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M8 Panos --Nodal point for M lenses

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Nice stuff, Phil ! BTW, I'm still in London. Let me know when you're next in town and let's get together.

 

Cheers, Doug

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Actually, Georg, the more I think about this, the more I am inclined to advise you more strongly not to get wrapped up in solutions that applied to an earlier technology and just get on with shooting. That is, tripods with pano heads were necessary in the days of film photography but they are much less so in digital. Therefore, this equipment will actually stand in the way of your taking photographs rather than enhancing the photos you want to take.

 

For example, I took a hand-held panorama photograph from the deck of a moving ferry boat consisting of five frames through a 75 mm lens. Obviously, the nodal point was moving out of my control up and down, side to side, and receding from the scene at a rate of knots. Even if I had used a tripod and pano head, I never would have been able to fix the nodal point or level the equipment. See East River Harbor Scene on Flickr - Photo Sharing! and look at the larger size files there on Flickr. I think PhotoShop CS3 overcame these difficulties in exemplary fashion. So, why bother with more gear?

 

Philip,

 

Great shot of the harbor.

 

I am completely with you as regards not worrying about the nodal point for such types of shots. As I said in my opening post, I regularly shoot handheldl panos and I am quite pleased with the results.

 

However, last weekend I tried to shoot a pano (handeld) in the forrest with some plants in the foreground, a lake with old tree branches in the middle, and tress in the back. Well that did not work well at all

. So that' s the reason why I am contemplating to get a pano head. My objective would be to shoot a mulit-row pano of a scene like the one I described in order to print it really big with lots of detail. Basically to create LF with the M8.

 

May be that's a crazy and stupied idea, but would not be my first one

 

Georg

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Actually, Georg, the more I think about this, the more I am inclined to advise you more strongly not to get wrapped up in solutions that applied to an earlier technology and just get on with shooting. That is, tripods with pano heads were necessary in the days of film photography but they are much less so in digital.

 

Hmm... I am not so sure. I have had to regret several times leaving my tripod (just a lightweight Gitzo) and panohead at home or hotel.

 

When horizons are involved, and your pictures are not perfectly horizontal, the software may not be able to render a straight horizon.

The waivy thing that is the result is impossible to correct. CS3, PtGui, Auto Pano: to no avail. And a stunning sunset in the tropics down the drain

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.......

 

However, last weekend I tried to shoot a pano (handheld) in the forest with some plants in the foreground, a lake with old tree branches in the middle, and tress in the back. Well that did not work well at all

. So that' s the reason why I am contemplating to get a pano head.

 

Georg,

 

You could be right. This: http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m8-forum/32333-indonesian-jungle-panorama.html#post339098 was done with a pano head, plants 2 meters away, and I wonder what would have resulted when I had done it handheld. Probably a mess!

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Georg,

 

You could be right. This: http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m8-forum/32333-indonesian-jungle-panorama.html#post339098 was done with a pano head, plants 2 meters away, and I wonder what would have resulted when I had done it handheld. Probably a mess!

 

 

Sanders,

 

Cool shot in a warm and humid climate.

 

This is the type of shot I have in mind. How big is your file and how large could you print while preserving detail?

 

I would like to shoot something like that with, say, a 50 or 35 cron in 3 or 4 rows in order to have more pixels than a single row with the WATE so that I could print larger.

 

Georg

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Hmm... I am not so sure. I have had to regret several times leaving my tripod (just a lightweight Gitzo) and panohead at home or hotel.

 

When horizons are involved, and your pictures are not perfectly horizontal, the software may not be able to render a straight horizon.

The waivy thing that is the result is impossible to correct. CS3, PtGui, Auto Pano: to no avail. And a stunning sunset in the tropics down the drain

 

When I have that problem I get round it by opening each individual frame in Photoshop and use the lens distortion tools to rotate each image until it's horizon is horizontal. I then stitch together the straightened frames.

 

So maybe your stunning sunset in the tropics isn't down the drain

.

 

Bob.

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Sanders,

Cool shot in a warm and humid climate.

This is the type of shot I have in mind. How big is your file and how large could you print while preserving detail?

I would like to shoot something like that with, say, a 50 or 35 cron in 3 or 4 rows in order to have more pixels than a single row with the WATE so that I could print larger.

Georg

 

The file is 150Mb and about 8500 pixel wide. A 1 meter wide print looked good!

As to the focal lenght to choose, I would really like to see your results. 3 rows would be interesting.

Here is a normal pano made with the CV 35/2.5: South Africa and Namibia Panorama's

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When I have that problem I get round it by opening each individual frame in Photoshop and use the lens distortion tools to rotate each image until it's horizon is horizontal. I then stitch together the straightened frames.

 

So maybe your stunning sunset in the tropics isn't down the drain

.

 

Bob.

 

Thanks

I tried setting the pictures straight with rotate, but that did not work in the end. I'll try your solution!

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Thanks I tried setting the pictures straight with rotate, but that did not work in the end. I'll try your solution!

I can't remember but I think it helps if after rotating/straightening the horizon you crop each frame so that it's sides are rectangular, that is there's no sloping sides. You can do that if there's sufficient overlap between frames.

 

Bob.

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Hmm... I am not so sure. I have had to regret several times leaving my tripod (just a lightweight Gitzo) and panohead at home or hotel.

 

When horizons are involved, and your pictures are not perfectly horizontal, the software may not be able to render a straight horizon.

The waivy thing that is the result is impossible to correct. CS3, PtGui, Auto Pano: to no avail. And a stunning sunset in the tropics down the drain

 

Sander, I do find that PS can cope with less than perfect horizons if I take the effort. In fact, the harbor scene was way off level straight out of the auto-stitching. Fortunately, there are a few things you can do to correct for that such as a slight rotation of the image or a more adventuresome Warp (under Edit->Transform).

 

I do accept, however, that there are certain situations where the pano head can be a real help and, I suppose, your jungle scene is one of them.

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Georg,

 

I have done a few multi-tiered panos hand-held although not altogether successfully. If you are attacking something that ambitious, perhaps a tripod/pano is a good idea. You certainly need to be especially well-organized to make sure that all the overlaps, horizontal and vertical, work without gaps which can be quite tricky.

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Philip - I applaud your Nodal Man outlook, maybe you've actually become a tripod and not yet noticed the other leg. Thanks for your report back on Photoshop, it sounds like it has come a long way from the near unusable CS1 version of Photomerge. I look forward to seeing example panoramas.

 

............... Chris

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Philip - I applaud your Nodal Man outlook, maybe you've actually become a tripod and not yet noticed the other leg. Thanks for your report back on Photoshop, it sounds like it has come a long way from the near unusable CS1 version of Photomerge. I look forward to seeing example panoramas.

 

............... Chris

Chris, you might be interested in the three panoramas in this thread. The first two are a stitch of frames made by stepping sideways. The third is a stitch of frames obtained by approximately rotating the lens around the entrance pupil, hand held. 35mm Summicron ASPH, M8, Photoshop CS3 merge function. I've yet to try CS4.

 

Bob.

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I would endorse some of the earlier comments on nodal point and precise technique not always being so necessary.

 

Referring to the Carsten thread (http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m8-forum/27196-36-shot-portrait-panorama-3.html) - the pano I posted in thread 49 was done from a moving boat, handheld; thread 57 was done hanging off a balcony also handheld. Panos are great fun.

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Chris, you might be interested in the three panoramas in this thread. The first two are a stitch of frames made by stepping sideways. The third is a stitch of frames obtained by approximately rotating the lens around the entrance pupil, hand held. 35mm Summicron ASPH, M8, Photoshop CS3 merge function. I've yet to try CS4.

 

Bob.

 

Love the first two: interesting technique. Will try it when it stops raining here!

 

No 3. shows on my monitor some color variances in the pavement. Probably because WB was on AUTO. Most software now claims to be able to correct that kind of color variances (Autopano does), but for situation in which requirements are critical I would advice to put WB on manual and choose the nearest usable setting.

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Chris, you might be interested in the three panoramas in this thread.....

 

Bob - Yes indeed and thanks for the link, that's a thread that I gave up on rather early. It just goes to show that prejudging what will turn up in a thread can be foolish.

 

................ Chris

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Actually, Georg, the more I think about this, the more I am inclined to advise you more strongly not to get wrapped up in solutions that applied to an earlier technology and just get on with shooting.

 

Well, I followed your advice. Last weekend in Paris, no tripod, but a newly acquired second hand 50 lux ASP. About 9 vertical shots on the Place des Voges. Stiched inCS3

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When I have that problem I get round it by opening each individual frame in Photoshop and use the lens distortion tools to rotate each image until it's horizon is horizontal. I then stitch together the straightened frames.

 

So maybe your stunning sunset in the tropics isn't down the drain

.

 

Bob.

 

Bob - I seem to be forever adjusting horizontals [and verticals too] for accurate alignment. I should have suggested this earlier, and my apologies if you know the following :

 

In Photoshop, in the Tools Palette, scroll to the Eyedropper Tool and click on it to open it's options, scroll down to the Measure Tool. Then click on a horizon point and drag a long line to another horizon point. Go to Menu, select Rotate Canvas, select option Arbitrary. A box will open that shows the correct angle of rotation you have measured with the difference between your dragged line, and true horizontal [you can also do rotations by writing in an angle in that same box]. Click OK.

 

Apologies if you know, and have rejected this method, but I sometimes think that the Measure Tool is one of Photoshop's forgotten tools.

 

............... Chris

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Well, I followed your advice. Last weekend in Paris, no tripod, but a newly acquired second hand 50 lux ASP. About 9 vertical shots on the Place des Voges. Stiched inCS3

 

Looks good to me; how about you? Too bad the sky was a little flat when you shot it but you certainly establish your hand-held credentials. If you like CS3 for stitching, you'll love CS4. It does a great job of balancing the lighting and tonality of a pano.

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Bob - I seem to be forever adjusting horizontals [and verticals too] for accurate alignment. I should have suggested this earlier, and my apologies if you know the following :

 

In Photoshop, in the Tools Palette, scroll to the Eyedropper Tool and click on it to open it's options, scroll down to the Measure Tool. Then click on a horizon point and drag a long line to another horizon point. Go to Menu, select Rotate Canvas, select option Arbitrary. A box will open that shows the correct angle of rotation you have measured with the difference between your dragged line, and true horizontal [you can also do rotations by writing in an angle in that same box]. Click OK.

 

Apologies if you know, and have rejected this method, but I sometimes think that the Measure Tool is one of Photoshop's forgotten tools.

 

............... Chris

 

Chris, I am not sure which version of PS you are using but all of what you discuss in your post is automatically handled in CS4 and quite effectively in my early experience. I am still working on my Winchester shots in between other priorities but soon I will be able to release them.

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