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Would you give Leica a free hand in M9 design?

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Didn't Minolta do that job for Leica in the past for their SLRs?

 

They've changed their name to Sony now.

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The only choice we have, and as individuals only, is to buy or not to buy.

 

Well, if the forum could decide whether to buy it or not, then it's a big decision.

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Do they have to get our permission?

I hope Leica will have a better strategy than justfollowing a few people in web based photo-forums.

Coming on this forum I wonder why some of the posters are not working as product managers for Leica or Nikon or whatever company? At least some seem to feel they could do this job better than the people who actually do this job. (I dont think so)

Cheers, Tom

 

Aw come on Tom! You have no opinions? Nothing interesting to say about this? Come on - give me one opinion about the design of the camera you like and would hope that Leica keeps in the next version?

Really, I'm interested.

You know this is the way it goes: someone throws up a question - and then other people throw in their constructive and fascinating opinions - and then people keep coming back because the discussion is so cool and fun.

 

Ok - I'll start the ball rolling again: what about if Leica said the M9 was gonna be RED? Let's say, red rubber covering. Waddya think? Would you buy it?

 

You see how this works?

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Aw come on Tom! You have no opinions? Nothing interesting to say about this? Come on - give me one opinion about the design of the camera you like and would hope that Leica keeps in the next version?

Really, I'm interested.

You know this is the way it goes: someone throws up a question - and then other people throw in their constructive and fascinating opinions - and then people keep coming back because the discussion is so cool and fun.

 

Ok - I'll start the ball rolling again: what about if Leica said the M9 was gonna be RED? Let's say, red rubber covering. Waddya think? Would you buy it?

 

You see how this works?

 

 

The problem isn't that LUF members don't have opinions, rather that there's no shortage of opinions. And while everyone is entitled to their opinions of what Leica should/should not do, voicing them so freely often sets the precedence of feelings of entitlement--as we have seen through many recent threads.

 

That......is MY opinion.

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Would I give Leica a free hand in M9 design?

 

Interesting question. I read somewhere that an architect encouraged social housing tenants to decide the main elements of apartments to replace their slum tenements. The outcome was unusual and eccentric, but a great communal place to live.

 

If Leica asked us our opinions on the design of the M9, the results might well be unusual and eccentric, but a great camera for us all? I'm not so sure ....

 

On the other hand, I do have strong views on the ergonomics and features of a future M9 and I would love to be consulted. The first thing I'd say is "small, discreet and deceptively simple, please" because for me, these parameters (not the fact that the M8 is a rangefinder) differentiate the M8 from cameras which are its peers in other respects.

 

Lose these distinguishing features and the next Leica will be a second rate Canonikon, no matter how well its built, nor the quantity of titanium and brass, nor even the qualities of its glass will make it stand apart.

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The problem isn't that LUF members don't have opinions, rather that there's no shortage of opinions. And while everyone is entitled to their opinions of what Leica should/should not do, voicing them so freely often sets the precedence of feelings of entitlement--as we have seen through many recent threads.

 

That......is MY opinion.

 

Okay - I get it now - we musn't discuss anything strictly non-photography related on these forums because if we do it turns us all into spoilt brats.

 

Now I get it - thanks 35mm! It's all crystal clear now. Sorry I wasted your time. Okay folks - back to work. Nothing to see here. No discussions allowed. Move along - discussing is not good for you!

 

Ah the internet - it's a serious business.

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Guest rweisz

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So will we give Leica a free hand in designing a future digital M camera body?

 

Based on reading this forum for a while, I highly doubt it

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Okay - I get it now - we musn't discuss anything strictly non-photography related on these forums because if we do it turns us all into spoilt brats.

 

Now I get it - thanks 35mm! It's all crystal clear now. Sorry I wasted your time. Okay folks - back to work. Nothing to see here. No discussions allowed. Move along - discussing is not good for you!

 

Ah the internet - it's a serious business.

 

 

haha, spot on!!

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Well I bought an M8 today, my D300 went kerputt last night and I am going to swap for an M8, even though it is older tech, and is getting older looking spec wise by the day it is still the only option if you want a small camera with great glass which produces excellent results for 80% of situations.

 

If the design changed I wouldn't really care, I am not fussed about FF, I am not fussed about higher reolutions either, I would like lower noise at 1250 and 2500 iso and for that I would upgrade tomorrow, but, not if it meant the body and lenses had to be bigger.

 

So Leica have to be careful, I am sure alot of people like the M range because of their size, changing that would be a big mistake imho.

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So Leica have to be careful, I am sure alot of people like the M range because of their size, changing that would be a big mistake imho.

 

Right. Would be self defeating.

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I have a feeling that part of the struggle Leica will have with the M9 is fitting everything they want inside of the body as it is now "configured." I seriously doubt they will abandon the M look and feel altogether, though it may need to grow in size and they are probably struggling with that, and the ergonomics surrounding that decision.

 

I would certainly hope they have lots of stuff up on the drawing board to choose from. And I would hope they are consulting with some pro photographers, esp of the Magnum/VII ilk. I think they could have pushed the 8 a little bit farther, though I also realize they were under a time crunch.

 

I would be fine with a slightly taller camera (like a film M with a Leicavit attached). It might actually help balance out the added thickness.

 

They are probably struggling with:

 

FF (I'd be fine with 1.2 or 1.1 myself)

 

making even quieter than recent upgrade

 

faster bigger buffer (means more guts)

 

better/more external displays and controls (iso/ev, etc)

 

bigger/better preview screen

 

better flash TTL (lose the annoying preflash)

 

LCD framelines / full time shutter speed display in vf

 

all around more robustness and QC

 

adding a manual wind (maybe??? though doubtful)

 

lighter?

 

And the list could go on.

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There was a prototype M6 that was quite different from the M-Leicas that came before it, but Leica decided not to take the risk and the M6 ended up using the same chassis as the earlier M4. I've attached a link to the picture below. Personally I would have bought it if it was well made.

 

What I would really like from Leica is the same rangefinder focussing direct viewfinder and a small compact and very well made camera that is compatible with M-lenses. The M8 is too big and it is not as well made as a M6.

 

I don't mind if Leica changed the ergonomics or user interface or added radical features (electronic framelines, dual magnification .58x and .80x VF, larger exit pupil, autofocus, live view) because I think Leica would know what they're doing and maybe they need a fresh interpretation for a compact digital RF. Maybe Leica should continue to make the M8 and introduce a new M9 that has revolutionary features and sell them concurrently.

 

It would be nice if the M9's sensor has high ISO thats as good or better than the Canon 1D MK III.

 

 

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better flash TTL (lose the annoying preflash)

 

YES!

 

That preflash makes the SF24D practically useless for photographing children or animals, who have no problem closing their eyes just in time for the exposure.

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Aw come on Tom! You have no opinions? Nothing interesting to say about this? Come on - give me one opinion about the design of the camera you like and would hope that Leica keeps in the next version?

Really, I'm interested.

You know this is the way it goes: someone throws up a question - and then other people throw in their constructive and fascinating opinions - and then people keep coming back because the discussion is so cool and fun.

 

Ok - I'll start the ball rolling again: what about if Leica said the M9 was gonna be RED? Let's say, red rubber covering. Waddya think? Would you buy it?

 

You see how this works?

 

 

Asking "would you buy it" is a good question, but "Would you give Leica a free hand in M9 design?" I cant answer because its not my decission.

 

My opinion regarding your question is: I like the traditional design but I am also open for changes and innovation., as long as it works good.

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i just want my M8 but covered with proper leather

that'll do

 

 

more interested in taking pictures personally

 

 

 

 

& let's just hope leica don't come on here and witness all the bickering and self-aggrandising

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My answer is yes. They get to design, build, price and market the camera -- my job is to decide whether to buy it or not. Pretty simple.

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Beat me to it Frank. Free hand? Yes of course. As for whether I'd want to buy the result (which for me is the important question), well that depends on what they produce.

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Would we give Leica a free hand in designing their own product?

What strength do we deal from? Zero.

 

So, we will.

 

Having said that we, and Leica, better remember what happened in 1971. Leica designed a superior product; I still have and love my M5; the market rejected it and Leica almost went bankrupt.

 

They remember this more then we do; with so many of you having entered the Leica fold years after the M5.

 

Ask me again please. I wish Leica would gather their guts and put out a digital equivalent of the M5. That would be something.

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Guest malland

It's an interesting question: whether the conservatism of the existing customer base, many of whom have bought only used M-camera and lenses, would permit, in the sense of buying, a new camera that was not at all like an M and could not use M lenses. My feeling is that this would not have been an important issue if Leica could have developed a camera like the Ricoh GRD/GRD2, which would have been a great success, but for the development of which Leica simply did not have and still do not have the financial, technical or manpower resources. Unfortunately Leica has been in this mode since the M5 debacle so many years ago. For years Porsche was stuck with the 911 albatross, but now have developed to the position in which they may acquire Volkswagen. I don't see a similar way out for Leica.

 

BTW, I have said ad nauseum that the GRD/GRD2 are the cameras that Leica should have developed, and therefore can't resist — photography being about the pictuers after all — posting a couple of GRD2 pictures at ISO 200 here, and a third one at ISO 1600 (taken with the 40mm EFL tele-converter and intentional camera-shake):

 

 

 

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/applications/core/interface/imageproxy/imageproxy.php?img=http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2357/2311953385_fcb278a418_o.jpg&key=78c1bb2bcce01a80d4bc454b7f78b06796841c05a4c2455f01b9af5a43e481a2">

 

 

 

 

/applications/core/interface/imageproxy/imageproxy.php?img=http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2305/2301951414_e49ae8894f_o.jpg&key=a33ff28795f21790bf5ecc8990f7123203fc8b4dba043818c8d901730f5793b8">

 

 

 

—Mitch/Bangkok

Flickr: Photos from Mitch Alland

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