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M8.2 Price: $6295 / £3990

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I suppose if we are unable to afford future Leica M cameras, we can always use the supposedly forthcoming Nikon/Contax/Sony DRF made by Cosina. The rumour mill has it that although Leica M lenses will fit, they will not be RF coupled, which seems a strange decision. On the Nikon/Zeiss lenses, the RF coupling will be electronic. Oh well it would work with a WATE anyway. Again the rumour mill says it will use the new Nikon high speed FX sensor, with only 6 to 7 MP but an ISO range up to 51400.

 

 

Wilson

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Guest stnami
Ahhh, so what you're saying is that that's the way it is, just accept it. In one way, you're just telling me to be quiet. Similarly jaap is saying the same thing, 'if you think the price is not justified then don't buy it"

 

Ahhhaa!! remember people like Jaap and Steve are dentists, lawyers, MPs etc and not photographers so they have only some sense of the requirements of the photographic industry. Yes they will state they have friends who are photographers blah blah etc.........well I have friends who are doctors, dentists but this doesn't mean I really comprehend the core nature of their business.

Many here buy Leica because the can afford to, it makes them feel good and sorta puckers up the ego at times. So they will defend and defend, defend

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£3990 is just totally absurd.

 

That's about £1,000 less than a DMR back and R9 body, when the DMR came out.

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Good. Andy just amended his post which said, "looks like a bargain to me." Good sense prevailed as he realised it's not a bargain after all

. thanks for crossing over to our side of the argument.

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You are choosing to miss jackal's point which is the signal that the M8.2 price sends regarding the M system road map. Those of us currently invested in the system will need to think carefully about whether we see a long term future with it.

 

 

 

Not at all; on the contrary, I made the point that it was a business decision for a pro. Stay with the current camera, switch to the new one or switch systems alltogether? That will be for the individual to decide, but it certainly is not a basis for a value judgement.

Professionals, contrary to popular myth, have never been a substantial part of Leica's customer base. The bulk of cameras and lenses have alway been sold to committed amateurs. That famous photographers have been using Leica cameras and that current-day top men can be seen doing so is a nice marketing thing, but does not put money in the bank directly.

I am sure these things have been carefully considered by Leica's marketing department before setting the prices. Time will tell if they were right.

 

 

And, Imants, dentists at least are confronted with the need to buy extremely expensive tools for their business, and are faced with similar problems. I don't think anybody needs to be fully into familiar with intricacies of the craft to understand the basic economic and professional balancing act involved.

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Good. Andy just amended his post which said, "looks like a bargain to me." Good sense prevailed as he realised it's not a bargain after all

. thanks for crossing over to our side of the argument.

Not at all. I just didn't want to be inflamatory, so edited my response. Thanks for bringing it back

 

I just think that these things need to be kept in context that's all.

 

No one who ever bought their first Leica did so thinking that they were getting into a cheap, massed produced system.

 

Even a 48 year old M2 like mine costs the same as a consumer dSLR with more knobs on than a fitted kitchen.

 

Leica's have never been and never will be cheap.

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Don't take offence, Andy. Are you a fashion designer? I have noticed that you call your recent photo album as "Spring Collection" And designers have money, I guess:p

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Ahhhaa!! remember people like Jaap and Steve are dentists, lawyers, MPs etc and not photographers ...

 

Steve can answer for himself, but is just a normal chap, who has a normal job. Like most of us.

 

Whether either of the two you mention consider themselves "photographers" is open to interpretation, I suppose.

 

There are lots of normal people who have expensive hobbies, don't forget.

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and .......... ?

 

 

And what?

 

That was 3+ years ago.

 

This new body is at least £1,000 cheaper than that combination. That's all I am saying.

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Don't take offence, Andy. Are you a fashion designer? I have noticed that you call your recent photo album as "Spring Collection":p

 

No.

 

I am not a fashion designer.

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.....the signal that the M8.2 price sends regarding the M system road map. Those of us currently invested in the system will need to think carefully about whether we see a long term future with it.....

 

A good point Ian.

 

Leica kit is and no doubt always will be very expensive, I take that as a given, but I do now wonder what any future full-frame M9 is likely to cost (or indeed any sensor upgrade for existing cameras).

 

As an amateur, with only one body and two or three lenses at any one time, I don't have major system-change cost concerns. Nevertheless, even though I might be lucky enough to be able to afford to upgrade, I would find it hard to justify at the likely price level.

 

Still a week to photokina though and I still think that the really big news is yet to come.

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Here is my analysis (take it for what it's worth); the current market price for a used M8 is $3400-3900 (on ebay). Had the 8.2 come in at the same list price as the M8 the used prices would have dropped $600-800 (my best guess). Since the M8.2 comes in at a higher price the used M8 prices should remain stable. So if I sell my M8 I've gained $600-800 thanks to the increased M8.2 price. If I choose to get the M8.2 I get the quiet shutter, the hardened glass, the delayed cocking, improved framelines, SDHC, better leatherette, black logo, black hot shoe and black paint for a net of about $1200 (US).

 

For my part, the new M8.2 has the improvements I was hoping for, looks great and at a premium of $1200 I just might do it. I think it's all good.

 

Expensive stuff is expensive. BMW vs. Honda - we could argue it all day. My concern is that if this upgrade substantially increases the price, just imagine what an upgraded sensor will cost us?

 

SInce the pricing that we are discussing is based on a very small sample we should also wait to hear what the official list price is and what dealers are willing to take for the new camera before we grind our molars to dust by gnashing our teeth over it - although I suppose that scenario would help our dentist friends better afford the camera

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... but I do now wonder what any future full-frame M9 is likely to cost ...

Steve,

 

As with any consumer goods it will cost what the market can stand; too expensive and it won't sell and will have to be discounted, too cheap and sales will outstrip supply and the price will rise.

 

Pete.

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Here is my analysis (take it for what it's worth); the current market price for a used M8 is $3400-3900 (on ebay). Had the 8.2 come it at the same list price as the M8 the used prices would have dropped $600-800 (my best guess). Since the M8.2 comes in at a higher price the used M8 prices should remain stable. So if I sell my M8 I've gained $600-800 thanks to the increased M8.2 price. If I choose to get the M8.2 I get the quiet shutter, the hardened glass, the delayed cocking, improved framelines, SDHC, better leatherette, black logo, black hot shoe and black paint for a net of about $1200 (US).

 

For my part, the new M8.2 has the improvements I was hoping for, looks great and at a premium of $1200 I just might do it. I think it's all good.

 

Expensive stuff is expensive. BMW vs. Honda - we could argue it all day. My concern is that if this upgrade substantially increases the price, just imagine what an upgraded sensor will cost us?

 

SInce the pricing that we are discussing is based on a very small sample we should also wait to hear what the official list price is and what dealers are willing to take for the new camera before we grind our molars to dust by gnashing our teeth over it - although I suppose that scenario would help our dentist friends better afford the camera

 

 

 

Not sure I can follow your math? As the M8.2 actually starts to ship ,some photographers that use their cameras(meaning that the camera shows normal wear) will begin to trade for the newer model. Unless you have a mint camera (essentially not used) you will be lucky to net $3295 . So ,at least in the USA, your upgrade will cost you at least $3000 plus any tax .

 

Interim models (m8.2 as opposed to a new model M9) can rarely be justified as an upgrade ..unless the M8 is viewed as quite used and potentially unreliable. A better comparison is the M8 ($5495) verse the M8.2($6295) . For an additional $800 , the new model has a list of improvements which at least provide some new value to justify the increase.

 

The most important factor will be the potential for a FF M9. This would be a full model change giving photographers justification to trade immediately . That would deflate the value of the M8 and M8.2 in a more significant way.

 

So my point of view is that interim models ...extend the products life cycle by improving the value to new owners and by creating incremental sales to exisiting owners. Short of a FF(new sensor) model not much else Leica could do .

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My lenses are worth more today than they were several years ago. My 3 yr old Canon is not worth much at all.

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Ahhhaa!! remember people like Jaap and Steve are dentists, lawyers, MPs etc and not photographers so they have only some sense of the requirements of the photographic industry. Yes they will state they have friends who are photographers blah blah etc...

 

No I'm not a _professional_ photographer, I earn living in a different profession. A bit like yourself I guess. However I rather resent the implication in your post that I'm not a photographer of any kind.

 

I certainly don't have the money to buy any of the new lenses or camera, but that doesn't mean that others won't have.

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Not sure I can follow your math? As the M8.2 actually starts to ship ,some photographers that use their cameras(meaning that the camera shows normal wear) will begin to trade for the newer model. Unless you have a mint camera (essentially not used) you will be lucky to net $3295 . So ,at least in the USA, your upgrade will cost you at least $3000 plus any tax .

 

Interim models (m8.2 as opposed to a new model M9) can rarely be justified as an upgrade ..unless the M8 is viewed as quite used and potentially unreliable. A better comparison is the M8 ($5495) verse the M8.2($6295) . For an additional $800 , the new model has a list of improvements which at least provide some new value to justify the increase.

 

The most important factor will be the potential for a FF M9. This would be a full model change giving photographers justification to trade immediately . That would deflate the value of the M8 and M8.2 in a more significant way.

 

So my point of view is that interim models ...extend the products life cycle by improving the value to new owners and by creating incremental sales to exisiting owners. Short of a FF(new sensor) model not much else Leica could do .

It will be better economically to upgrade an M8classic.

1. you only pay for what you want.

2. you buy the extra guarantee.

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No I'm not a _professional_ photographer, I earn living in a different profession. A bit like yourself I guess. However I rather resent the implication in your post that I'm not a photographer of any kind.

I initially decided to let that one pass by, Steve, but now that you mention it : +1, especially coming from somebody who, afaik, has shown no evidence of being a photographer himself.

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