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I am considering buying a printer and I know less than zero about them. Canon Pro 1000 or Pro 1100.  The 1000 is on sale.  Is there a big advantage to the 1100 over the 1000?  What papers are the best?  Canon, Epson, etc? 

In the past i have just used White House Custom Color.  Are there other online printers that would be better?  I have a ton of stuff I want to print and I did have a darkroom and did all my own printing and that was great, loved it.  I just returned from a big vacation and have many things that will be going on the wall at home.  Just thinking this may be the time to get a printer.  I would want to print 11x14 at least and these two Canons will print larger.  Anything larger than that I would just send off for printing.

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Go to Youtube > Keith Cooper and watch his content on printers. The 1100 is not an inexpensive printer and might not be where you'd want to start if you aren't already familiar with printing, I wouldn't pick it as the 1st printer, and I think Keith suggests that in his recent videos. It's a professional grade tool and not cheap to operate. 

I had 1000 (or its predecessor) many years ago. I printed every week to hang stuff on the walls. Really need to have your monitor calibrated and understand paper profiles and how they interact with your editing software. If you don't use it regularly the print heads will clog and that's an expensive repair, if you can find someone local to do it.

I'm also shopping after a multi year hiatus from having a photo printer. The 1100 is not on my list. For $1300 I would need to be making prints every day. I'm not a professional, and can't justify the cost, technicality and ink prices. Keith's videos have some other options. 

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A bunch of posts on this topic for easy search.  Common conclusions for 17” home printer is either the Canon you mention or the Epson P900. Cartridge size differs, as do head technologies and  related cleaning strategies.  Both competent, but as I explain elsewhere, the Canon is best suited for those who print frequently.

Jeff

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Posted (edited)

I've got the epson p900. One thing it has in its favour is that it is very well behaved even if you don't print for a while. I am considering buying one of the very large format epson versions (SC-P9500) at some point with permanently available matt and gloss black but I'd need to find space first and that is a longer term project!

Edited by Derbyshire Man
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vor 2 Stunden schrieb ALScott:

I am considering buying a printer ...

Good idea! But—it's essential to understand that conducting one's own printer is not about saving money. It's about control. It's about being in charge. It's about not getting mad about someone else's poor efforts. Running your own printer is not cheap. High-quality inks and papers are earning their makers a fortune or two. Still, it's worth it. Your results will be YOUR results.

You're going to pay your apprentice's due. The art of printing is no easier than the art of photography ... or any other art. But mastering it is extremely satisfying.

.

vor 2 Stunden schrieb ALScott:

Canon Pro 1000 or Pro 1100.

Very good choice! Currently there's two brands to choose from when it comes to top-quality photo printing: Canon and Epson. Forget anything else. Personally, I am an Epson user but that's just because I am using Epson printers for a few decades now. In terms of photo printing, Canon currently is at least just as good.

Sorry I don't know the difference between the Canon ProGraph 1000 and 1100. But it cannot be too hard to fnd out on the Internet.

.

vor 2 Stunden schrieb ALScott:

What papers are the best?

Okay. You tell me what car, what toothbrush, and what wife is best, and THEN I'll let you in the secret what paper's best.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, 01af said:

Your results will be YOUR results.

But mastering it is extremely satisfying.

I am an Epson user but that's just because I am using Epson printers for a few decades now.

Okay. You tell me what car, what toothbrush, and what wife is best, and THEN I'll let you in the secret what paper's best.

1. this is why I am looking into this, control.  When, where and how.

2. It always put the final bow on a great shot when I printed it in the darkroom.

3. Why Epson, anything that make them better over Canon like clogging or not clogging which I have picked up on.

4. Fair enough, just checking.

Edited by ALScott
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54 minutes ago, rogxwhit said:

But the darkroom of old is often now the lightroom.  And what comes back from a lab is down to how you prepared the image file - just as if the print machine was on your desk ... so what's the deal?

The prints I have had made did not come back from the lab as my file appeared but because someone else did the print I do not know where the issue lies.  Plus, it isn't exactly cheap ordering online.  4 prints, 2 of which were throw aways because the paper I "tested" was terrible, cost $50 which is not cheap by any means.  I would just have to keep tweaking the file on my end, ordering again and hoping it came back like I want it to.  So, that is the deal I have had so far.

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Posted (edited)

I use Bay-photo for large prints, often 16x20~24x30. I have nothing to complain. Control? they did much better job than my own. I am sure there are many other professional printer houses that do similar quality. As of today, most print problems are photographer's faults.

However, I am back to house printer. 17", but I think 13" would serve me well too. From specs, Epson P700 and P900 can handle roll paper reasonably well but not terrific. This is what it exceeds Canon competitive printers.  For real roll paper handling, I would go Epson P5370.

But Jeff S's early comments that the cold ink head of Epson should be another consideration, particularly for me that have low print volumes.

Color wise, my eyes cannot tell whether Canon or Epson is better if price is close. I doubt many can.     

Edited by Einst_Stein
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2 hours ago, ALScott said:

3. Why Epson, anything that make them better over Canon like clogging or not clogging which I have picked up on.

 

See above.  The Canon print heads are ‘hot firing’, thereby creating residue, and resulting in Canon’s mandated automatic cleaning cycles (and user replaceable heads, eventually).  Users cannot avoid cleanings, so ink WILL be used… either for printing or through cleaning, so one may as well print.  The Epsons are ‘cold firing’ and cleaning cycles are primarily user controlled.  Older machines had a tendency to clog through lack of use, but newer models have proven more dependable. I’ve not had any serious clogs in 15 years with my 3800 and now P800. If left idle, I just run a test print now and then or, if needed, a quick clean cycle.

My P800 has 80ml cartridges, as do the Canon Pro 1000/1100 models, but the latest P900 was reduced to 50ml.  Ink sets are of course different, but both brands are more than capable.  Just like cameras, printers are not plug and play; user decisions and techniques matter… just as in darkroom days.  I’m a big fan of ImagePrint software, but that’s another discussion.

Jeff

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vor 12 Stunden schrieb 01af:

Good idea! But—it's essential to understand that conducting one's own printer is not about saving money. It's about control. It's about being in charge. It's about not getting mad about someone else's poor efforts. Running your own printer is not cheap. High-quality inks and papers are earning their makers a fortune or two. Still, it's worth it. Your results will be YOUR results.

You're going to pay your apprentice's due. The art of printing is no easier than the art of photography ... or any other art. But mastering it is extremely satisfying.

.

vor 14 Stunden schrieb ALScott:

Canon Pro 1000 or Pro 1100.

Very good choice! Currently there's two brands to choose from when it comes to top-quality photo printing: Canon and Epson. Forget anything else. Personally, I am an Epson user but that's just because I am using Epson printers for a few decades now. In terms of photo printing, Canon currently is at least just as good.

01af is absolutely right!

vor 14 Stunden schrieb ALScott:

What papers are the best? 

Hahnemühle is the best because it has a consistently high level for all papers. Other manufacturers also make (almost) equally good papers (such as Innova, Moab, Canson). I would only use fine art papers because only these have that unique feel. Otherwise you have to decide between glossy or matt papers and between white and natural white (cream-coloured) papers. All well-known manufacturers offer something in each of these ‘normal’ categories, and each manufacturer also has speciality papers with special materials, surfaces or effects.

 

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Buying a printer is only the first step on the learning and cost curve. High quality printing at home means that you must have a colour-calibrated process from monitor to paper. You will need to calibrate your monitor yourself, and you will need paper profiles. (You might find your next expense is a better monitor.) You may trust third party paper profiles (from the paper maker or from the software provider like Imageprint) or make your own - I have a Calibrite device that calibrates both monitor and paper, but I also use the paper manufacturers' own profiles. The paper profiles are used by whatever printing software you use; I print from Lightroom, but there's Imageprint and other dedicated printing apps.

Paper is a whole new can of worms. Most of the major brands produce a sample pack; I got packs from Canson and Hahnemühle, and most of my papers are now Canson. I aim to have stocks of textured matt, plain matt, semi-gloss and gloss, all in fibre-based archive quality, though I use semi-gloss and plain matt most of the time. I could give you the names, but you're better off working it out for yourself from a sample pack. I also have a box of cheap RC semi-gloss for quick and dirty prints, either to give to someone else or because I want to print a large number and lay them out on a table to decide which ones I want permanently on the wall.

If you want to have fun, there are all sorts of obscure papers to try - this is when I tried washi papers to keep me awake during covid lockdown.

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9 hours ago, elmars said:

Hahnemühle is the best because it has a consistently high level for all papers. Other manufacturers also make (almost) equally good papers (such as Innova, Moab, Canson). 

 

I generally prefer using Canson, which often feeds better through my Epson(s) than Hahnemuhle. But I use multiple papers depending on specific circumstances, made easier by using the superb ImagePrint profiles, which cover virtually any paper (they will custom make for free if not already available), and also for different lighting conditions.

But it doesn’t stop there.  One must pay careful attention to display lighting conditions, framing and matting decisions, and even cover glass types, all of which can subtly alter viewer perceptions or paper characteristics such as texture/color/tonality.

Jeff

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Posted (edited)

Choosing printer paper is like choosing film. You choose a film and the developer based on convenience and whatever your basic criteria, stick to it till you can handle it with confidence before switching to something else. Before that, any problem is likely your own.

I choose my printer paper based on simple criteria. Acid free, double sided, offered by trustworthy professional print house, and the largest available sheet size according to my printer, preferably also available in roll form, but optional. 

I searched B&H, found Moab Entrada Rag Natural and Entrada Rag White. the 190 weight is available in 17"x22" and 17" roll, but 300 weight only in 17"x25".    Not that other papers are bad, but I just want to start with something.  I would like the sheet size to cover 2x3 aspect ratio without cropping the raw image, but it is not quite possible. 17x22 can do edge-less but will crop the original image. 17x25 is not edge-less, so essentially the image size will be more or less 16 x 24 ~ 16.3 x 25. But that 's fine, I take 17x25 for sheet. When I become comfortable with roll paper, it will take another learning curve.     

Talked to the professional print house, it turned out Moab is among their most popular papers. But Carson and Hahnemühle are popular too.

By the way, The road I choose are also available in 13x19. The Entrada Rag White is also in 13" roll. 

Edited by Einst_Stein
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Appreciate all the help.  After days of reading I think I will just have to pick one.  This is already a deeper rabbit hole than I imagined.  I do want to print my own stuff.  Besides my own enjoyment my family and friends would enjoy getting them also.  Plus, I may actually try to sell a few, we'll see.  As far as reviews it seems to be worse than camera reviews.  Epson great and horrible, clogs, slow and Canon much the same, "gulps" ink, etc. on and on.  Customer service seems to be a little better with Canon.  I will say that Keith Cooper is an excellent resource.  

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Posted (edited)

I have limited wall space so I make relatively few prints. I have been using an Epson P700 for almost four years and have had no clogging or any other issues. 

I tried a variety of paper brands when I started inkjet printing with an Epson C88 almost 20 years ago, but I quickly settled on Red River Paper. Their variety of paper types and paper sizes is at least the equal of the more expensive "name" brands. My current favorites are 68lb Ultra Pro Satin and Aurora Art Natural 300 in both 8.5x11 and 12x12 sizes. 

Edited by Doug A
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40 minutes ago, Doug A said:

I have limited wall space so I make relatively few prints. I have been using an Epson P700 for almost four years and have had no clogging or any other issues. 

I tried a variety of paper brands when I started inkjet printing with an Epson C88 almost 20 years ago, but I quickly settled on Red River Paper. Their variety of paper types and paper sizes is at least the equal of the more expensive "name" brands. My current favorites are 68lb Ultra Pro Satin and Aurora Art Natural 300 in both 8.5x11 and 12x12 sizes. 

This is one of this issues mentioned that worries the most, not printing enough and causing clogs, wasting ink, etc.  So, how often do you print and how do you avoid issued if it isn't much?

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4 hours ago, Einst_Stein said:

I choose my printer paper based on simple criteria. Acid free, double sided, offered by trustworthy professional print house, and the largest available sheet size according to my printer, preferably also available in roll form, but optional. 

Curious: why do you go for double sided? Do you print for books, or is there some other benefit of double sided I haven't thought about?

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49 minutes ago, ALScott said:

This is one of this issues mentioned that worries the most, not printing enough and causing clogs, wasting ink, etc.  So, how often do you print and how do you avoid issued if it isn't much?

Simple, if you’re worried, run a test print or a nozzle check every few weeks if your Epson is idle.  As noted, I haven’t had a serious clog in 15 years, with two machines. The Epson 4900 was a dud as far as clogs, but well known and now replaced with newer model. Canon will run cleanings whether you want or not, if you’ve been following.
 

Jeff

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1 hour ago, LocalHero1953 said:

Curious: why do you go for double sided? Do you print for books, or is there some other benefit of double sided I haven't thought about?

Purely for convenience. I don't see much difference in price.

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