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Help with scanning


bluedubbed

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I haven't shot much color film lately, mostly b+w. I decided to try shooting color again for various reasons. In the past, I've had no problem scanning b+w negatives (IR, T-max, Tri-x) and usually get good results. The last 5 or so rolls of color film that I've shot have been pretty disappointing. I've been using Kodak NC and VC 160. All the shots below were taken with a M6TTL with 35mm Summicron.

 

I have a Nikon Coolscan 5000 and have been using the Nikon software. I have demoed Vuescan with similar results. My scan look really disappointing (see below). I've played with all the settings and still can't quite get the results I'd like. The first problem is that most of the scans look really grainy, especially at full resolution. The second problem is that the color doesn't look quite right. It could be that my metering is off, but I'm not sure why they look so grainy, especially for 160 film on a bright sunny day. My basic scan setting are 3000dpi, 8bit, 2x scan. I've tried 16bit, and it doesn't seem to help.

 

Sorry if the photos below are a bit big, but any smaller and it's hard to see details.

 

The first photo is digital (a little 10mp point and shoot camera) and the rest are Kodak VC160. The second is a scan with no alterations except digital ICE. The third is an unaltered scan and the forth has some alterations like the digital GEM, etc. The fifth is an unaltered scan (one of the few) that actually represents the normal/natural color range I'd expect.

 

Maybe it's partly my poor photography skills, but I still think I'm missing something in the scanning process. It could also be that I've gotten so accustomed to digital images.

 

Any help/feedback/criticism would be greatly appreciated. I love shooting film, so making nice scans is a top priority.

 

Thanks!

 

MJ

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Well, scanning negative film is an art. And can get very frustrating. Negative film *is* indeed grainy when compared to a digital file. You can lower the harshness of the grain (or the scanner noise) by increasing the number of Samples you scan. Vuescan and Nikonscan should be able to do this. Colorwise, your shots aren't bad. But they are very contrasty, so that you have no or very little headroom to post-process them. And there are tonal Gaps in the Sky. I would scan them with the highest available resolution at 15 bits (important for Post-Processing!) in Vuescan with the "advanced workflow"-method: Scan the Film base (it's described in Vuescans Manual how to do this), select "Kodak Portra" or "Kodak Gold" or "Kodak Vericolor III" under "Film type" to achieve a natural looking image without too much contrast, select "Auto-Levels" under white-balance or set the Grey Point manually by right-clicking on a neutral grey spot on the image. That should give you a good starting point. For Post-Processing Negative-Scans, I would use Lightroom. It's much more intuitive for that purpose than Photoshop. And: Avoid any noise-reduction in Vuescan or Nikonscan. If you really want, you could add a little color-noise-reduction in Lightroom, but be careful with that: The Pictures quick get an unnatural look. Film has grain. That is what we love it for, right? ;-)

 

Here's an example of scanned Portra 160NC, done with the Nikon Coolscan 9000, Vuescan (with the above method) and Lightroom.

Good Luck!

Peter

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I'd use nikonscan set at 16 bits. I also just use one pass scanning with Digital ICE. Nothing else.

 

Color negative gets more grainy as it gets underexposed, which could be a problem. You're also probably better off scanning at 4000dpi and downsampling instead of scanning at a lower resolution. Scanning at a lower resolution can emphasize grain through grain aliasing.

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Hi MJ,

I am surprised at seeing what gives Coolscan, marks who stopped any manufacture of scanners except last 9000.

Here is what I get with much less expensive Epson V750

24 bits colour -scan in 4800 dpi - Tiff and posted in Jpeg here.

R4S - Fuji film Superia 100 Iso

Picture uncorrected

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The better the scanner, the more grain you will see.

 

Wet scanning lessens the grain.

 

Some recent configurations of Portra and Fuji 160S are made for scanning and thay scan considerably better. I was shocked when I saw the first few rolls.

 

There is a program called true grain I THINK that will not kill detail like normal noise reduction. Normal noise reduction programs work on digi files better than film.

 

In photoshop, you may also mask the edges/outlines, and apply grain reduction.

 

You can also select the sky and use the median or average filter.

 

Noise reduction or agerage can be applied can be applied the RGB channels separately.

 

Imagenomic - Imagination at Shutter Speed

 

not True Grain, but Grain Surgery

 

If you run a Google Search, you will find many suggestions, most of which involve edge masking or Channels.

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My Suggestion: Forget Noise-Reduction. The Pictures will always look unnatural. Live with the Grain, enjoy it! If you scan at the highest available resolution, use 8x or 16x Multisampling and do not underexpose the film, the grain will look charming instead of disturbing. Getting the right color is much more difficult.

Peter

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Any help/feedback/criticism would be greatly appreciated. I love shooting film, so making nice scans is a top priority.

 

Thanks!

 

MJ

 

Does SilverFast work with the Nikon scanner? I use a MicroTek ArtixScan 1800F and I've been using SilverFast for quite a while. I recently downloaded the tutorial on the use of Adobe Camera Raw from Luminous Landscapes (highly recommended), and Geoff and Michael demonstrated how to scan to get the best results. They created a TIFF that can be tweaked using the comprehensive tools in both SilverFast and then in ACR to get the final detail out.

 

Nick

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You can buy a version of silverfast for the Nikon scanners.

 

I've tried the camera raw thing on scans. It does work. It works pretty fast. I still prefer to work in Photoshop though. I can do far more in Photoshop to a scan, and can also be more subtle too. Dust busting is obviously easier with the healing brush. Sharpening is much more powerful in Photoshop - multipass sharpening and through the use of masking layers. And you can do some wonderful stuff to the color in LAB. Just my take on things.

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