Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
thrid

M9 Concept sketch - traditional approach

Recommended Posts

Charles, your and my mileage clearly varies.

 

As I said above, I have "done" the digital workflow from RAW, without all the electronic angst and sturm und drang that seems to be the order of the day for some people around here. I still do, with the RAW outputs from my Olympus DSLR, Canon G7 and now the D-Lux 4. Jpgs are, after all, for eBay advert illustrations only.

 

Now, I don't know about you but I get no pleasure whatsoever from tweaking sliders while sat at a desk. As to film, I can (still) outsource the process and that is my preference. I would rather someone else sat in a stinking darkroom turning their fingers yellow while I am out in the fresh air capturing images. Feel free to disagree, but please respect my right to hold a different opinion to you without calling it "silly".

 

Regards,

 

Bill

 

Yes, Bill, but a lot of shooters outsource their RAW "developing" as well (I outsource my film as well though do the final scanning and printing on an Imacon and an Epson 4800). Sliders still get slid.

 

Whatever. Maybe you should actually try shooting with the M8 for once.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
No, you don't need a separate button for every item. Just logical grouping of functions on controls that are easy to set quickly. The best camera I have used for this is the Konica Minolta A2. It has a huge number of features that are easy to control directly without using the menu. And it is smaller than an M8. Although this camera certainly does not produce state of the art pictures, I think it is a triumph of ergonomic design that clearly incorporates a huge number of functions that can be set quickly.

 

For instance, there is a single control dial that lets you select ISO, metering pattern, camera drive, white balance, custom user functions and memory settings

 

I suggest you look over the control functions on this review:

 

Konica Minolta DiMAGE A2 Review: 5. Operation & Controls: Digital Photography Review

 

you could do worse than check out the later iteration of KM control interfaces in the 7D SLRs,

 

Konica Minolta Maxxum 7D Review: 5. Operation & Controls: Digital Photography Review

Konica Minolta Maxxum 7D Review: 6. Operation & Controls: Digital Photography Review

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
you could do worse than check out the later iteration of KM control interfaces in the 7D SLRs

 

I honestly think you need go no further than the RD1: one dial for speed, ISO and EV:

 

http://www.richcutler.co.uk/r-d1/images/rd1_03.jpg

 

I honestly can't imagine what else is needed? WB is taken care of by shooting RAW, and AE lock equals manual exposure in my book. Separate buttons for 'PROTECT', 'DELETE' and 'INFO' are just overkill imo, and could've been combined into a submenu, or a user-choice button.

I know some others might use them and would probably miss them, but in my opinion the experience of shooting digital would be improved without constant chimping, deleting and fiddling with the camera generally - and instead simply focussing our concentration on the act of really seeing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Whatever. Maybe you should actually try shooting with the M8 for once.

 

*sigh*

 

Therre's always one.

 

Regards,

 

Bill

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
*sigh*

 

Therre's always one.

 

 

Sorry Bill, and with the utmost respect for your opinons: you had that coming!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sorry Bill, and with the utmost respect for your opinons: you had that coming!

 

It really doesn't matter, Sander. I just get bored with the assumptive zealotry and intolerant monotheistic thuggery displayed in this sub-forum to anyone who has the affrotery to hold an opinion without a "qualifying" M8 in their humidity-controlled glass cabinet. .

 

Regards,

 

Bill

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I honestly think you need go no further than the RD1: one dial for speed, ISO and EV:

 

http://www.richcutler.co.uk/r-d1/images/rd1_03.jpg

 

I honestly can't imagine what else is needed? WB is taken care of by shooting RAW, and AE lock equals manual exposure in my book.[/i]

 

A control dial also can use settings for - Drive. This could be auto bracketing, single frame, low continuous, hi continuous, and a "silent" delayed re-cocking single frame mode.

 

Some shooters don't have the luxury of shooting raw on every assignment, or need simultaneous jpegs for editing and want these to look good. Plus it makes raw conversion much quicker if the images have been set to the correct color balance, especially for critical work.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It really doesn't matter, Sander. I just get bored with the assumptive zealotry and intolerant monotheistic thuggery displayed in this sub-forum to anyone who has the affrotery to hold an opinion without a "qualifying" M8 in their humidity-controlled glass cabinet. .

 

Regards,

 

Bill

 

Like I said, whatever Bill. Why don't you check out my website (or google my name) before you think I might have my camera in a glass cabinet.

 

I for one give up on this forum of grumpy old men.

 

See ya,

 

CP

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I honestly think you need go no further than the RD1: one dial for speed, ISO and EV:

 

http://www.richcutler.co.uk/r-d1/images/rd1_03.jpg

 

The only problem with that design is that EV compensation only works if you are in aperture priority mode.

 

 

I honestly can't imagine what else is needed? WB is taken care of by shooting RAW, and AE lock equals manual exposure in my book. Separate buttons for 'PROTECT', 'DELETE' and 'INFO' are just overkill imo, and could've been combined into a submenu, or a user-choice button.

I know some others might use them and would probably miss them, but in my opinion the experience of shooting digital would be improved without constant chimping, deleting and fiddling with the camera generally - and instead simply focussing our concentration on the act of really seeing.

 

You have to be more careful with digital, because it is not nearly as forgiving as negative film to exposure errors. With digital we're back to shoot slide film, with a little more headroom. So, you have to pay attention. Secondly the M8 metering system is good, but is a lot more easily fooled than something like Nikon's 1005 RGB matrix meter. So, once again, you have to pay more attention.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thrid,

I like your design for the M9 but suggest a couple of changes.

1) You have 2 on/off switches, 1 on top plate, 1 on back of camera. I think this was an oversight when you changed from design #1 to design #2. 2) Eliminate the "S" Mode and install a "quiet" shutter with 1/8000th shutter speed. 3) Where is the live view on/off

switch?

Overall, I think your concepts are well thought out. When will you be joining Leica's design

team?

Sincerely,

Russell C. Greenberg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thrid,

I like your design for the M9 but suggest a couple of changes.

1) You have 2 on/off switches, 1 on top plate, 1 on back of camera. I think this was an oversight when you changed from design #1 to design #2. 2) Eliminate the "S" Mode and install a "quiet" shutter with 1/8000th shutter speed. 3) Where is the live view on/off

switch?

Overall, I think your concepts are well thought out. When will you be joining Leica's design

team?

Sincerely,

Russell C. Greenberg

 

 

Two on/off switches. Silly me... Thanks for pointing that out.

 

Thanks, glad you like it.

 

Live view switch - I was trying to add as few buttons as possible. I figure that live view could be activated through the main menu.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thrid,

 

Sorry! 1 more suggestion, Please exchange the circular display for the OLED display,

I like the additional information provided by it. Again, your design concepts are excellent,

Can you create a design for a film camera with a high speed metal shutter? (M7HS)

Sincerely,

Russell

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest bwcolor

Well, all you guys have now satisfactorily redesigned the digital M series, so maybe there is a bunch of you who should build a working prototype to send to Leica and then all they would have to do is clone it! They sure need it.

 

More seriously, it is sad that this company is so out of synch with its audience, and with the state of the art, that their putative customers have to design a decent camera for them. Some of the thinking in this thread has been very much to the point, very creative, but also pretty obvious as to what the market wants, and how deficient the M8.2 really is. Sob!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I haven't read through all of the posts so excuse me if these suggestion have already been made. The O/U compensation switch on the back is in a bad place, too easily hit inadvertently by the thumb, keep the on/off switch on the back and move the O/U switch to the shutter release base. Also Please add a PC outlet for use with studio flash and non-ttl cord synced flashes. Also change the ttl shoe to the Olympus/Panasonic standard.

Just my $.02

Neal F

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Why not make it thinner? No reason for it to be so fat.

 

I share your wish, but there is an LCD array behind the sensor plane. Add that (2-3 mm) to the register and that is your thickness.

 

You might argue: Thin the body and let the lens mount stick out. Taken to extremes one gets something like this:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A full size piano keyboard has 88 keys. Plus three pedals. That is a lot of buttons especially when you consider that you may have to press a bunch of them simultaneously.. Yet synthesizers have added lots more dials and controls and musicians seem to figure out how to use them.

I tried to learn the piano or a few years... Never came to anything. ):

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I tried to learn the piano or a few years... Never came to anything. ):

 

I had piano lessons from 6 years on till 35. Have not played now for 25 years, but when I see a Schubert Sonata on a piano, I can still play it quite reasonably.

 

Two months not using my Canon 20D: have to start all over again. Inhuman interface:eek:

 

Please keep the Leica M9 as clean as possible. But I do like the idea of the extra battery compartment. Reminds my of my trusted TA Rapidwinder (that unfortunately got lost in the Boxing Day Tsunami)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I share your wish, but there is an LCD array behind the sensor plane. Add that (2-3 mm) to the register and that is your thickness.

 

You might argue: Thin the body and let the lens mount stick out.

 

The lens mount on the M8 already sticks out more than on film Ms, allowing the body to be a millimetre or so thinner than would otherwise be the case. I suspect this is as far as it could be taken without having to alter the rangefinder. Maybe the M9 will do this. Getting rid of the circuit board between the sensor and the LCD monitor, plus allowing the lens mount to protrude about 3mm more, would get the thickness of the body back to that of the traditional M.

 

IMHO, however, the elegant proportions of the M3 and sisters were already ruined by the additional height of the M6TTL and M7; the extra thickness of the M8 was merely a small additional ugliness.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...