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russell

This is really crazy! New 6bit coding price 433€ (not even the 169€ from before)

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We need something to make us feel warm and cuddly about Leica once again. Then maybe this whole forum might get over its currently crotchety mood (me included) and we can all go back to being nice to each other and to Leica too.

 

Simple... be a part of the biggest single event this Forum has ever hosted, and take a picture on the 29th of this month...

 

http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/customer-forum/45189-leica-day.html

 

Regards,

 

Bill

(Never one to pass up an opportunity for a shameless plug)

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Ah, c'mon Russ, it is 140 (plus VAT) for the 6-bit coding, as indicated on your invoice.

140 (+ VAT) is for the bayonet mount only...

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220 Euros for a repair to a lens that will involve disassembly, repair, reassembly and calibration doesn't seem extortionate to me.

Well, "6-bit coding" doesn't imply "repair": If the focus of the 50mm Summilux was accurate before coding, then a "repair" shouldn't be needed...

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In fairness to Leica when you send them a lens for whatever reason they seem to take a look at it's overall performance. When I sent my Tri-Elmar to them for a repair - the aperture ring had lost it's indents - they asked if I'd also want some other repairs doing. Lenses shift out of alignment occasionally.

 

The additional work mentioned above will be optional, if the owner doesn't want it doing then he only needs to say so.

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Guys, I hate to break this to you, but every lens and body needs adjustment for critical work (eg looking at 100% magnification of the pixels).

 

Canon's do. So do Nikon's. Leica is no different, except they let you mount 20 and 30 and 40 year old lenses on a new body. This is one reason some of the new Canons have on-body focus adjust (that and I think they're manufacturing QC has gone down for lenses lately).

 

If you ask them to do, essentially, a CLA on your old, out of warranty lenses, expect them to charge you for it. I'm not talking about new lenses here; just old ones.

 

Now, there are some bargains in this space; if you're in the US, you should be sending your gear to DAG from what I hear; in Canada, the place to send to is Kindermann (the authorized Leica depot).

 

A lens adjustment at Kindermann is $70-100. Period. Now--that won't tweak your M8 or match lens to body or correct a worn lens that needs repair; that's when you need Leica, and the difference in price.

 

But if all you want to do is take your good shape lenses and make them work in spec, then send them here instead.

 

I had a backfocusing used 75 Lux that Gerry Smith at Kindermann fixed (he said it couldn't acheive infinity focus as is) in about 3 days. Cost? $75 CAN plus tax. I'm sure DAG isn't much more; heck, even shipping to Canada from the US isn't that bad, and Kindermann deals with the border back.

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I have my M8, 35/1.4A, 50/1.0 and 75/1.4 all at Solms at present for focus checking wide open. My dealer notified me this week that Leica had informed him that the cost of this work would be zero, other than "some possible courier charges. All lenses are circa 1999-2002.

 

Strangely, I wasn't surprised by this. I've always had good experiences with Leica "taking care of things" after sales.

 

M

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Haven't heard back from Leica yet. One good point made is that if you're going to spend all that money to have it adjusted then it should also work on your own M8. So I'd have to mail in my own M8 at the same time. But then it gets re-worked in Aug after the upgrade again; and with tolerances as tight as they are perhaps it's then out of whack with the lenses I serviced(should I go forward with it) in Feb. So it becomes a vicious circle.

 

And my experience, even from the film days, Leica could adjust the focus properly on my Noctilux(another serial no.) back then. And they didnt have the attention to detail I wanted in a repair. Better experience was with non-Leica AG repair people who took the time to fix the lenses as I wanted it.

 

One idea is to pay Leica to code the lens and only that. Then send it in to another repair person who can make the focus adjustments

But to be honest, even though I had my hopes lifted by the upgrade program, I'm now really starting to deeply rethink which camera company I want to support.

Stop and think: 433 Euro for 6-bit coding and bringing the focus in-line afterwards.

 

433 Euros.

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Good grief.

 

I had a Contax MM zoom that had a speck of dust in it a few years ago. I dropped it in by hand to Kyocera in Reading. A few days later I received an estimate for the thick end of £400. It was itemised - as this one is - and included work to bring the lens back to "as new" condition.

 

These are pro-spec. tools. These charges do not seem excessive. Would you have them ignore what needs to be done, send the lens back and have you complain about the state it has been returned in?

 

 

Regards,

 

Bill

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Really, I would send the lens to DAG after the new mount has been done for any sort of adjustments. BTW, do you really feel the need to have a 50mm coded? I would save myself the 140 euros and skip it altogether or buy a d-coder.

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I never sent anything to Solms... frankly my idea about lens coding is :

 

- If you want CODING ONLY, do it yourself or from a lab (I did so for my 21 Asph... 100 Euros and the code "works")

- If you want to send a lens to Solms, there must be a good reason to do it (recalibrating cam, repolish...) : they are THE FACTORY... you can expect it's not cheap, and you must pretend a well-done work.

 

Time ago, I got CLAed my own old twin BMW bike... from a good mechanical of my town... good result for me... at BMW factory in Munchen, there is a specific department for such works... I did not think ever to send my bike there... but someone does... and pays in accordance....

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These are pro-spec. tools. These charges do not seem excessive. Would you have them ignore what needs to be done, send the lens back and have you complain about the state it has been returned in?

Was the OP's 50mm Summilux not correctly adjusted before the coding was done? He didn't mention that... So why he should have to pay for adjusting a lens whose focus was accurate before coding?

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I've been holding the cash for buying one of these things for quite some time. I've enjoyed my M6's and lenses, both Leica and not, for years. When the M8 was announced and later hit the market I was ecstatic, but decided to wait for the shite to shake out as it always has to with any new complex electronic product. I've waited and waited, but the storm has not abated.

 

I guess I'm missing something. I've always been a "life's too short to ..." kind of person, but even I can't believe the amount of effort, cost, lost time and frustration in general that people are willing to put up with in dealing with Leica and this offering.

 

My film M's have been a lifelong model of reliability and I guess that I've been fortunate in not having body/lens relationship problems through many combinations over time. I hold Leica in high regard for the products that they've produced over the years, but I continue to shy away from the M8 because I think that it will, by virtue of its many issues, spoil my simple enjoyment of all things Leica.

 

Honestly, am I missing something here? Is it really worth all the "heartache" and hassle?

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My 50mm Summilux focuses better than any of my lenses. Right now it is fine. I am worried that they will knock it out of whack when they add the 6-bit coding.

And the argument that I should just pay through the nose because it's THE FACTORY and it's a pro-level product is silly. I bought the 50mm Summilux just 5 or 6 years ago for new from an authorized dealer for around $1,200. Even though prices have gone up I feel 433 Euros is a lot to ask for a new mount. Imagine I needed the front glass replacing!

 

And it's a sad state of affairs if I have to send the lenses to Leica and wait 4 (or more?) weeks for coding and then turn around and then ship them to another 3rd party repair to have their focus adjusted.

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My 50mm Summilux focuses better than any of my lenses. Right now it is fine. I am worried that they will knock it out of whack when they add the 6-bit coding.

And the argument that I should just pay through the nose because it's THE FACTORY and it's a pro-level product is silly. I bought the 50mm Summilux just 5 or 6 years ago for new from an authorized dealer for around $1,200. Even though prices have gone up I feel 433 Euros is a lot to ask for a new mount.

"a lot"? It's a total rip-off! Why should changing the mount introduce any focus errors? IMHO all one needs to control the fitting of the new bayonet mount is a sliding caliper...

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{snipped}Honestly, am I missing something here? Is it really worth all the "heartache" and hassle?

 

For some of us, resoundingly yes

The M8 has been a great camera, exactly as reliable as any other digitial camera I've used professionally. Since I'm comparing it with industry workhorses like the 1ds2 and 5d, that's pretty good!

 

I think most of the problems with the M8 have been shaken out, honestly.

 

And I'm not the only one ok with the M8 for the most part. Remeber too, there are those that have terrible luck and I feel badly for them. But your not as likely to hear from satisfied users on a forum like this.

 

If you read about things on the internet you'll never buy anything

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A possible explanation:

 

I was puzzled when one of my two 35mm Summicrons focused more accurately on M4-6 & the other on M8. But my dealer said it didn't matter which I sent in, because the coding process involved setting the lens to match the M8 sensor. He explained that coding involved both adding the code/mount & also re-setting the lens for a tighter match to M8 sensor specs.

 

So it might be the case that Leica initially charged only for coded mount, & did further adjustments as freebies. Looks like they're now trying to extract the full cost of lens adjustment/correction?

 

I don't know, though, why it would cost so much. The last time I had Sherry Krauter CLA a lens I think it was $75 for labor (but that was a while ago).

 

I hope a modern tech will emerge who does just this sort of job for a reasonable price - Milich-type mounts or machining, combined with CLA & bench test of lens. A nice little niche business for someone, for Zeiss, CV lenses too?

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A possible explanation:

 

I was puzzled when ..........., CV lenses too?

 

Comon guys - this is German high precision work which of course has its price. If there was no market for this, they would not have their workshops fully booked. Its ultra high quality work not cheap US labor. If people think they can get this done in a low labor cost country - go ahad and give it a try.... I would rather pay 433 EUR and get it done nicely and with high reliability. The EUR is high compared to the USD which tells everyone that something has changed over the past years, which some people do not want to realize when living in the US. I love Leica and am willing to pay for the high quality - of course one can always dream of lower prices, but thats not the segment Leica is in. If people do not want to afford the equipment ebay is a good platform to recover a large portion of the value. Other people will honor it...... [/color][/size]

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I took 8 lenses to Solms (I live just 80 miles away) to have them 6-bit coded and added my M8 to check focus problems. The estimate they sent me was more than fair: the inspection of the M8 was totally free (total service with inspection, cleaning, sensor-cleaning, replacement of one electronic part as an update to recent standard). All the lenses except my 75Lux just needed the coding (about 90 EUR each). The 75lux needed some extra work (new focussing ring), that was about 250 EUR. So I think Leica CS works alright, and, Russell, I would advise you to phone there and ask about the actual cost for your Summilux. I'm sure they can explain what's wrong with your lens.

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................the inspection of the M8 was totally free (total service with inspection, cleaning, sensor-cleaning, replacement of one electronic part as an update to recent standard)........

 

I have a very meek and trouble-less M8. Firmware updates flawlessly. Sent it in after a year for cleaning (oil spots on sensor) and it came back totally CLA-ed, for free. In a beautiful black velvet pyjama.

 

Now it grows up and wants an update: entering puberty. I shudder at the thought. What terrible tricks it will start to play

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"it might be the case that Leica initially charged only for coded mount, & did further adjustments as freebies. Looks like they're now trying to extract the full cost of lens adjustment/correction"

 

Yes, this is what I'm thinking might have happened. It seems there has been a policy/price change at Leica repairs. When I hear back from them we'll know for sure.

 

Lightpainter's experience is more what I'd like to see, but perhaps times have changed.

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