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Going back to film

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I can understand the attraction. I'm still not comfortable handling all the color management issues when trying to get a good print from either an M8 DNG or JPG image.

 

But for me, going back to film in more complex since I always preferred the C-41 process. (Very comfortable with my trusty Nikon film scanner.) Finding a good local lab to process the film is nearly impossible. I can't afford a pro lab solution from either a cost and time perspective.

 

So we struggle on with the M8. I have retained a Voigtlander R2M for an occasional roll of film when I want to remember the "good ol' days."

 

-g

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I am inclined to agree Andy.

 

Interesting observation: I just installed Firefox 3 AND activated colour profiles (thanks for the help Steve!). I have just compared your 3 pics on Opera, (still my favourite browser), and the new Firefox set up. For images Firefox is a clear winner. Opera displayed your pics nicely, but Firefox gave extra depth and color with nicer contrast. I just wish Firefox would incorporate a couple of the Opera features and would blitz the field.

 

Are you going to add Hagas (sp) to your favourite list next week Andy?

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I welcome a film vs digital debate, within the confines of a sensible discussion of equipment and technique.

 

Instead of film vs digital, think “when would I pick up my M6 or M7 as opposed to my M8 and how would I use it differently?.

 

Hell, I hate to sound so moderate and diplomatic. There are people out there who’ve NEVER shot film and will tell you that digital is better. I want a film vs digital debate – wherever it is relevant - because I never want to stop hearing from people who can bring their film experience to help me get more from digital.

 

(I did edit the quote a bit, but...)

 

Agree.

 

I had to laugh at myself as I first started learning the M8. I started out over 40 years ago with a 2 1/4 x 3 1/4 Graflex press camera -- and a strobe with a battery that weighed almost as much a my scrawny 14-year-old self. A lot of film in a lot of different circumstances. And a shit to mostly digital.

 

The remarks (paraphrased here) about valuing the differences between film and digital -- because of what they tell us about our craft and art -- are spot on.

 

Where I laughed at myself had to do with my two camera brains. Though I hadn't done it consciously, I had developed a digital photo brain and a film digital brain. All those do-dads on the DSLRs had my head in a different place that where it was when I picked up a film RF. Hmmm.

 

Then I found out that I couldn't treat the M8 like a DLSR. Not, on the other hand, totally like a film camera -- but darn close. Like (I suspect) others in the forum, that has made me take another look at what I'm shooting, and how I'm shooting. That's a good thing. Reaching back into my memories about shooting in film ... Considering the differences or similarities.

 

There seems to be a certain amount of B.S. that goes along with the perpetual film v digital "debate". But mostly I tolerate it because it is also possible to pick up some interesting points of view from those on the periphery who happen by with a comment or two without the chest thumping.

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Dye transfer printing is history, because the process involved too much contamination.

 

 

As a side note, I was under the impression that dye transfer printing is history because Kodak, who own the patents to the process, discontinued the product line.

 

If there is more info on the matter, I'd be curious to hear the story.

 

 

-J.

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"Onepic," the original poster, is decidedly not a troll. He's a dedicated photographer who has shot a lot of both film and digital.

 

--Peter

 

Thanks Peter. It's become hard to write a simple "i like this or i do this" post in this forum without being torn apart by pitbulls. i posted in the film forum, too, btw. friendly folks over there.

 

i've owned many cameras from 4x5 to 6x7, 6x6, 645, Digital backs, DSLR, M6, M7, M8, MP, and I still own and use many of them. i definitively know enough to being able to come to my own conclusions in the film vs digital discussion, and have no need to discuss this subject publicly.

 

happy shooting!

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Originally Posted by Rolo

...It's a choice, not a competition

 

Agreed.

+1+1

After a while with the M8... it's such a pleasure(!) to use a film M, with lenses long accustomed... wonderful to have the choice!

 

Although, EXIF data is helpful

 

rgds,

Dave

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Thanks Peter. It's become hard to write a simple "i like this or i do this" post in this forum without being torn apart by pitbulls. i posted in the film forum, too, btw. friendly folks over there.

 

i've owned many cameras from 4x5 to 6x7, 6x6, 645, Digital backs, DSLR, M6, M7, M8, MP, and I still own and use many of them. i definitively know enough to being able to come to my own conclusions in the film vs digital discussion, and have no need to discuss this subject publicly.

 

happy shooting!

 

 

I couldn't agree more. What have I done:eek:

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Rollo,

 

A bit hard to tell: a game, or a serious question? I'll give credit to the latter, though your first option must be a spoof, since a light table is only a means of sorting:

 

The photographers I know work on projects or portfolios with some preferred output in mind: gallery show, portrait, specific commercial application; or just a personal undertaking related to some sort of photo group or web-sharing.

 

I can imagine working for an art director who wants images for use in multiple modes, but would have to query him/her about what use is most critical, or whether the goal is only a common denominator.

 

I tried to say that the photographer has to figure out what he or she most wants to end up with, & then chose equipment & processes accordingly; so it's hard for anyone to make recommendations to anyone else.

 

As I tried to say, no obvious 'right' choices; it's just what you want to end up with.

 

K

 

Kirk,

One Pic wrote: "And my Fuji slides look soooo beautiful on the light table..." and you respond that slides are not an end product. Surely, OPic is the decision maker here, not you, or me, or the art directors you know. I know dozens of photographers that have only ever shot slides, have boxes and boxes of them and have never made prints or posted on the internet. Their end product was slides.

 

Your references to the light box and spoofing were unnecessary. And, informative as it is to the inexperienced here, your lessons in satisfying customer needs are just plain off topic.

 

Take a good look at OnePic's images at Flickr: one pic a day's Photostream . IMO he has provided some of the best images to our Forum in the last year and is perfectly capable of deciding what his end product and means of acquisition will be.

 

Rolo

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Then why did he post in the M8 forum??? This is not the film forum or the I dislike digital and love film forum.

His original post would of been better suited in the film forum, where someone might care.

.

 

I appreciate his posting and was happy to see his reference to the M8 in the M8 Forum and I , for one, care.

 

I care because I'm interested to learn the reasons why competent photographers, who can display a body of work I respect, would decide to return to film after investing in digital kit and mastering the digital skills. That's whether it be M8, which I'm especially interested in, or any other digital capture device.

 

That interest stems from my own heavy commitment/investment to digital photography whilst retaining loads of film camera equipment in full knowledge that one day I'll be using it as the primary means of capture. One day, IMO, professional/art photographers will promote their use of film as a selling feature.

 

BTW OnePic did not refer to a dislike of digital which is a Troll comment from you, IMO.

 

Rolo

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Guest wls.shanghai

....good news,

 

welcome back to the "real"

 

photography

 

Regards

wls

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Guest jimmy pro
Thanks Peter. It's become hard to write a simple "i like this or i do this" post in this forum without being torn apart by pitbulls. i posted in the film forum, too, btw. friendly folks over there.

 

Oh puhleeze, give us a break. Try posting this in the Film Forum:

 

"After using the MP daily for 19 months, I have decided to go back to digital, I bought an M8 one week ago and haven't touched the MP since.

 

The difference is substantial and I feel like I've come home. I will probably sell the MP. Just doesn't give me the feeling I have when photographing with the M8.

 

And my DNG's look soooo beautiful on the monitor..."

 

Then let us know how friendly the film zelotts are.

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Thanks Peter. It's become hard to write a simple "i like this or i do this" post in this forum without being torn apart by pitbulls. i posted in the film forum, too, btw. friendly folks over there.

 

happy shooting!

Go over there and post that you are leaving film and going all digital, or even almost anything about the M8, and see how friendly they really are.

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Oh puhleeze, give us a break. Try posting this in the Film Forum:

 

"After using the MP daily for 19 months, I have decided to go back to digital, I bought an M8 one week ago and haven't touched the MP since.

 

The difference is substantial and I feel like I've come home. I will probably sell the MP. Just doesn't give me the feeling I have when photographing with the M8.

 

And my DNG's look soooo beautiful on the monitor..."

 

Then let us know how friendly the film zelotts are.

 

Amen to that!

 

Now, not only is film better but the forum members are nicer. Wow! I think I'll sell my M8 and move over there.

 

I feel sick, think I just ate some troll bait.

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Then let us know how friendly the film zelotts are.

 

That would be their problem, not the photogrqapher's.

 

It's not black and white (no pun intended), it's about personal preference.

 

So often people seem to think that if _they_ do something a certain way then that's the only way that it can be done and anyone who doesn't think the same way as them is wrong. If someone prefers film and I prefer digital, that's ok, it's allowed, there's no right or wrong involved. I don't like broccoli, lots of people do, that doesn't mean I think broccoli should be banned.

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… Interesting observation: I just installed Firefox 3 AND activated colour profiles (thanks for the help Steve!).

 

Sorry if it is OT but I would really like to know how you do this?

 

Jeff

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I am about to buy my first Leica. I cannot make my mind up about the M8 or the MP I really want an MP but I keep hearing people say film will soon be hard to come by and get developed. I still think film produces far sharper and far better quality than digital

 

It was recommended to me when I bought my M8--and I was looking at a backup film camera (Leica)--that I seriously look into the M6TTL. I had asked almost the same question you have asked--should I buy an MP? I bought the M6TTL (in Ex+ condition, used like twice by its original owner) from a reputable dealer for about 1/4th the price of an MP. Tastes vary--and it's not an MP in terms of tank-like build, nor is it "new"--but I can say it's been great to shoot with. And it was a good value buy. Depending on your situation you might want to stick toes in the water with an M6TTL and then move forward to the M8 (or by then an M8-2) when you're ready. You will be "trained" on the Leica body/rangerfinder working style on the M6TTL (if you aren't now) when you make the jump.

 

Good luck,

Will

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It's very difficult to say something general about things that are not general. Maybe it's stupid to try? but isn't it also a part of what makes us humans?

 

I've come across a few strongly opinionated persons, and they all have the same in common, that what makes them is the same as what brakes them. I tend to like photos, music and paintings that in some way shows the person who made them. I find it easier to chose and more satisfying when everything is not boiled down to mediocrity.

 

/Henrik

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