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In praise of the Mandler lenses


adan

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Excellent article and photos to demonstrate. I own the 21 pre ASPH Elmarit and couldn't be happier. I kept looking at my photos with it and read what Putz (intentional) had to say and had to scratch my head. The 21 combined with a Hoya IR72 filter shot in b&w gives a remarkable quality to the image. I also own the 35 'lux pre ASPH and although i don't use it often the two times I've taken it out to sell it I look at those big sparkling elements and put it back in the bag,

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  • 4 weeks later...

OK so here's some odd info which I would guess relates to another Mandler designed lens! Some time ago I picked up a 3" f/2 Elcan aerial lens off a Vinten military aerial camera (as used in the Falklands it is rumoured). Well, I finally got around to testing it - with mixed hopes - on my Canon 5D2. It will not focus to infinity on the canon - maximum focus is about 3m - so this is where I tested it, after a bit of messing around that it. My tests were simply indoors on a bookcase and rough and ready. I found that the lens certainly resolves very well when stopped down to about f/8ish (no markings) and over the full '35mm' frame all detail is very well retained. I'd say it was actually pretty close to the 80/1.4 when stopped down.

 

My impression (based on the straight edges of the bookcase) is that distortion is negligible (aerial lens, so I would expect this). I also tried other shots into a window to find that wide open it suffers from substantial violet highlight edges, both in the plane of focus and in oof areas, with some slight green fringing in the oof areas also. Given that it is probably optimised at infinity as an aerial lens, and would rarely be used wide open on ultra high contrast targets, this is probably acceptable as part of the design.

 

Not quite sure where to go from here with the lens - for use it would need a focus mount and a CLA which is probably not economic, however.....

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  • 1 year later...

I shoot with Nikon gear for bread and butter stuff. But Leica is fast becoming part of my equipment bag. I picked up an old battered ridgid summicron and was suitably surprised by the photographic quality. When I started shooting with a Nikkor 300mm f2.8 afs VR1 I was stunned by the quality of the lens. This Mandler Summicron has photographic quality as special, so I sent it off to get the front element repolished and it returned to it's former photographic glory, I won't be parting with it. I managed to pick up a pre asph 21mm with lens and hood yesterday, and can't be happier. I did try out the 24mm elmarit prior to purchasing the 21mm and it is a fantastic lens, and despite it's slow aperture, a low noise lens in low light. I'm glad there is a name behind the design of these lenses, art isn't about ultimate resolution, but perception.. I believe Leica lenses now are on their own in terms how they take light and make pictures. But as always, you need to work hard to put together a meaningful photograph, regardless of the media used. Mandler was an artist in his own right.

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At one time I bought several of the ASPH lenses (21 Elmarit, 35 Summicron and Summilux, 90 Summicron APO, 135 APO-Telyt), in part based on some of E. Puts' implications that they out-class the older lenses quite strikingly. Apparently the effects of the Kool-Aid were transient, because after using them a while I no longer own any, and have returned to my Mandler-era versions. I'm very happy I didn't sell them, although I wish I'd held onto those ASPH lenses a few more years to reap the rewards of the obscene price hikes of recent times. At the time I laughed when people spoke of lenses as an investment :mad:

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Thanks for sharing this info Andy!

 

It is quite interesting, that for some, the path of liking certain lenses is quite similar.

 

My very first Leica lens has been a 50 Summilux ASPH - this lens took me by total surprise!

I was so amazed of the obvious worlds difference to my then top of the line Nikon f2.8 zoom lenses, that I consequently started to sell most of my Nikon gear.

 

When the 50 Lux ASPH went to Solms, to have taken care of the sticky focus issue, I used the 6 weeks time, to fall in love in another 50mm, which started it all - the Noctilux f1.

 

It was clear from the first moment, that I would love the f1!

I am fond of other Mandler lenses as well, recently using also a 75 Summilux on a second body.

 

What I like most about the Mandler designed lenses is, that the photographs need so little, if any work in post processing, to have the look, I like.

 

This shot here shows exactly the look in tones, fine detail and smooth transitions, I just love (I think, this is not possible with the newer ASPH lenses):

 

6345034334_cbe04e1702_z.jpg

Untitled by teknopunk.com, on Flickr

 

People on the internet often write, the old lenses are "soft" or how the newer lenses murder the old designs, as it is obvious in comparing MTF charts.

I think, they completely miss the point + I have the feeling often, these comments are lacking completely the persons experience of seeing large prints form Mandler lenses.

 

It is the combination of having smooth looks, endless tonal transitions AND finest detail recorded (in the workers hands shot above, every skin pore is distinctly rendered!).

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The shot here is missing due to a broken Flickr link, I'm afraid.

 

Andy, I have no clue, what is going on with flickr.

I have seen this recently with a few photos, which never have been touched, but displayed as missing, while links are all intact and lead to the correct photo.

 

I think, the "share photo" feature, creating a link in flickr has a flaw.

 

Here is the same photo again:

 

6345034334_547f144bb3_z.jpg

Untitled by teknopunk.com, on Flickr

 

Strange - clicking on the "Untitled" link brings up the image on Flickr. A fine image it is too and illustrates Menos's point.

 

Thanks Keith - how could one not fall for those special lenses, where every other modern lens, introduced is engineered, to show less and less optical flaws, drilling each potential of showing some sort of character out?

 

It seems, nowadays the talk is focussed on pixels, automatic functions and tech talk inspired discussions of focus shift and circle of confusions, while things that really matter - a lens' signature for example - is entirely forgotten about.

 

Even Leica continues, to follow the (technically absolutely valid) goal of further perfecting optics to a degree, where we might not see a difference between reality and the copy of that real scene, made with the perfect optic without flaws.

I think, that in a few decades, nobody will talk anymore about Today's so perfect flat MTF curve of the new 21 f3.4 Super Elmar, while people will think back with a smile about the Super Angulon and admire the photographs from a time, where certain looks were in fact created by a combination of lens, film and the photographers ability, to use the characteristics of this combination, to create a picture.

 

I do not want "the perfect optic" - I want the optic, that helps, creating "a look", I want.

 

Very strange! But a lovely photograph on many levels.

 

Thank you certainly ;-)

 

Could I have shot this picture with a 50 Summilux ASPH? No, I don't think so (which is, why I actually sold mine about a week ago, as it sat completely unused in storage):

 

6350754250_a5b946dff4_z.jpg

Untitled by teknopunk.com, on Flickr

 

The look here has been tried, by me, to be derived in post processing with the 50 Lux, but believe me, this work is so laborious and in the end doesn't come close to this here, that the 50 Lux ASPH is for my photography an inferior lens, I had to sell.

 

I now see, that flickr also strips EXIF data from smaller versions of the original sized picture.

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Menos/M6--

 

Love both shots. I could not find specific data. Were they both shot with the Nocti F1? If so, at 1.0?

 

Thank you - the photograph of the workers hands is made with a version II Canadian 75 Summilux wide open at close focus. The camera was the M8.2.

 

The photograph of the old lady crossing a misty Shanghai alley in the night has been made with the Noctilux f1 version 4 wide open with an M9.

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People on the internet often write, the old lenses are "soft" or how the newer lenses murder the old designs, as it is obvious in comparing MTF charts.

I think, they completely miss the point + I have the feeling often, these comments are lacking completely the persons experience of seeing large prints form Mandler lenses.

 

I do not own Mandler's M lenses, but have many of his R lenses. They are simply wonderful, the way they draw the picture can be found only in some rare examples from Zeiss and Nikon, in my opinion.

Yes, these lenses are not made for photographing MTF charts (though they're not bad at all at that ;)), but for photographing the real world. I really prefer them to the newest asph designs. For my taste, Mandler is the best "optical artist" up to now.

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