Erwin on Apples & Oranges

[Fotomiguel]

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I agree with Erwin Puts. For me the M8 is a camera that needs concentration and daily use and know what to do if you want to get good results. A month without using it and you loose the feeling to be quick focusing and metering light and composing at the same time. But when you are fit, and you have the feeling over the camera is such a nice joy. The size of the camera and the manual controls give a psychic state very special. Of course is more difficult than to use a full automatic camera, but when you train everyday, you get used and you concentrate yourself... ufff what a experience! and if you also get a nice shot... will keep you happy for a whole week.

Cheers

[Vieri]

...

 

Personally, when I am working in some distinctly shady parts of London at odd hours of the day I know which camera I prefer having. One which can easily be whipped out of an innocuous looking bag and put back in again in a flash, does not attract attention and if it does attract attention looks not much bigger than some kind of point and shoot.

 

LouisB

 

Hey Louis, I think you got it the wrong way just figure the scenario, and you'll immediately see how with the D3 & 70-200, holding the camera by the lens, you could kill any assailant much easier than with the M8...

 

A Leica is a Leica. If the souls of dedicated photographers are examined, Post Mortem perhaps, it will be revealed that those who used and loved Leicas of all vintages, are more pure and beautiful, more happy and calmly satisfied, than those who used Nikons.

 

I use both Nikon & Leica (from a recently acquired IIIc to two MPs sided by a M2, and on the Nikon side a D3 - D300 pair preceeded by a D2x - D2xs pair now sold): what is my soul going to be looking like?

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[SJP]

Miguel,

 

Just to note that I am very (VERY) impressed with your photo's. I am/was blown away with the Mallorca pictures especially as I has somehow filed Mallorca as a place that was not worth visiting for mass tourism reasons. Thanks for that, it shows how shortsighted you can be. My wife is still convinced that you removed the throbbing masses (all the other tourists) via manipulation.

 

One question was that a few pictures seem to be directly into the sun (sun inside the frame), mallorca no 45 & 47, which I always thought was not possible due to flare etc. any comments on that? I think I need some re-education here.

 

Best Stephen

[gravastar]

Another, oh, so boring, thread. What is new here. Comparing a dSLR with a range finder yet again, give me a break, please!

 

.........................Personally, when I am working in some distinctly shady parts of London at odd hours of the day I know which camera I prefer having. One which can easily be whipped out of an innocuous looking bag and put back in again in a flash, does not attract attention and if it does attract attention looks not much bigger than some kind of point and shoot.

LouisB

 

To lighten up this thread . Perhaps not so boring since I recently had a relevant experience in a shady part of London.

 

I was photographing graffiti on the walls of a tunnel (Leake Street, locally known as P*ss Alley) which runs underneath the platforms of Waterloo station. Lighting in the tunnel is low, dirty strip fluorescents which graffiti artists have painted over. There were several other photographers there, all weighed down with large back packs crammed with dSLR equipment - cameras, lenses, flashes and tripods. I had an M8 with 35mm ASPH Summicron.

 

Others were complaining about the flash reflecting straight back off the painted walls, lenses not being wide enough and the light being low. There was much curiosity when they saw me take a picture hand held without flash, take a few steps sideways, take another and repeat as required. When they realized how I'd overcome the wide angle problem they asked about the M8 and were surprised I was able to use the lens at full aperture, something they said they couldn't do if they wanted quality. They could of course avoided using flash but then they would have had to use a tripod. .... The M8 made it all so easy. I've printed the images at 20ins but they would easily go to 40ins or more.

 

ETA: And the camera was discreet enough to capture some of the locals at work without them holding their carrier bags of paint cans up in front of their faces which is what they did when the guys with the dSLRs were around.

 

Bob.

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[mwilliamsphotography]

Nothing like any sort of a challenge to Lieca mania ... especially from a former Leica maniac ... LOL!

 

Horses for courses.

 

The trouble is that the "courses" are getting tougher.

 

A D3 may be a beast, but a D700 with Zeiss optics isn't quite as intimidating or conspicuous ... and when the "course" is low light shooting, ISO 4000 and up is an interesting option ... not to mention that some of the Zeiss ZF optics are pretty competitive.

 

Nice to have options.

[jrc]

Does the D700 not fit the bill on the camera front? I've never handled a D60, but I own the D700 and it can't be so much larger.

 

Current wideangle Nikon primes are weak at the moment, but there is some good stuff from the AI and AIS era that is entirely compatible and very cheap, and of course there's the Zeiss option.

 

I have a D300 (about the same size as a D700 as I understand it) and while it's a lot smaller than a D3, it's still a fairly large weighty camera compared to a Leica. If you look at a D60, you'll see that it is, comparatively, quite compact -- not too much bigger than a Leica, although the IQ does not match up. If Nikon decided to build a small FF camera, I think they could build one not a lot bigger than a Leica, although they might have to leave out a few things. If they cut the battery size by half (but provided an add-on battery pack for people who really need to shoot 1500 shots in a row), and dropped the pop-up flash, I think they could get the size down quite a lot...I have the Zeiss 25ZF 2.8, and it's a good solid lens, but not particularly compact or light.

 

I hope Leica gets an M9 out there, but with the advent of the 8.2, it seems unlikely to me. I think it might be five years away. One of the camera makers will eventually get onto what everybody, on every high-end camera forum, seems to want: a small (Leica-sized) FF pro camera with the sensor response of a D3/5D. If that happens before the new Leica comes out, Leica could lose a lot of its more serious patronage (that is, people more involved with image production than with camera.)

 

JC

[Fotomiguel]

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Miguel,

 

Just to note that I am very (VERY) impressed with your photo's. I am/was blown away with the Mallorca pictures especially as I has somehow filed Mallorca as a place that was not worth visiting for mass tourism reasons. Thanks for that, it shows how shortsighted you can be. My wife is still convinced that you removed the throbbing masses (all the other tourists) via manipulation.

 

One question was that a few pictures seem to be directly into the sun (sun inside the frame), mallorca no 45 & 47, which I always thought was not possible due to flare etc. any comments on that? I think I need some re-education here.

 

Best Stephen

Hi Stephen,

Thank you for the compliment. In Mallorca there are not so many tourist as you thing. You have to look for the rigth time. Some of the shots were taken in the winter which is the best time of the year for shooting in Mallorca. Light is much nicer and not tourist at all and no traffic problems. And the best thing I'm on holidays. Another shots were taken in the summer, but very early in the morning. Sometimes I wake up 5.00am. My wife ask me if I'm crazy.

The pictures 45 & 47

Zenfolio | Miguel Massanet Amer | Mallorca

Zenfolio | Miguel Massanet Amer | Mallorca

They were taken with the voigtländer 15mm in winter when the sun goes low. This ultrawide lens admit light in different way. The combination with the M8 and its great dinamig range. I underexpose the shot and I edit later with PS. I have to admit that I'm not a expert with PS and was a bit hard.

Best Miguel.

[Paul Hart]

One of the camera makers will eventually get onto what everybody, on every high-end camera forum, seems to want: a small (Leica-sized) FF pro camera with the sensor response of a D3/5D. If that happens before the new Leica comes out, Leica could lose a lot of its more serious patronage (that is, people more involved with image production than with camera.)

 

JC

 

I agree. If, instead of (or as well as) producing collectors' versions of its rangefinder cameras of yesteryear, Nikon were to make a FF digital version at a sensible price...

[SJP]

Thanks Miguel, I think we will be going to Mallorca for our winter holiday then. We have been to Lisbon for christmas a few times which was great (eldest brother lives there). Very good for the soul as NL is very dark that time of year.

Thanks for the info on pics 45 & 47. I will start experimenting.

[tomasis7]

To lighten up this thread . Perhaps not so boring since I recently had a relevant experience in a shady part of London.

 

I was photographing graffiti on the walls of a tunnel (Leake Street, locally known as P*ss Alley) which runs underneath the platforms of Waterloo station. Lighting in the tunnel is low, dirty strip fluorescents which graffiti artists have painted over. There were several other photographers there, all weighed down with large back packs crammed with dSLR equipment - cameras, lenses, flashes and tripods. I had an M8 with 35mm ASPH Summicron.

 

Others were complaining about the flash reflecting straight back off the painted walls, lenses not being wide enough and the light being low. There was much curiosity when they saw me take a picture hand held without flash, take a few steps sideways, take another and repeat as required. When they realized how I'd overcome the wide angle problem they asked about the M8 and were surprised I was able to use the lens at full aperture, something they said they couldn't do if they wanted quality. They could of course avoided using flash but then they would have had to use a tripod. .... The M8 made it all so easy. I've printed the images at 20ins but they would easily go to 40ins or more.

 

ETA: And the camera was discreet enough to capture some of the locals at work without them holding their carrier bags of paint cans up in front of their faces which is what they did when the guys with the dSLRs were around.

 

Bob.

 

love the story "difficult" cameras make us more clever, better photographers.

[danyves]

Shame that Puts wastes his time writing stuff like this when his opinion and testing of lenses is so valuable.

 

Personally, when I am working in some distinctly shady parts of London at odd hours of the day I know which camera I prefer having. One which can easily be whipped out of an innocuous looking bag and put back in again in a flash, does not attract attention and if it does attract attention looks not much bigger than some kind of point and shoot.

 

LouisB

 

Out a bag and in again in a flash. Curious way to use a Leica. Needless.

[bill]

Out a bag and in again in a flash. Curious way to use a Leica. Needless.

 

Were you there, then?

 

Regards,

 

Bill

[farnz]

Were you there, then?

Perhaps he was waiting in the shadows hoping to 'acquire' a Leica ...

 

Pete.

[AlanG]

In the M8 vs. DSLR debate, I see a conflict or contradiction. On one hand there is the opinion that the M8 being a simple non-automatic camera, requires one to think more, be deliberate and thus be a better photographer. The implication is that DSLRs make photography too easy and automatic thus leading to less control and perhaps boring photos.

 

On the other hand, M8 users will say that DSLRs have too many buttons and menus and thus are too complex to learn and use easily and quickly.

 

So which is it?

[jdeed1]

Miguel,I too was very impressed with your portfolio. Looking at the information details on the photos no information is given on the lenses you use. Other than the 15mm you mention what are your other regular lenses, in particular those you used for your "People" section

John

 

 

 

 

Hi Stephen,

Thank you for the compliment. In Mallorca there are not so many tourist as you thing. You have to look for the rigth time. Some of the shots were taken in the winter which is the best time of the year for shooting in Mallorca. Light is much nicer and not tourist at all and no traffic problems. And the best thing I'm on holidays. Another shots were taken in the summer, but very early in the morning. Sometimes I wake up 5.00am. My wife ask me if I'm crazy.

The pictures 45 & 47

Zenfolio | Miguel Massanet Amer | Mallorca

Zenfolio | Miguel Massanet Amer | Mallorca

They were taken with the voigtländer 15mm in winter when the sun goes low. This ultrawide lens admit light in different way. The combination with the M8 and its great dinamig range. I underexpose the shot and I edit later with PS. I have to admit that I'm not a expert with PS and was a bit hard.

Best Miguel.

[glenerrolrd]

Hi Stephen,

Thank you for the compliment. In Mallorca there are not so many tourist as you thing. You have to look for the rigth time. Some of the shots were taken in the winter which is the best time of the year for shooting in Mallorca. Light is much nicer and not tourist at all and no traffic problems. And the best thing I'm on holidays. Another shots were taken in the summer, but very early in the morning. Sometimes I wake up 5.00am. My wife ask me if I'm crazy.

The pictures 45 & 47

Zenfolio | Miguel Massanet Amer | Mallorca

Zenfolio | Miguel Massanet Amer | Mallorca

They were taken with the voigtländer 15mm in winter when the sun goes low. This ultrawide lens admit light in different way. The combination with the M8 and its great dinamig range. I underexpose the shot and I edit later with PS. I have to admit that I'm not a expert with PS and was a bit hard.

Best Miguel.

 

Miguel That is quite a collection and to my eye beautifully processed . I shoot the kite boarders in Florida each winter. Your images are excellent. I have tried working with the M8, the R9/DMR and the D3. Each provides advantages and disadvantages ..but I like the M8 images the best . Roger

[Fotomiguel]

Miguel,I too was very impressed with your portfolio. Looking at the information details on the photos no information is given on the lenses you use. Other than the 15mm you mention what are your other regular lenses, in particular those you used for your "People" section

John

Normally I use the leica 50mm cron as a main lens, shifting to a 28mm elmar or a 75mm cron if I need it. When I need a tele lens I use a D300 with my old nikkor 180mm F2.8, But normally I am too lazy and I leave it at home. For the last 20 months 90% of the files are M8.