right for the stars to align. Never truer words. The stars finally aligned for me. Takes getting used to, and requires more steps and patience than before, but at least I can use my favorite bw paper without print problems. Yeah! Thanks to you and others for all the help. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoppyman Posted November 5, 2009 Share #15 Posted November 5, 2009 Jeff, while I have had some thicker papers feed from the auto position I don't know if it is as reliable or the paer paper as straight as from the rear. Whatever works! GTG, exciting news happening locally:D Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adan Posted November 5, 2009 Share #16 Posted November 5, 2009 One point on setting the platen position controls in the Epson print dialogue - you must SAVE or SAVE AS that printer setting as a new "preset" before going forward with the print job, or the new setting reverts to whatever it was before once the print job is done. BTW, same for all the other settings in the Epson print dialogue. Any change to the defaults is a one-shot unless saved as a new "preset". I use "widest" platen setting for all my papers, just because I've gotten occasional scuff marks and subsequent ink drool with "Auto" or "Normal" even with Epson's own Premium Luster paper. I think Auto or Normal are tuned for Epson's Archival Matte (or whatever their current name for it is) - which is a thinner paper compared to any of the Luster/Gloss/Fiber gloss/Baryta photo papers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted November 5, 2009 Author Share #17 Posted November 5, 2009 One point on setting the platen position controls in the Epson print dialogue - you must SAVE or SAVE AS that printer setting as a new "preset" before going forward with the print job, or the new setting reverts to whatever it was before once the print job is done. BTW, same for all the other settings in the Epson print dialogue. Any change to the defaults is a one-shot unless saved as a new "preset". . Yes, thanks, Andy...I do this each time for reasons you state. But, I swear, once...or twice..I set to widest and I could hear that print was struggling through, and sure enough, platen was still on standard. Strange. I double check it every time now. Just curious, have you (or others) ever used front loader for thicker paper (not for non-paper media)? I explained to my local shop rep that I was now able to use rear feeder for the thicker papers if necessary, and told him that it sure was finicky to get paper precisely straight before it would feed. He recommended using front feeder, which he said is easier. I'd try it and see, but it would require moving furniture and printer away from wall to allow print to clear. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
M_Driscoll Posted November 6, 2009 Share #18 Posted November 6, 2009 Yes, thanks, Andy...I do this each time for reasons you state. But, I swear, once...or twice..I set to widest and I could hear that print was struggling through, and sure enough, platen was still on standard. Strange. I double check it every time now. Just curious, have you (or others) ever used front loader for thicker paper (not for non-paper media)? I explained to my local shop rep that I was now able to use rear feeder for the thicker papers if necessary, and told him that it sure was finicky to get paper precisely straight before it would feed. He recommended using front feeder, which he said is easier. I'd try it and see, but it would require moving furniture and printer away from wall to allow print to clear. Jeff I've always used the front manual feeder for thicker papers (i.e. Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Pearl 320gsm). My 3800 is about 8" from the back wall. No problem; 13 x 19 just bends up initially. Never used the rear feeder. Cheers. Zenfolio | Matt Driscoll Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
orni100 Posted November 6, 2009 Share #19 Posted November 6, 2009 Love my printer, and love Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Pearl 320gsm for my bw work. But, the printer struggles to feed the paper properly. I adjusted the platen to its widest setting, which seemed to do the trick for a while. But, recently, the paper feeds ok until it gets to the last inch or so, then gets hung up, shifts laterally a bit, and I end up with double inking on the end of my prints. Ugggh. The printer works great (using standard platen setting) with my Ilford Gold Fibre Silk, which I use primarily for color work. I've been using the top feeder for both papers. The Hahnemuhle has a different feel than the Ilford (not as slick), and comes out of the box a bit curled (not as flat as the Ilford), so I generally fold it gently to eliminate the curl before putting in the feeder. The Epson manual refers to some custom paper settings, but I thought the platen adjustment, from the LCD, would have handled any paper thickness issues. Maybe not so, or maybe something else is going on besides just paper thickness. This is the only Hahnemuhle paper I've used, so I don't know if others would have similar issues (a friend likes Photo Rag Baryta for bw work on a different printer). I want to keep using this paper if at all possible on the 3800. Oh, one more thing. A couple of times after I changed the platen to its widest setting for the Hahnemuhle, it really struggled to feed (worse than usual), only to find at end of print that the platen was still on its standard setting. I swore I changed the setting properly, but maybe not. In any case, could this have screwed up the feed mechanism? Before I call Epson technical support, does anyone have any similar feed problems with this or other papers, or any suggestions? I'm bummed. Jeff Hello Jeff, I use exactly the same paper but on R2880 - but experiencing exactly the same problem you describe here with A4 paper size. Very annoying the whole thing, as I love this paper. Then I tried the same paper A3 -all on auto feed- and everything works just fine. Instead of fiddeling around and trying to find the problemsource with the A4, I am a lazy guy and use A3 from now on exclusively. But funny enough to find somebody with the same problem (only the last inches) and the same paper choice. Regards Dieter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted November 6, 2009 Author Share #20 Posted November 6, 2009 Matt and Dieter...thanks to both of you. At times this forum can be a wonderful and amazing place to get almost instant feedback, from anywhere in the world, on identical issues and solutions. Now, I've been struggling with how to earn a quick $100k today, without much effort or negative consequence...any thoughts out there? Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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