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M8 evolution to M9 or M8.3 - Wish List


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I was informed via PM that Frank most likely is a Troll that has been kicked off the forum before and went by the name of Helios . Does anyone else have evidence to substantiate this claim? I have no reason to believe this but if it were remotely true, he would be the hardest working troll that I ever came across and it still wouldn't justify the attacks

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...but if it were remotely true, he would be the hardest working troll that I ever came across and it still wouldn't justify the attacks

 

You never had any dealings with Helios, there is no comparison between the two. For what it's worth I don't think Frank is Helios, but there are times when I wonder if Frank is Frank.

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Jaaps first comment were to the point and polite written. The internet bullies stuck their head up later in the thread.

 

I'm no internet bully and I'm not sure if you were referring to me at all but most of Franks posts are so long, pedantic, verbose that I just couldn't get through them.

They left me wondering does anyone ever really listen to him or read his memos at his place of employment.

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They sent you the one that worked? Lucky boy <grin>.

 

It worked well for a decade. Then it spent a decade on the attic. After that the shutter started to be unreliable. Anyway, for me it was a great camera for learning how to take pictures, and it was all I could afford at that time.

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I was informed via PM that Frank most likely is a Troll that has been kicked off the forum before and went by the name of Helios . Does anyone else have evidence to substantiate this claim? I have no reason to believe this but if it were remotely true, he would be the hardest working troll that I ever came across and it still wouldn't justify the attacks

 

I have no idea, but just for kicks, you might want to search back to some of Frank's first posts here...you can't miss them; went on for days about his being a CEO, etc. In those threads, the exchange got so bizarre that similar accusations (his being a troll and/or imposter) were made about him and discussed in his own threads.

 

The only thing that surprises me is why some of the "veterans" on the forum, if indeed they believe this, continue to read his threads and often are the first to offer polite and helpful advice.

 

Jeff

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It worked well for a decade. Then it spent a decade on the attic. After that the shutter started to be unreliable. Anyway, for me it was a great camera for learning how to take pictures, and it was all I could afford at that time.

 

:D:D I had one too. (Same reasons.) I'll bet that anyone who complains about the M8 shutter sound never heard a Zenit-E in action. :D

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My apologies to all. But here are my own selfish and possibly shortsighted comments on Frank's list. Item by item. Sorry.

 

>O rings for water and dust sealing : Could be of use, but what about old lenses?

> EVF : This would have to be of truly outstanding quality. And would change the game entirely.

> Live view : That is an EVF, right?

> Saphire scratch proof rear screen cover (like M8.2) as standard: Could be expensive and I do not want to pay for it.

> Access to memory card without removing base plate: What about the battery? It goes first.

> S2 graphics chip circuitry: Why S2? Whatever works well is fine with me.

> Full frame sensor ....and much discussion about the spec. of this sensor: Could be nice for wider views. If it can be done well.

> Higher ISO numbers: Probably

> Provision for Autofocus lenses to be introduced later: Doubt it

> Provision for Lens data to be fed back to the viewfinder (aperture selected): Whatever for?

> Flash metering....some feedback was given for improvements as I remember.: ???

> Button for storing exposure reading : It is on the top right of the M8

> Larger Viewfinder : Might increase the size of the camera.

> Improvements to frame line accuracy in Viewfinder: Good idea

> reduce camera size to M7 using latest smaller size electronics: I would welcome this

> Fit a socket for sensor...... to facilitate replacement: Leave this to Leica, eh . .

> Reduce 2 circuit boards to one for easier assembly and repair.: See above

> Cover glass for sensor should be with an IR filter if now this is technically feasible (previously not possible 3 years ago): I do not care. Filters work fine.

:):mad:

Edited by george +
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A bit late for a wish list, but here are some of mine:

 

likely:

- FF

- 16-20MP

- no IR problems

- silent shutter from M8.2

- accurate framelines from M8.2

- ISO 80-2500 or 100-3200, with all being 1-2 stops better than now

 

possible:

- high-res screen

- menu system from S2

- add flash socket back

- more accurate, consistent rangefinder

 

unlikely:

- smaller, thinner body (like M6)

- B&W workflow mode, only DNG

- direct ISO setting

- bracketing up to 5 shots, up to +/-2 EXP, for HDR lovers

- at least an attempt at weather sealing

- better viewfinder with larger opening

- sensor cleaning

- the ability to use my 50 Cron DR

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Jaapv if the above are in error and are not requirements please let me know. If I have missed others or if a consolidated list of what was asked for is still in existance again I would like to see it.

 

I am not interested in comparing the wish list today against what is rumoured to be announced shortly. I do think it will be interesting to see if Leica have taken note of any feedback given here when the beast is eventually released in September as rumoured.

 

 

 

"Requirements" Frank? If you have special requirements then I suggest you contact Leica directly. But I think you'll find that working photographers have a totally different set of requirements. Those who I have met who were actually asked by Leica what they thought of a particular feature were polite enough to suggest that they either did or did not like it, for whatever reason. NONE, however, was so presumptuous to suggest, even in the politest of terms let alone the language you use, that Leica must introduce a particular feature in order to stay in business. But I guess that's the difference between a photographer and a CEO.

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Guest BigSplash
"Requirements" Frank? If you have special requirements then I suggest you contact Leica directly. But I think you'll find that working photographers have a totally different set of requirements. Those who I have met who were actually asked by Leica what they thought of a particular feature were polite enough to suggest that they either did or did not like it, for whatever reason. NONE, however, was so presumptuous to suggest, even in the politest of terms let alone the language you use, that Leica must introduce a particular feature in order to stay in business. But I guess that's the difference between a photographer and a CEO.

 

I am sure that you are correct. If Leica are asking professional photographers for feedback and I am aware that they are doing this then this will drive a certain type of camera design. Apparently the S2 was developed in this way, and this looks as a business far from certain given the prices. .

 

Totally separately I would argue that there are "serious business implications " for a business that is now losing money each year. I am very focussed on this as this is where my experience is and I hope Leica executives who apparently read the forum get some feedback that is constructive for them. Many companies pay money to obtain client feedback, and have a continuous improvement program in place. Leica is as you say asking some professionals, and my dealer tells me that they are not good at listening to even their own dealers..

 

Leica has had a difficult business history since a very long time selling to a market that is mainly to amateur photographers...and is certainly not exclusively a supplier to professionals. I am told that many CEO's., celebrities and professionals ranging from dentists to lawyers are the main core clients of Leica today and historically. I wonder if Leica is doing a good job to meet their careabouts and judging from comments in this forum several people agree with me.

 

I very much want Leica to succeed and grow to the 250M€uro annual revenue figure that Dr Kaufmann says he needs to sustain present R&D levels....against last year's 135M €uros that is a steep hill to climb, but I actually believe that it is achievable. My business experience suggests that:

> Levering your existing strengths (M system) is the way to go

> Reduce costs of manufacture and scale the business (ie go for volume)......Experts in this forum say that skilled technicians build a Leica like a Formula One car and that this is good! Skilled technicians take years to gain their expertise....and this is good?

> Dominate a niche (rangefinders...I am told Leica have 95% mkt share) and widen the niche ...so I ask why S2 and Pradovit? ....

 

I strongly suggest that Leica should widen the appeal of the M series with a low cost M8 and a upmarket M9 and an M10 with enough sex appeal to woo people from their DSLR .

 

I think Leica should build a system offering around the M body with the appropriate accessories and yes an item that does the Visoflex functionality but uses modern technology would be high on my list. I also believe a M10 body should be ready for Leica to introduce Auto focus lenses in the future........would that not be something that would erode DSLR market share?

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Has anyone seen specs for the M10? I heard it will be full frame and out in 2010. The M9 is just going to have a few upgrades on the M8. I heard this from a friend of mine who works for Phase One.

 

Daniel

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