Thoughts on Summarits?

[Gentleman Villain]

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What's the general consensus on Summarits?

 

From what I've read, a lot of people seem to think that they are a low budget/entry level way of getting new customers into the Leica system. My impression is that they have a different look than a lot of the summicrons and summiluxes. The Summarits seem to have a smoother transition between in-focus and out-of-focus areas. Also, the colors are different...can't quite put my finger on it...but they look more muted or old time or something?

 

Any thoughts?

 

The Summarits seem to have a really interesting look that I find appealing...but I can't quite put my finger on exactly why

[michali]

I just bought a 35mm Summarit today, after doing some fairly lengthy research including asking advice from Forum members. See the thread on this page "35mm which one?".

 

Best thing you can do is check out Sean Reid's site: http://www.reidreviews.com it's a subscription site, very well worth joining. Sean's done some exhaustive reviews on the Summarits amongst others. BYTW my initial impressions of the 35mm Summarit are the same as Sean's; positive.

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[martinb]

The Summarit's seems great, there's only one big BUT!

The Voigtländer 28,35 and 50mm Skopars are so damn good, more compact and a lot cheaper. With 35mm+ focal lengths coding isn't super necessary.. The 90mm seems like a bargain though compared to the old 90mm elmarit..

[Hacker]

I have used all 4 Summarits, and the 35, the 75 and the 90 are very exceptional. Slower but certainly not worse off than the other ASPH equivalents. Also, the OOF is nice, unlike the harsher look of the CVs..

[jaa]

I bought a 90 Summarit a month ago. I don't have a definitive opinion yet (not much time to use it) but, even if it may not have the absolute resolution of other Leica lenses I don't think it's bad at all. Not that I think there are bad Leica lenses. Only very good, excellent and outstanding... and the classification varies according to user preferences.

 

Some exemples (not that low res images can tell anything meaningful but, hey, it's fun to look at pictures)...

 

All: M8 + 90 Summarit.

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[Gentleman Villain]

Thanks for posting the pics...The middle shot is exactly what I'm talking about...the in-focus and OOF areas seem to blend together in a super smooth way

 

I've always ignored the summarits because they are less expensive...Now I'm starting to see certain advantages that they may have over their higher priced counterparts.

[sean_reid]

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The Summarits seem to have a smoother transition between in-focus and out-of-focus areas. Also, the colors are different...can't quite put my finger on it...but they look more muted or old time or something?

The Summarits seem to have a really interesting look that I find appealing...but I can't quite put my finger on exactly why

 

It's a combination of somewhat lower contrast and somewhat more muted color saturation. These are not entry level lenses, that's just marketing nonsense.

 

Cheers,

[Gentleman Villain]

Thanks Sean...Ithought I was seeing something really different....the lower contrast and the muted colors must be it

[lars_bergquist]

The real competition for the Summarits comes from Carl Zeiss: Very good optical and mechanical quality indeed, and lower prices than Summicron or Elmarit lenses. But the Summarits come coded, and it does seem that quality control is more consistent in Hessen than in Japan, which is where both the Zeiss and the Voigtländer lenses come from.

 

I own a 75mm and it is extremely good, probably the best in the line: excellent definition, great resistance to flare and reflexes, good solid feel.

 

The old man from the Age of Max Berek

[Guest JasonG]

I have to admit to having been enticed by the Summarits, specifically the 50, when I was looking at buying an M8. This was mainly because of cost, although in the end I bought an "as new" used 50 cron for the same price as the 50 Summarit ( a very nice deal on a nearly new, completely indistinguishable-from-new, lens) and I'm made up over it!

The Summarit has a very nice signature to it but I have to say that the cron is more of what I like.

 

Having said that, I have a lovely CV 40 f/1.4 (single coated version) that I bought with a Bessa R3M (now gone) that I now use on a nice M2 from our good host and it works fantastically well for B&W. I haven't tried it yet on my M8 as the cron has been almost glued on but I've heard good things.

 

I will have a look at the Summarits again later in the year when I'm looking for a 75 or a 90, although the main attraction of the M-system for me is all the old glass available.

 

Tra

 

Jason

[patashnik]

I have only tried the 35mm and 50mm, and while the 50mm Summarit felt like a "Summicron light" (and I don't even like the 50mm Summicron), I could live happily with the 35mm Summarit. The speed wasn't really an issue, it made me realize how little need I have for f/1.4 and f/2 when it all comes down to it. Seeing the results I got from f/2.5-f/8, it made me finally ditch the 35mm Summilux ASPH with its focus shift issue.

[earleygallery]

I have used all 4 Summarits, and the 35, the 75 and the 90 are very exceptional. Slower but certainly not worse off than the other ASPH equivalents. Also, the OOF is nice, unlike the harsher look of the CVs..

 

I'm not aware of the harshness you describe on the CV lenses I have - do you have any photos to show the differences?

[Guest Joachim_I]

The 90mm seems like a bargain though compared to the old 90mm elmarit..

You can get a mint Elmarit-M 90mm for less than half of the price of a new Summarit-M 90mm. I know for sure since I just bought one (18 months old, in like new condition).

Best, Joachim

[Guest Luis D]

Because as it has been stated, these Summarits have "lower contrast and muted colours" compared of the top of the line latest Leica glass, they are closer to the precedant versions, that are buyable for much less money (on average). The only Summarit that to me holds reason is the 75mm, because there are no equal or less expensive Leica alternates, although there is Cosina/Voigtlaender 75mm that is I'm sure no less good than the Summarit. For me there appears two types of people who are designed for the Summarits: those who must have the Leica name, and/or those who have an aversion to secondhand.

[lars_bergquist]

The 75mm Summarit is distinctly better than the CV lens off axis and wide open, also at 4.0. And the build quality is higher. That said, the Color Heliar is a very good value.

 

The old man from the Age of Max Berek

[abrewer]

I'll probably get bashed for this, but...

 

...save your money and get a summicron

[jaa]

Because as it has been stated, these Summarits have "lower contrast and muted colours" compared of the top of the line latest Leica glass, they are closer to the precedant versions, that are buyable for much less money (on average). The only Summarit that to me holds reason is the 75mm, because there are no equal or less expensive Leica alternates, although there is Cosina/Voigtlaender 75mm that is I'm sure no less good than the Summarit. For me there appears two types of people who are designed for the Summarits: those who must have the Leica name, and/or those who have an aversion to secondhand.

 

OK, to a great extent that may be true* but what's the problem? Let me present the case. For a little more money, with the Summarits you get:

1. The Leica name (totally subjective value);

2. The guarantees (of appearance, quality and assistance) that comes with buying new (that’s not such a small detail for someone who has ever had to return something);

3. The easier and more secure process of buying through a dealer (for reliable dealers that also sell used stuff this point doesn't apply but when buying privatly...);

4. The assurance that the lenses were developed by people who know the M8 (see points 5 and 6) and maybe even had future full frame Ms in consideration;

5. The 6-bit code on the lenses and the file information and software teaks that it allows;

6. Generally, better image quality that equivalent CV lenses (Zeiss may be another matter but, from what I've read, Summarits are at least as good);

7. Perhaps a higher re-sale value (to be confirmed or denied with time).

Finally, choosing a new Leica lens instead of a used one or a new CV or Zeiss is a way to help Leica during these rough times. This may mean nothing to most people but I suspect it’s not entirely irrelevant for many other (Leica fans may be vocal and demanding but many feel a definitive connection to the company).

 

 

* Just to place all the cards on the table: I prefer Leica but I also have a very nice CV 15mm and, though I prefer buying new, I own or owned stuff bought used: one of my first cameras was a Pentax P30T and, later, I enjoyed using for many years a Pentax 24mm f/2.0, both items bought used (the lens had - and has as I still own it - a lot of use marks).

 

[Gentleman Villain]

Thanks for all the feedback

[Guest Luis D]

The 75mm Summarit is distinctly better than the CV lens off axis and wide open, also at 4.0. And the build quality is higher.

 

It was a while before, but I remember a review by someone (not Erwin, the other man, the one who charges a fee to read his opinions) that I think did not call the Summarit "distinctly" better. As for build quality, I have not heard of CV lenses that fell aparts. I have heard many stories of brand-new Leica lenses with dirt inside, stiff focus, etc. what needed to go right back for some repair. For me there is subjective feel, what I believe Leica lenses are better, and then there is durability, what I believe CV lenses have plenty enough. CV lenses are paint, however, and does wear off. But also the few blackpaint Leica lenses also wear to brass.

 

OK, to a great extent that may be true* but what's the problem? Let me present the case. For a little more money, with the Summarits you get:

1. The Leica name (totally subjective value);

 

Agreed on both your points.

 

2. The guarantees (of appearance, quality and assistance) that comes with buying new (that’s not such a small detail for someone who has ever had to return something);

 

Many tales of defective new lenses (included Leica). Buy secondhand from reputable dealers and there is ability to return, and also 60-90 day warrantee.

 

3. The easier and more secure process of buying through a dealer (for reliable dealers that also sell used stuff this point doesn't apply but when buying privatly...);

 

Again, you answer your own statement, there are dealers for security in secondhand also.

 

4. The assurance that the lenses were developed by people who know the M8 (see points 5 and 6) and maybe even had future full frame Ms in consideration;

 

AFAIK all M lenses are designed with full-frame, included Summarits. These are not telecentric, and do not have builtin IR filters, so "know the M8" has what to do? Most Leica lenses in the highprice line were designed way before the M8.

 

5. The 6-bit code on the lenses and the file information and software teaks that it allows;

 

Any lens can be selfcoded. Many older Leica glass can be coded by Leica, with especial "tweaks" for the M8 in firmware. Again, just the 75 has a unique place w.r.t. focal length and price vs a secondhand Leica glass.

 

6. Generally, better image quality that equivalent CV lenses (Zeiss may be another matter but, from what I've read, Summarits are at least as good);

 

Where is it proved the Summarits are all better image quality than CV? Even if so slightly, they are 2-3x cheaper.

 

Finally, choosing a new Leica lens instead of a used one or a new CV or Zeiss is a way to help Leica during these rough times. This may mean nothing to most people but I suspect it’s not entirely irrelevant for many other (Leica fans may be vocal and demanding but many feel a definitive connection to the company).

 

There I cannot argue. If you buy to support Leica, buy new Leica lens. If like me you believe he who makes the best price:quality wins, and have already yourself and family to support, then better buy what performs as you need, regardless of who makes it.

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Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[andybarton]

 

AFAIK all M lenses are designed with full-frame, included Summarits.

 

ALL M lenses are designed to cover a full 35mm film frame. None are designed specifically for the M8.