pierovitch Posted June 14, 2008 Share #21 Posted June 14, 2008 Advertisement (gone after registration) Shock and horror. A Leica camera is not perfect for a particular role which most will luckily never experience. I guess its that machismo that some products trade on. Such as "I don't drive at 300 km/h but my car could if I wanted to". Back to home manufacturing polaroid type 55 to keep my potential to emulate Ansel Adams credibility alive. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 14, 2008 Posted June 14, 2008 Hi pierovitch, Take a look here Leica M8 bashed by Michael Kamber. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
chilihead Posted June 14, 2008 Share #22 Posted June 14, 2008 I trust every single word in the article - he was brutally honest, and that quality is reflected in his work. Thanks for testing the M8 Michael - someone had to do it! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
offshore Posted June 14, 2008 Share #23 Posted June 14, 2008 This is not meant to be an excuse for Leica and the results that came about from this article but I wonder how many photojournalists really use Leica. If the market is small (I would imagine very small) perhaps Leica chose to get out of this market segment and pursue the market they are currently in with a camera that is cheaper to produce. I certainly haven't put my M8 through the rigors of combat photography but also have not been gentle with it. It went over on a tripod once and came out completely unscathed and is constantly getting knocked around when I hike with it (I know, before anyone jumps down my throat that there is no comparison). For me and the way I've treated my equipment in the past this camera has taken a lot of abuse and has come through for me every time. Still, not a very complimentary article but perhaps a wake up call. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted June 15, 2008 Share #24 Posted June 15, 2008 I trust every single word in the article - he was brutally honest, and that quality is reflected in his work. Thanks for testing the M8 Michael - someone had to do it! I hope that his 'work' is more complete than his test report. Whilst 'honest' in what he presented as his assessment, it was not 'complete' in that any good aspects were conveniently overlooked, which really turns his "brutally honest" report into simply "brutal." Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanG Posted June 15, 2008 Share #25 Posted June 15, 2008 I hope that his 'work' is more complete than his test report. Whilst 'honest' in what he presented as his assessment, it was not 'complete' in that any good aspects were conveniently overlooked, which really turns his "brutally honest" report into simply "brutal." Other than that, how did you like the play Mrs. Lincoln? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest s.m.e.p. Posted June 15, 2008 Share #26 Posted June 15, 2008 I trust every single word in the article - he was brutally honest, and that quality is reflected in his work. Thanks for testing the M8 Michael - someone had to do it! I also want to say thanks to Michael. For me real Photographer´s test counts more than the tests of LEICA collectors or people who take pictures of their grandchildren. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jimmy pro Posted June 15, 2008 Share #27 Posted June 15, 2008 Advertisement (gone after registration) I also want to say thanks to Michael. For me real Photographer´s test counts more than the tests of LEICA collectors or people who take pictures of their grandchildren. I'm sure most Leica M8 owners agree. When there not dusting there Leica collection or playing with the grandkids Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted June 15, 2008 Share #28 Posted June 15, 2008 Or even dusting their grandkids and playing with their Leicas for that matter. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted June 15, 2008 Share #29 Posted June 15, 2008 How many threads on this subject do we want to keep going guys. There were three this morning - one of which is now locked. Do you want to combine the remaining two into one, lock one, leave both open or just start afresh? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHAG Posted June 15, 2008 Author Share #30 Posted June 15, 2008 Or even dusting their grandkids and playing with their Leicas for that matter. I just dust my kids. For the grandkids, I'll have to wait. Am I still a photographer ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saloti Posted June 15, 2008 Share #31 Posted June 15, 2008 Let us sum up the facts, guys: 1. A reporter, representing 1/10.000 of the possible occasions of use for the M8, gives valid feedback on this definitely incomplete camera. Excellent. 2. Leica should read the words of this reporter and study all feedbacks from others, who might not only take pictures of their grandparents and/or -children. 3. Leica will improve the product, we WILL see. If they don´t, they will not survive. But Leica will. 4. Taking (!) pictures has both a rational and emotional dimension. Let us accept that there are honourable people out there stressing more the one and the other dimension. 5. There are many people out there, who like/want to work with the M8, despite of all weaknesses we discuss in this forum very frequently. Good evening. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted June 15, 2008 Share #32 Posted June 15, 2008 Andy-- One is more than enough. I say kill 'em all. 1) The topic is wandering in both remaining threads. 2) Most of the on-topic new posts are simply rehashing the same points already raised multiple times. 3) I'm wasting too much time reading all of them to see if anything new has been said. 4) No matter what you do, in another week someone will start a new thread on the same topic. <g> Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blakley Posted June 15, 2008 Share #33 Posted June 15, 2008 Re: professional cameras. Hurley used LF with glass plates. Kamber would undoubtedly have found it unsatisfactory too, but it's hard to argue that he works in more difficult conditions than Hurley did. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisC Posted June 15, 2008 Share #34 Posted June 15, 2008 Andy-- One is more than enough....kill 'em all.... Howard - Always a pleasure to agree with you. But we are really sad gits to keep reading aren't we? I remember a serious thread we both took part in a long time ago when I stated that Leica had 'dropped a bollock' with the premature release of the M8. I bought one anyway, but the internet noise generated by the Kamber article will undoubtedly cost Leica sales now, regardless of the work-arounds and firmware improvements we on the forum know. The Kamber article is a sadly continuing price for those early dropped bollocks, as is Michael Johnson's joyous crowing over the article because he thinks it spares him blushes for his own sloppy journalism about the M8 too. Damn, I've just continued the thread....... ......... Chris Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
graeme_hutton Posted June 15, 2008 Share #35 Posted June 15, 2008 I'm sure most Leica M8 owners agree. When there not dusting there Leica collection or playing with the grandkids I think the grandkids v's war photographer comment is a bit worn and lame, sorry. It takes two extreme caricatures and juxtaposes them for effect....genteel family loving homely type v's action hero.......both (and their subject matter) are capable of excellent, or very poor photography. One does not prohibit the other.....besides, I bet every 'war' photographer has another side to them.......This on Don McCullin from 'The Guardian': "............. nowadays, he's taken on another persona, that of the solitary artist closeted away in Somerset. I wonder if he's any happier with who he is, recording nothing more savage than bare trees and winter skies." Graeme Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
plasticman Posted June 15, 2008 Share #36 Posted June 15, 2008 Come on guys - what is this about always locking-down negative threads? It really is difficult to air dissatisfaction about the camera on this forum for the last year. The mistake that a lot of you make is that you seem to think that because you own an M8 this alone gives you the right of veto over discussing it. But buying one or two pieces of Leica equipment doesn't actually give you sole rights to the general discussion of where Leica is going, or where it's going wrong. There are many others of us out here who also have bought a great number of Leica items and have an opinion about the current direction and what's going to happen in the future. Let the forum accommodate those people too - anyone, in fact - whether it's a problem that's been discussed before or not. There's a shrill and defensive tone to the forum - it feels like I'm watching a child holding their hands over their ears and screaming "I'm not listening!" - but the problems are real, and some of us want Leica to hear them and deal with them - for the sake of their own future, and the future of the great company they once were. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted June 15, 2008 Share #37 Posted June 15, 2008 Come on guys - what is this about always locking-down negative threads? It really is difficult to air dissatisfaction about the camera on this forum for the last year. There is no policy about locking down negative threads. Why would there be? And where have you not been able to air dissatisfaction? There are hundreds of threads here expressing dissatisfaction with everything from the on/off switch to the baseplate. And all things in between However, what is the point of having three threads on exactly the same topic? Why not just have one, then everyone can see what's being discussed in one place. Avoids unnecessary duplication too. Make no mistake - Leica know exactly what the issues are with the M8 and are doing something about them. How could they NOT know? You should have been in Hessenpark on Friday, when you could have heard Herr Daniel speak with us on this very subject Oh, and by the way, I don't own an M8, nor will I. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
plasticman Posted June 15, 2008 Share #38 Posted June 15, 2008 Make no mistake - Leica know exactly what the issues are with the M8 and are doing something about them. How could they NOT know? You should have been in Hessenpark on Friday, when you could have heard Herr Daniel speak with us on this very subject So Andy - two points: 1. Whenever topics like this come up the general response on this forum is a mixture of "this has already been done to death/nothing new" and/or "this person obviously has no idea what they're talking about", and/or "the latest firmware has fixed all these problems". How on earth would the company ever have heard these problems if the most fanatical Leica-faithful had had their way and silenced all the criticism? (btw all of the above have been said about Michael Kamber's review) 2. What did Herr Daniel say? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted June 15, 2008 Share #39 Posted June 15, 2008 But we are really sad gits to keep reading aren't we?... Damn, I've just continued the thread....... :D:D I laughed out loud at that. Speaking of Michael Johnston, I attempted to calm him down by posting a link to the Weeks article (Chris - Uber - this may sting...) and got back a note from him "You think I'm going to LINK to that guy? That's just what he wants, to try to appropriate a bit of my traffic for his "week" site." Everybody is getting hassled for this, and we're the suckers for reading it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted June 15, 2008 Share #40 Posted June 15, 2008 So Andy - two points: 2. What did Herr Daniel say? You had to be there... Oh, and you had to understand German* * Fortunately, I had two tame Norwegians with me, both of whom are fluent. Unlike me. They told me that the M9 is coming in September. It will have a larger than full frame sensor, cost only €1,000, and will be made in South Africa. So, there you have it. Straight from the horse's mouth. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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