Mascarpone Posted February 21, 2008 Share #1 Posted February 21, 2008 Advertisement (gone after registration) Most of these wartime beasts are postwar fakes, from russia with love. I own an original, confirmed by a Zeiss historian. It is the type of lens "HCB" usd for years. It just received a complete CLA, and the glass has no scratches - but the old coating has some stains that my repairman can not remove. It had been used with a screwmount Leica on a german submarine during the war, the spots were created by salt water. It did not affect the glass itself, but the coating is not so beautiful. My question for the experienced collectors: is it possible to re-coat such a lens? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted February 21, 2008 Posted February 21, 2008 Hi Mascarpone, Take a look here Zeiss Sonnar 1.5/5cm LTM. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
telewatt Posted February 21, 2008 Share #2 Posted February 21, 2008 The Question for me is, are you shure to do this..!...You have a original and after that it is not the same... Regards, Jan in England is a firm they do coatings on old lenses... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rona!d Posted February 21, 2008 Share #3 Posted February 21, 2008 Clemens, think about this twice! Liebe Grüße, Ronald p.s. Frag mal beim Wiener Leicashop, die bieten sowas zumindest für diverse alte Leicalinsen an (aber alle Objektive macht man dort wohl auch nicht!) Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. No Posted February 21, 2008 Share #4 Posted February 21, 2008 My question for the experienced collectors: is it possible to re-coat such a lens? possible is everything, but the lens will lose in value. NO Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leitz_not_leica Posted February 22, 2008 Share #5 Posted February 22, 2008 possible is everything, but the lens will lose in value. NO How? Google John Van Stelton in the US. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mascarpone Posted February 22, 2008 Author Share #6 Posted February 22, 2008 possible is everything, but the lens will lose in value. NO Now what's the value of a lens with this kind of damage? I have absolutely no idea... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 22, 2008 Share #7 Posted February 22, 2008 Advertisement (gone after registration) Perhaps https://www.leicashop.com/start.php?location=service will do it. It is a nice lense and I think, it is good to try it. str. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianv Posted February 22, 2008 Share #8 Posted February 22, 2008 Rather than recoating the front element, have you thought of buying a coated 5cm F1.5 in Contax mount and swapping the front element? I've done this with other Sonnar lenses with good results. I've also done this with collapsible Summicrons, but a bit more care was required. If the front optic has to be ground down slightly to take off the coating, its focal length will change. That can throw the lens off as much as simply replacing the front optic. Chances are, the lens will need shimming either way. That is easy with the Zeiss lenses, as they have a variable stand-off ring. Worst part is re-aligning the aperture ring. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrid Posted February 23, 2008 Share #9 Posted February 23, 2008 I would leave it alone. A few blemishes like that really do not affect the lens significantly. I have two Summicrons, one with perfect coatings and the other has a few serious wipe marks. You can't tell the difference, between the two in practice. If you have it recoated you will change it's optical fingerprint and it will also reduce it's monetary value. You're very lucky to own an original Sonnar, enjoy it as it is. The Zeiss Ikon Contax Camera Home Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted February 23, 2008 Share #10 Posted February 23, 2008 It would be like buying an antique and refurbishing it so that it showed no sign of use or age, and make it pretty much pointless. Assuming the 'marks' do not affect the IQ then I would definately leave it alone. If you want perfection just go out an buy a new lens. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephanvdz Posted July 19, 2008 Share #11 Posted July 19, 2008 I wouldn't either... I own several early Zeiss coated lenses in contax and LTM mounts and it would be stupid to recoat one and loose the authenticity... the main problem with real Zeiss sonnar in LTM is that they are prone to "get lost"... in fact there is a little difference between the focal length of a Zeiss 50mm and Leica 50mm and it means that the total focusing system had to be adapted... For wartime production it seems that the lens was not recalculed and kept it's 52mm or so focal length, on a non compensated helicoïd it's impossible to have infinite and near distance equally transmitted to the rangefinder... you have to choose or to go for a middle... with a 1,5 sonnar it has immediate effect (so go for infinite)... this variation of focal length had effect on the russian production (a jupiter 8 is a basically a sonnar f2) the jup for kiev are 52mm or near... while at one point they decided to recalculate the LTM ones (standard lens for zorki and other ltm bodies). concerning HCB use of sonnars on leica... it's not sure about the fact that he was using a Zeiss Ltm lens and there are photographical evidence of him using a contax mount biogon 35 with an adapter (focusing adapter or not ? who knows...), it's probable that he used sonnar with an adapter too... adapter don't have the same helicoïd transmission problem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianv Posted July 20, 2008 Share #12 Posted July 20, 2008 I've been shimming Sonnar's to optimize focus when used close-up and wide-open for the Leica. The Sonnar Focus-Shift is rearward as you stop down, so infinity focus is usually good at F2.8. The Pre-war and war-time Carl Zeiss Jena 5cm F1.5 will fit into a J-3 focus mount, and the collapsible 5cm f2 Sonnar will fit into a J-8 mount. On some lenses, it was necessary to swap the variable stand-off ring and the aperture ring. The optics module and shims were interchangeable. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephanvdz Posted July 20, 2008 Share #13 Posted July 20, 2008 a set of sonnar ... 2 original contax mount (left) and LTM... all are wartime T lenses of various finish ... one is a very special post war artisanal production... Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/45989-zeiss-sonnar-155cm-ltm/?do=findComment&comment=608830'>More sharing options...
rickp13 Posted July 20, 2008 Share #14 Posted July 20, 2008 i can't help you with the decision to modify a rare lens. i had no choice with the front element of my summarit 1.5 - it was simply too hazy with cleaning marks to be used. so, IF you decide to have the front element recoated, here are two addresses: 1) john van stelten's NEW ADDRESS BELOW John Van Stelten Focal Point, Inc. 300 Center Drive Suite G-177 Superior, Co 80027 303-665-6640 john@focalpointlens.com Welcome to Focal Point Lens Inc. 2) i live in europe, so i found and used the following u.k. company for recoating: Roy Atkinson Optical Instruments (Balham) Limited. 39 Neville Court, 27/43 Neville Road, Croydon, Surrey CR0 2DS Tel: 020 8664 9799 Fax: 020 8664 9771 E-mail: oib.ltd@btconnect.com <mailto:oib.ltd@btconnect.com> i'm not a pro, but the lens looks great to my eye and works well. you may want other references from OIB before proceeding. good luck rick Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianv Posted July 21, 2008 Share #15 Posted July 21, 2008 A wartime 5cm F2 "T" Sonnar in a J-8 mount. Total cost $70. $35 for the Contax mount lens, $35 for the J-8. Rather than recoat the front element, a 5cm F1.5 "T" in Contax mount will run under $150. I paid $120 for mine, a beautiful coated front element. Swap out the front element, or swap out the entire optics module. It will be cheaper than recoating the front element, and you can always "go back" to the original configuration. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephanvdz Posted July 21, 2008 Share #16 Posted July 21, 2008 swap the entire module... it's safer... you should take a sonnar in the 3000000 range from CZJ, later opton or CZ(non jena) models are not exactly the same) Don't destroy a T sonnar below 3000000 they are wartime production and valuable too. key serial numbers... about T coated zeiss lens (any mount) with the Carl Zeiss Jena name -below 2200000 probably non original coating (or factory converted) -between 2200000 and 2600000, preproduction models and embargo period... rare, rarest... and more -between 2600000 and 3000000 wartime production (rare in 50mm, very rare in other focal length) -above 3000000 post-war jena production production in the west resumed with different name : Carl Zeiss or Zeiss-opton , but the optical formulas are a little different... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephanvdz Posted July 21, 2008 Share #17 Posted July 21, 2008 there is another solution if you want to use a historical sonnar on a M body, someone in hong kong is manufacturing adapters that are perfectly functionnal and very nice looking. They allow to use 50mm contax mount lenses and 85/135 sonnars on your M... but not the biogon 35... But If you want an HCB configuration, you must find a true Orion adapter (contax to LTM), but it would cost you more than the Leica and the lens... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan States Posted July 21, 2008 Share #18 Posted July 21, 2008 I just purchased a Contax to Leica adaptor on Ebay from a guy who sells them all the time and it works perfectly at all apertures and distances. The original Sonnar 1.5 and 2 are truly outstanding lenses and to my eye have much more character than the modern double gauss designs. Loads of detail in the shadows and smooth out of focus regions. Love em! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianv Posted July 21, 2008 Share #19 Posted July 21, 2008 I also have three Contax/Nikon mount to Leica Mount adapters. One even has a custom cut in the RF cam to correct for the difference in focal length between Contax and Leica. The focus action is not as smooth as the "converted" lenses. I do use them with a Zeiss-Opton Sonnar, which is different construction than the pre-war and wartime lenses. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephanvdz Posted July 21, 2008 Share #20 Posted July 21, 2008 so do I... a perfect combination with the M3... adapter to M or to LTM ? does your adapter allows the use of a biogon 35 (post war) on the M ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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