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pascal_meheut

Making the forum more useful

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In another thread someone asked "what have you learned here ?".

 

Well, so many things I will not list them but this is becoming harder and harder.

Because many threads are now quickly polluted by people who apparently want to do nothing else than complaining or give lectures in marketing and management and so forth.

 

The useful informations or basic common sense given by people Guy Mancuso, Sean Reid and the many others I respect here is drowned in a flow of whining about price, service...

 

Is there any way to get the Signal/Noise ratio higher so we read a thread about facts sometimes without being exposed to complaints about AWB after it has been fixed or "Company management 101" ?

 

It could be to create "facts only" threads, or a more extensive moderation, or some ignore lists because most of the offensive or useless posts are from the same persons.

 

Any other idea before this forums ends up as a place where Leica death is announced every week but an exaggeration each time ?

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It could be to create "facts only" threads, or a more extensive moderation, or some ignore lists because most of the offensive or useless posts are from the same persons.

 

You can set up whatever ignore list you want very easily. Just go to User CP-> Buddy/Ignore Lists on the menu.

 

Of course, that won't actually silence the people you disagree with, but you can't have everything......

 

Sandy

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Of course, that won't actually silence the people you disagree with, but you can't have everything......

 

Problem is not disagreeing. Problem is people who have absolutely nothing to say except express their anger, their fears, their prejudices...

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In jest I suggested a subforum for whiners, moaners and bashers . In reality it might be a solution to have section about "Leica- the company"

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You can set up whatever ignore list you want very easily. Just go to User CP-> Buddy/Ignore Lists on the menu.

 

Of course, that won't actually silence the people you disagree with, but you can't have everything......

 

Sandy

 

Unfortunately there is no "ignore" button for threads.

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Problem is not disagreeing. Problem is people who have absolutely nothing to say except express their anger, their fears, their prejudices...

 

Tout à fait Pascal, I agree.

Michel

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[ ............]

because most of the offensive or useless posts are from the same persons.

 

Yes, I can alas only second you:( I only avoid the threads coming from them you can rather easily detect.

But I'm ready to adopt any suggestion to have a more automatic tool.

Best.

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There are some people who simply like to moan and wind everyone up, there are others who are expressing concern about Leica and its future, because it is a historic camera company and because if it goes down we could all be left up a blind alley. I used to moan a bit and say Leica has to do this or that etc, but now I am fed up with it especially when it gets very personal.

 

My cameras are working, if one breaks I'll simply send it in and perhaps record the fault here. I also wonder how many of the faults are unintentionally caused by the user, Leica probably knows this.

 

Any forum devoted to a particular camera or brand inevitably includes a lot of speculation posts about the next model. Leica's progress to the next model will be slow compared to the big boys. So we will have to post about photography instead.

 

I get the feeling that not so many here visit the photo section of the forums. That's a pity and I think there is a case for bringing M8 photographs into this forum and separating the M8 forum from the digital forum.

 

Jeff

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The only solution is to deal with the way things are, and a little more direct Moderating (though it strikes me the moderators are busy enough.)

 

So...

 

Take the High Road: We readers must learn to ignore posts and threads, or at least skim past the ones we don't like

 

Lead by Example: We need to not feed into such conversations - what's the point of convincing someone who's mind is already made up

 

Let time sort it out: Soon the M8 will be just another camera, and/or the R10 will be pissing everyone off.

 

Be a Hall Monitor: If someone is constantly bringing up the same negativity in threads that don't directly relate to topic, point it out to a moderator. If someone is really just a drain on the community, let someone "in charge" know. It may not result in instant banning, but it helps "build a case" later on.

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I am a member of other forums (or rather 'fora'), and I have seen this problem everywhere, whether it be among bird-watchers, linguists, you name it. It is more a matter of group psychology and quite unavoidable in my opinion. It is like a law of nature that you will attract a small but vocal group of dissenters to 'positive' threads. If you were to get rid of the 'negative element', some of the 'positives' would start to play that role in turn - nature abhors vacuums (or is it 'vacua'?).

To accept it is often the best remedy, hopefully you can even start to smile when the negative comments show up, because it was all so predictable...

The 'glass half empty' folks also serve a purpose in a sense, for they lead us to sometimes question what we 'glass half full' people too readily took for granted.

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The only solution is to deal with the way things are, and a little more direct Moderating (though it strikes me the moderators are busy enough.)

 

So...

 

Take the High Road: We readers must learn to ignore posts and threads, or at least skim past the ones we don't like

 

Lead by Example: We need to not feed into such conversations - what's the point of convincing someone who's mind is already made up

 

Let time sort it out: Soon the M8 will be just another camera, and/or the R10 will be pissing everyone off.

 

Be a Hall Monitor: If someone is constantly bringing up the same negativity in threads that don't directly relate to topic, point it out to a moderator. If someone is really just a drain on the community, let someone "in charge" know. It may not result in instant banning, but it helps "build a case" later on.

 

A fine program.

 

My only comment here if about some freedom that cannot be censured. So moderators cannot erase comments, in my opinion, even if they are negative or speculative. I would suggest a more active and critic attitude in older and calmer and more experienced members of the forum, as Pascal does. All this trolling is tiresome and makes this forum a place less interesting.

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The only solution is to deal with the way things are, and a little more direct Moderating (though it strikes me the moderators are busy enough.)

 

So...

 

Take the High Road: We readers must learn to ignore posts and threads, or at least skim past the ones we don't like

 

Lead by Example: We need to not feed into such conversations - what's the point of convincing someone who's mind is already made up

 

Let time sort it out: Soon the M8 will be just another camera, and/or the R10 will be pissing everyone off.

 

Be a Hall Monitor: If someone is constantly bringing up the same negativity in threads that don't directly relate to topic, point it out to a moderator. If someone is really just a drain on the community, let someone "in charge" know. It may not result in instant banning, but it helps "build a case" later on.

 

Well said Iron F!!

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Soon the M8 will be just another camera, and/or the R10 will be pissing everyone off

 

Nothing more certain than that <grin>

 

Perhaps we need a 'Digital SLR' forum.

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Guest Robert Belasario

This forum, any forum for that matter of fact, should be open and accesable to anyone, and about anything related to that particular forum.

There will always be M8 users whom aren't happy with the camera, the service, the quality, the cost, the upgrade etc. and I am of the meaning that they should be able to ventilate this on this forum, being a Leica M8 forum after all.

 

Subesquently what happens is that 50% of the "complainers" as you call them get wound up by the thread starter, Mr. Menuet and others in a manner which simply doesn't suit any forum. I recall at least three compaing members being compared to 12 year old adolecants, being told to get a life, being called idiots..... Obviously these "complainers" being a tad off allready will not feel any better by reading such comments thrown at themsleves and will continue to rant on.

 

I think the overall quality of this forum can be increased by providing anyone the right to complain, there are reasons to you know even you don't agree with them.

 

Treat people with respect, and they will respond with respect..... even if these people are way behind your self aclaimed level of intelligence and perceptive qualities, they are after all M8 user and have a complaint or comment, or are so involved with their M8 that they actually do want to ventilate their ideas on how Leica should continue in future... I see nothing wrong with that at all, it only takes the two parties to keep matters civilized, not just one as you might believe.

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Pascal's opening this topic up is to be commended.

 

LCT's suggestion -- segregate a M8 Reported Problem thread into a separate section -- makes sense, and if the moderators were vigilant, many threads could be pulled there.

 

But as others have suggested, some of the problem is endemic to forums. As in focus groups, sometimes dominant personalities change the dynamic. A really negative person can change the trajectory.

 

My dream M8 forum would have the following changes:

 

1. Segregate the M8 disaster threads out; there is now a large enough user base and there are enough people who will, of course, have issues, that we should give them someplace specific to be heard, ask questions, etc. Just as LCT suggests.

 

2. Allow there to be M8 specific photo threads. I'm sorry, but I don't often go to the sections where photos are exhibited, and yet I would devour them if here, and if by photographers showing what they can do with their M8s.

 

3. Maybe there should be an Existential Leica section, to corral all comments on whether Leica as a company is going to live or die, are geniuses or idiots, etc.

 

Cheers, JB

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Pascal:

 

I have noticed that thing got worse here about when M8 upgrade was anounced at PMA. I don't know what it was about PMA, but a lot of new users that joined this forum at about that time exhibited a lot of the traits you describe above.

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