M8 to M8.2 Upgrade Cost

[marknorton]

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We know that Leica charge €1320 to upgrade an M8 to as close to M8.2 specification as we can get. Call it $1675 or £1035, though YMMV depending on taxes and shipping.

 

If, instead, you trade in your M8, and buy an M8.2, you will get more these extras:

 

- Snap Shot Mode

- EV Adjust

- Discreet Mode

- Cosmetics

- Compact Charger

 

So, those of you who have bought an M8.2 to replace an M8, how much are you ending up paying for these additional functions and features, over and above the prices I've shown above?

[stunsworth]

I haven't bought an M8.2, but if we take Ffordes prices one costs £3990.

 

They also have used M8s for £2199. What the seller got from Ffordes will depend on whether the camera was bought by them outright, or is being sold on a commission basis. Lets assume bought outright, then I'd expect the seller to get around £1700 or so. If that's the case then the M8.2 will costs approx £2300.

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[mboerma]

You also get an extra year warranty when buying a new M8.2.

[dcoombs]

I noticed that Dale's (banner ad above) will accept M8s as a trade-in for $2,800. That's a 20% discount on what they say should be the retail price on a used M8 in good condition. Subract that from their M8.2 price of $6,295 and the net cost to you (in the US) is $3,495 (or £2,150 at today's fx rate). Selling your M8 privately might improve your cost, of course.

 

Doug

[wattsy]

Lets assume bought outright, then I'd expect the seller to get around £1700 or so.

 

I rather doubt it. I'd be surprised if Ffordes (or any other dealer) would offer more than £1200 for an M8 part-exchanged or taken into stock. Wasn't Caplan reported to be offering £1000 part exchange a few weeks ago?

 

Irrespective of dealer margins, etc. are used M8s actually selling (retail or private) for more than £2000 nowadays?

 

If you haven't got your knickers in a twist about the delayed shutter re-cock feature, going for the upgrade options makes a lot more financial sense.

[rsh]

I plan to sell the Chrome M8 and get the M8.2.

[ken_tanaka]

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Mark: I recently grabbed an 8.2 and still have both my 8s. (Yes, I'll be selling one of the latter when I get 'round to it.) Indeed, the 8.2 does offer these additional "features" beyond a factory upgrade to the 8. But, after spending almost two weeks with the 8.2 I have to admit that the 8.2 also provides owners with a more "finished"-feeling product. It is, I believe, the M8 that Leica wanted to originally introduce two years ago. (I also swear that it produces a slightly better image than the 8, but I really don't want to wade into that swamp.)

 

By making the above remarks I am NOT promoting the M8.2 per se. It's a damn expensive camera and represents a nearly impossible-to-justify premium over the M8. I was initially critical of the improvements that the 8.2 sold for such a large premium. In fact, I still am. But I have to admit that, absurd price aside, the M8.2 is a wonderful Leica. It's the M8 I thought I was buying in February 2007.

[andybarton]

You can pick up a Mint- M8 for about £1850, even in the centre of London

[thompsonkirk]

It' has seemed to me that upgrading an M8 makes more sense than getting an M8.2.

 

This would depend, of course, on what features one values. For my purposes the quieter shutter & more accurate framelines are worth the money. All the rest - except the unavailable discreet mode - is glitz to me.

 

In $ terms, if I bought a 4-5K camera that's now worth $3K, but can upgrade these essential features for $1270, why blow the other $2K? The prestige of the latest model? One additional year of warranty?

 

If I regularly took stealth pictures or worked in theaters or on sets, maybe the discreet mode would be worth $2K. Otherwise I can't see how to rationalize an M8.2 economically.

 

(Along the same lines I used an M4, several times overhauled, & an M6, but didn't 'upgrade' to M5, M6TTL, or M7.)

 

Kirk

[leicamr]

I currently use an M8 and I find the frame accuracy to be appalling. To you M8.2 users, how do you find the accuarcy of the frames in the M8.2?

 

What is 'discreet mode?

 

Mark

[marknorton]

Ken, it's certainly the case that the noisy shutter, the loose framelines, the scratch-prone LCD cover, the gritty shutter release and dismal charger do detract from the perceived quality of the M8. The combination of the upgraded parts plus Leica learning how to build the camera better all contribute to the improvement you are seeing in the M8.2.

 

With a traded M8 contributing little more than 40% towards the cost of an M8.2, it's easy to see why Leica need to create blue sky between the two. I expect we'll see further firmware enhancements restricted to the M8.2 to enhance its perceived value and further devalue the M8.

 

If a future M9 delivers IQ improvements over the M8 in the same way the Nikon D3 has over the D2x, M8 and M8.2 prices will take a real pounding - and provide a ready entry level camera for the Leica Digital M.

[ken_tanaka]

The M8.2 frame lines do certainly seem much more accurate than those of the M8. I've no evidentiary images to support this but I can tell you that I have noticed the accuracy improvement most on my 35mm and 50mm lenses (both Leicas). I know that this has been discussed in greater depth elsewhere here so I'll leave it at that.

 

Moments ago I offered an opinion on another thread that investment in a new lens might make far more sense for most M8 owners than either updating to the M8u or upgrading to an M8.2. The lens will probably be with you for a long time and may make a far, far greater difference in your photography than the current M8 body changes.

[dcoombs]

(Snip) If a future M9 delivers IQ improvements over the M8 in the same way the Nikon D3 has over the D2x, M8 and M8.2 prices will take a real pounding - and provide a ready entry level camera for the Leica Digital M.

 

Is an M9 really on the horizon, or is it a figment of our imagination?

 

Doug

[thompsonkirk]

It's a real figment.

 

Kirk

[ken_tanaka]

Is an M9 really on the horizon, or is it a figment of our imagination?

 

Doug

The answer depends on how high you are.

[biglouis]

You can pick up a Mint- M8 for about £1850, even in the centre of London

 

Blimey, at that price I could almost justify one as a second body.

 

If I had the best part of £2300 to part with (according to Steve's financial model) changing my M8 for a M8.2 would not be in the equation. For that money I would definitely think about a new Sony A900 and the Zeiss 35/1.4.

 

Actually, now I come to think of it, I'd trade in my 24/2.8 and with the £2300 added I'd almost have enough for a 24/1.4 or 21/1.4, which I'd get long before I'd consider the photographic IQ benefit (zero?) or moving from a M8 to M8.2.

 

Unfortunately, I don't, so I guess I'm just stuck with the M8 - poor me.

 

LouisB

[tomasis7]

marknorton, it would be cool if if M9 came, M8 are still produced to allow get lower level of price.

 

at the time M8.0 could be upgraded to M8.2 or vice versa allowing a la carte and playing a bit Lego

[thompsonkirk]

Louis, I think current M8 prices DO justify a second body plus upgrades. Or anyway I've acted on that premise.

 

My original M8, at this point just a bit too scratched/abused/dented to be a high-value trade-in, has been twice to the NJ clinic for repairs. This experience required me to keep a backup.

 

For backup I I had a 5D & Canon lenses/accessories that I never used, except on the 2 Leica repair occasions. So I sold it to a young artist for a reasonable price. This & a bit of cash bought a like-new M8 backup body for US$3200. Now the 2 bodies have appointments for upgrade to quieter shutters & more accurate framelines, which are the only M8.2 features that would affect my shooting.

 

That was $5750 additional outlay to have two M8.2 'functional equivalents' & 2 more years of warranty. Subtract the sale of the 5D & the outlay wasn't far over $3K.

 

I much prefer this arrangement to one M8.2 body (albeit clothed in vulcanite & sapphire) for $6300 minus a modest trade-in.

 

Kirk

[gwelland]

Kirk makes a lot of sense.

 

I started with one M8 and subsequently bought a back up after a few months so that I could set up two cameras with wide/long lenses as a pair plus the obvious coverage in case one should go wrong and/or need adjustment. This worked out extremely well.

 

I subsequently sold one to a friend when I knew there was a new updated model coming in the near future which made both he and I happy. Now that the M8.2 is hitting the streets I added one to my outfit.

 

Now I'm going to update my original M8 and bring it mostly up to spec. I've been considering selling it but like Kirk I suspect that my original black M8 is a little too 'lived in' to be an instant or worthwhile seller in the current climate. It's worth a lot more to me than a couple of $'000 especially if I invest another $1700 in it.

 

If I need whisper quiet then I have the M8.2. If I need quiet enough then the M8 is just fine. Heck, for my style of shooting the standard shutter noise isn't really a problem if I'm honest with myself. (Heck, why let reason creep into a big boy's toy discussion!).

 

Now if I could only work the numbers to sell my D3/D700 & Nikon/Zeiss lens collection and jump over to the new Mamiya 645/Leaf DL 28 or Phase One camera package ...

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[adan]

My local dealer said they could offer me about $2200 each for my M8s - about 60% of what they would sell them for used - as tradeins on an M8.2. So roughly I give up two cameras and $2000 cash for an M8.2. Or $8200 to have two M8.2 bodies minus trade.

 

I can upgrade both my cameras with the two critical items (for me) - low-impact shutter and framelines - for about $2500.

 

The upgrade works out better for me: I don't need anything else (except would pay for the discreet advance in addition, were it available). I'll just stick with my two bodies and their extended warranties (EACH gets a year).

 

Full-frame is the only improvement that would entice me to shell out cash for fully new cameras.

 

LeicaMR: Discreet mode delays the motorized cocking of the shutter until you release the shutter button, so you get a VERY quiet 'click' while exposing, and can stick the camera under your jacket or down to your side before letting it wind on (and the winding seems to be slower and quieter as well). Very cool - but not worth the $4000 difference I'd have to pay per body to trade up.