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My new defective APO Summicron 75 ASPH...still not up to Leica standards!


Valkyrie
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Many of you may have seen my earlier post on the defective 75 ASPH I received new from B&H two weeks ago. Its replacement arrived today and incredibly has the same defect!:eek: For those who care about such things and for the benefit of the Leica QC folks, I have attached photos showing the serial numbers of the defective lenses. Apparently this is not an isolated QC failure. I wonder how many more are out there? This one's going back for a cash refund; B&H handled the first return without any questions but I have lost all confidence that their current inventory has any good Leica 75mm lenses. To all of you who contributed to my earlier post, thank you; I found the discussion very informative. Mike

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Those two serial numbers just 41 apart. Perhaps produced in the same batch? Completely incomprehensible how this can have occurred. Since Stefan Daniel personally apologised and offered to make this right in the first instance, may I recommend that you contact him directly now? We can be very sure that he will want to know personally rather than relying on the forum post being noticed.

 

There is not only the issue of how you can have received two new lenses with identical faults but also the inventory of a high profile seller is polluted (not to mention that of Leica).

Leica ought to be able to tell you the source of your lens batch too, should they prove to be stock from a particular location and/or date (grey market for example)?

Also since you have elected to publish the problems here, will you please keep us posted on the final resolution?

Good luck getting this sorted out rapidly. It is a superb lens design.

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This kind of thing is exactly why materials for medical use are required to have lot numbers. A manufacturer needs to be able to do a fast trackback and recall a whole lot from the market. I'm sure "something" happened in the production process in Solms and that there will be e-mails flying to distributors and dealers to check the stock.

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OK, I have to admit, you made me double-check my 75/2.0. I'm all straight with the world, but my lens is from the 398xxxx batch.

 

Definitely contact the Leica product line manager on this one.

 

Eric

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Manfred, do you have this lens? The example I own produces stunning results.Can you quote production figures or error rates in the production?

Stefan Daniel has already personally apologised without a report to Leica, just a post here that he was made aware of. He offered to make this right, following the first described incident.

What is the connection to the S2 which is not even in serial production as yet?

 

Revolutionizing the pro market (S2) with that kind of performance will be interesting to watch, indeed.
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I have had my Mercedes E series called in 2 or 3 times for modifications due to errors which became apparant over time (mostly brake problems). This is understandable I guess, but each Leica lens is supposedly individually inspected before it leaves the factory. How this could happen to several lenses is unbelievable unless they employ someone with a serious eye defect or something.

 

I have a theory, though. In the latest issue of the German car magazine Auto Motor und Sport, a BMW 3 Series was given to various BMW garages for routine service inspection with 10 built in defects. All of these defects were on the service manual and as such must be spotted by the mechanic if the service one pays for is indeed carried out. In this survey about half the garages did not spot a single of the 10 defects, yet they were crossed out on the service sheet and certified to have been checked and found in order.

 

The cars had of course not been examined at all by any mechanic, save a quick oil change, but of course a full service was invoiced.

 

A defect as you report with your lens, cannot go unnoticed if the lens is indeed inspected.

Edited by Ivar B
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Unbelievable, but Mike don't give up on the lens. As Geoff says it is incredible. I had an instant replacement for mine when I bought it, different problem but there was a batch with the same issue at my time of purchase. I would bet that Leica do in fact track batch info (Jaap's lot numbers) as they seem to manufacture in batches. If you buy one somewhere else make sure the dealer inspects the lens before it is shipped...

 

 

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Manfred, do you have this lens? The example I own produces stunning results.Can you quote production figures or error rates in the production?

Stefan Daniel has already personally apologised without a report to Leica, just a post here that he was made aware of. He offered to make this right, following the first described incident.

What is the connection to the S2 which is not even in serial production as yet?

 

Yes, Geoff, I do have this lens and love it for its exceptional image quality. However, I have also had a very generous share of incredible examples of non-existant quality control at Leica: completely out of focus LEDs in the viewfinder of my first M8, several body returns, one body exchange, screws dropping out of brand new lenses when removing the rear lens cap for the first time, countless firmware glitches, camera freezes, and so on.

 

Once the Leica gear works, the image quality is breathtaking and it's a joy to use. But until it does there may be endless quality issues and return trips to Solms.

 

Now, I as an amateur can afford to put up with all this unprofessional nonsense because I don't have to make a living with my Leica gear. But if I was a professional who gives up part of his professional gear in order to replace it with fresh S2 equipment I certainly would have second thoughts.

 

Do you see the connection now?

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Manfred, I saw the connection that you were implying and was aware from the tone of your posts that you were personally unhappy with Leica. I disagee with your implication regarding the S2 when it is not even in serial production as yet, so there is no data at all to comment on its quality control, only personal opinion and attitude. Similarly with the M8, production figures and return rates are not public knowledge. I think I read here somewhere that production was in the order of 1000 a month? That is a quite incredible litany of problems that you are describing. You are not describing the typical or common experience of those 10,000+ owners every year else we would see literally thousands of such reports here. This user has never had any problems and in fact received superb service when recently visiting. No harm in my reporting that positive experience.

Yes, Geoff, I do have this lens and love it for its exceptional image quality. However, I have also had a very generous share of incredible examples of non-existant quality control at Leica: completely out of focus LEDs in the viewfinder of my first M8, several body returns, one body exchange, screws dropping out of brand new lenses when removing the rear lens cap for the first time, countless firmware glitches, camera freezes, and so on.

 

Once the Leica gear works, the image quality is breathtaking and it's a joy to use. But until it does there may be endless quality issues and return trips to Solms.

 

Now, I as an amateur can afford to put up with all this unprofessional nonsense because I don't have to make a living with my Leica gear. But if I was a professional who gives up part of his professional gear in order to replace it with fresh S2 equipment I certainly would have second thoughts.

 

Do you see the connection now?

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Good grief. Leica apparently has some serious quality problems. In March I bought an SF 24D flash that was defective right out of the box, and then in May I received a defective UV/IR filter for my 18mm Super-Elmar-M lens. I keep trying to convince myself that these are isolated incidents and Leica quality is still superior to other camera makers, but I am beginning to wonder. :(

 

Rocky

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I believe neither the SF24D nor the filter are actually manufactured by Leica but just rebranded products. The problems you experienced have no bearing on the current discussion.

If I were to guess the problem, I would look for inadequate training of a new employee who did not learn how the lens should be correctly assembled. It is my experience performing Root Cause investigations that it rarely is neglect by the employee that causes the problem. Of course everyone always blames the employee first and most of the time these problems are not fixed and actually made worse by sanctions against the employee, when the real problem is somewhere in management,-Dick

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I think a Leica quality issue is a problem regardless of whether the defective items come directly from Leica or from a vendor. A good quality program includes vendor quality as well.

 

I agree that many (most?) quality problems stem from poor training, which is an indication of the lack of committment by management.

 

Rocky

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