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In the hope that Leica look at this forum, I'd like to make a plea for a more ergonomic Leica M. I know, shock-horror change the shape!

 

Yes, change the shape. It doesn't have to be radical - please; no R8 departure! Just a little-more fitting to the hand. Leica have already acknowledged that hand-held photography could be improved by the introduction of the M-grip: a more-ugly piece of engineering I have yet to see.

 

Best wishes,

 

Mike.

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In the hope that Leica look at this forum, I'd like to make a plea for a more ergonomic Leica M. I know, shock-horror change the shape!

 

Maybe it would be a runaway success for Leica, just like the M5.

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In the hope that Leica look at this forum, I'd like to make a plea for a more ergonomic Leica M. I know, shock-horror change the shape!

 

Yes, change the shape. It doesn't have to be radical - please; no R8 departure! Just a little-more fitting to the hand. Leica have already acknowledged that hand-held photography could be improved by the introduction of the M-grip: a more-ugly piece of engineering I have yet to see.

 

Best wishes,

 

Mike.

 

So you'd prefer function over form? Keep in mind the basic shape is dictated by the rangefinder, the film cassette and the take-up spool. Plus you need a removable base plate to access the film. Or are you referring to a digital M?

Edited by AlanG
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Changing the M shape, EKKKKK part of the appeal is the shape, size and simple buttons just plain ease of use.

Jan

 

+1, please no change in shape and don't take the base plate away. If I want grip, I find a way to get it.

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I'm in favor of changing the shape, just not any thicker. Thinner and more grip-able would be more user friendly.

 

However, there's a lot of "No change" Leica-customers (you know the flexible type you find at work), so it'll be a difficult sell if Leica departs radically from the existing shape.

 

Best Rob

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So you'd prefer function over form? Keep in mind the basic shape is dictated by the rangefinder, the film cassette and the take-up spool. Plus you need a removable base plate to access the film. Or are you referring to a digital M?

 

I posted this in the hope that Leica actually read this forum. Tiresome, perhaps, but if enough people write Leica may feel more able to act.

 

Would I prefer function over form? Well, simplistically, yes! By this I mean that although I love the Leica M I do believe that it could be improved without making it into something else and this can be done with regard to the ergonomics. A simple bump on the front and somewhere to place your thumb on the rear would help the hand-holding abilities of the Camera. This does not have to interfere with the baseplate for film Ms but please, ditch the baseplate for digital Ms! A simple hatch to card and battery is much easier to use.

 

Nothing too radical here folks.

 

 

Mike.

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Thanks for posting this Mike, well knowing you would get the heat for it :D

 

If one look over the many odd additions to the Leica M cameras people and third party companies have added (and which often leave you with the impression that an overwhelming number of Leica M users might be lame and blind), Leica should take notice and see how they could design and produce some fitting pieces as a la carte, limited editions, add-ons, refitted, done-at-the-factory-updates or so.

 

A integrated handgrip, left-eye cameras, thumb-supporter, etc, etc,

 

The M rewinder is a good example of a stylish, classic designed add-on that fits the camera and does the work.

 

More of that, please. Many M users struggle to find extra Leica gear to buy why they buy two of each camera and/or several colors. So of course there's a market for special-fitted cameras if the product is there.

 

You're on the right track, Mike. The first fool to suggested the Earth was round was also ridiculed :P

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Thanks for posting this Mike, well knowing you would get the heat for it :D

 

If one look over the many odd additions to the Leica M cameras people and third party companies have added (and which often leave you with the impression that an overwhelming number of Leica M users might be lame and blind), Leica should take notice and see how they could design and produce some fitting pieces as a la carte, limited editions, add-ons, refitted, done-at-the-factory-updates or so.

 

A integrated handgrip, left-eye cameras, thumb-supporter, etc, etc,

 

The M rewinder is a good example of a stylish, classic designed add-on that fits the camera and does the work.

 

More of that, please. Many M users struggle to find extra Leica gear to buy why they buy two of each camera and/or several colors. So of course there's a market for special-fitted cameras if the product is there.

 

You're on the right track, Mike. The first fool to suggested the Earth was round was also ridiculed :P

 

Good idea about a la carte !! In this way, Leica could offer modifications to the original design and see what actually sells without running the risk of amending the M into something that users do not want. I know that some will cite design and production costs as a barrier to this method but Leica probably produce such items already as a part of R&D.

 

Thanks,

 

Mike.

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.... change the shape. It doesn't have to be radical.....

 

Mike - You won't get far with your discussion here, partly because it has been flogged before, and partly because like minded people to your views have, I suspect, given Leica a wide berth. There are many things about the Leica which I think represents lousy design, the shape being one, and the ludicrous 'grip' being an exemplary example. My own view is that the camera as a platform for good, even great lenses, is in need of a long overdue radical redesign; which many on this forum would campaign to prevent. They'd be wrong of course, but the chances are that Leica would listen to the same core Legacyistas who have held the company's progress back on other occasions.

 

For sanity's sake; learn to live with the camera's woes, and concentrate on the surviving positive attributes. If you have family feel happy for them because in 50 years time Leica will have an 'M' body fit for the 21 century.

 

I'll get my coat ......................

 

............ Chris

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Is there something wrong with my hands? I've no trouble gripping M Leica's. Not an M2, M7 or M8. I don't grips or thumb thingies. I use the skin that came on the camera. The left hand is always under the lens anyway. The only thing I use that is not Leica is the neck strap. I use a Nikon strap that doesn't have those plastic clips that would spell disaster if the broke.

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A large part of the appeal is the size and simplicity, so those I wouldn't change. But subtle changes to the shape could improve functionality. The original shape was dictated by the transport of film, but that is now long passed. With the digital M, there were in fact changes to the shape: the loss of the film advance and film rewind, the slight additional thickness of the body, the introduction of buttons and an LCD on the rear -- these essential changes obviously haven't killed off the popularity of the M. So there is good precedent for changes that make functional sense. The removable baseplate, on the other hand, is a strange holdover from the film era without a functional justification in the digital era, and it impedes functionality when compared with simpler solutions. The baseplate adds operational complexity rather than simplicity and is thus contrary to the digital M's nature. :D

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Why not stick on an MP type rewind knob and use it to set the ISO? Now that would be retro. Didn't the old cameras have a PC socket?

 

I think the shape is very nostalgic and lets people fantasize that they have something in common with their favorite photographers of the past. So it helps perpetuate the "romance" of using a Leica. This may be important to some as are the looks in general.

 

Of course I feel the more ergonomic the better. The more features the better, the higher the performance the better. But all I care about are the results, not the traditions or how a camera looks. I'm probably the only one.

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I think this discussion is perfectly legitimate. I do not have wind-on lever phantom pain, but there are two things that cry out for improvement:

 

The M8 feels like a M5. Clumsy. The reason is the increased 'gripping depth'. I know that the total front flange-to-cover glass distance probably cannot be reduced, but that is immaterial--it is the bulk held by the right hand that should be reduced to approximately M6 dimensions. It would of course be nice if the height of the body could be M6-ized too, but that is a cosmetic and not an ergonomic matter.

 

Second, if you look at a M8 from above, you will see that the front right curve of the body is singularly unsuited for gripping. The only thing worse that I have encountered is a Kine Exakta ... This should be rectified. Further improvement would come from an optional finger grip, moulded to fit the body contour and held by one or two screws fitting into discreet black bushings. A number of my old OM cameras had that feature and it worked like a charm. And fundamentalists could simply ignore it.

 

The intransigent types could always go buy themselves a good used Leica A.

 

The old man from the Age of the M3

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Why not stick on an MP type rewind knob and use it to set the ISO? Now that would be retro. Didn't the old cameras have a PC socket?

 

I like the idea of the rewind knob. So...... how about fitting a manual winding lever for cocking the shutter, and using the rewind knob to power a generator so that you can recharge your battery whilst out and about?

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