Leicavit

[Shootist]

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Ok so it looks like you fold the lever down and then move it, pull the complete arm of the LV/RW, in the same direction it folds back into the body of the unit. The folding in of the arm is only to get it out of the way when not in use.

This expains some of the questions and looking at the video hepled. Thanks.

 

Just how does this work on a M3? I see in one of the videos for loading film in a M2/3 the person doing the loading is using what looks to be a RW. Does the M3 need any modifications to use a RW, or do you need a specific RWer for the removable takeup spool of the M2/3?

[stunsworth]

Ed, a standard Rapidwinder won't work on an M2/3. The camera doesn't have the slotted cog that the Rapidwinder engages. Tom did release a Rapidwinder specifically for the M2, but I don't know if that would work on an M3.

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[peter_n]

There's lots of info on Tom A's products over on RFF where Tom has his own forum. The M3 needs to be modified to take the TA winder. Go to Tom's web site RapidWinder.com and read up on it.

[ErikFive]

Modification to the M3 can be done so you can use RW/Leicavit. You have to send in your RW/leicavit with the camera to get it done.

 

In Europe it can be done by Ottma Michaely who is located in Germany, In the US it is Don(DAG) and Kindermann in Canada does it. Kindermann takes aprox 300-350 Canadian dollars. Dont know about the rest. Got this info from TomA.

 

My plan was/is to fit the RW to the M3 and then get them painted matte black together by CRR Luton

[sepiareverb]

Peter_n and ErikFive. Imagine meeting you here.

[ErikFive]

Peter_n and ErikFive. Imagine meeting you here.

 

Hello Mr. Bob. I think I will have your Christmas Cron on monday:)

[budrichard]

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""Winding is winding and the stress is the same."

 

Not true."

 

I'm just a Nuclear Engineer with more than a passing understanding of Mechanics, so why don't you try an explanation out on me?

 

If not, try this" The gears have to move the same way whether using the camera's winding lever, a Rapidwind device or a Motor M. The only difference would be the impulse in the speed in which one would use the camera's winding lever against a Rapidwinder or motor M and unless the gear engagement were very sloppy, which they aren't, there is really no increase in stress as the speeds are slow.

So please explain how if something has to move by gears and a different motive force causes that movement, that the stress changes on the gears.

I'm not trying to be confrontational here but I read these types of 'Urban Legend' all the time. If I'm wrong, I will certainly admit I'm wrong.

But as it is, I will go right along using my Motor M's without ANY worry about increased stress.-Dick

[peter_n]

@budrichard: This is totally OT but do/did you drive a Volvo XC70?

[peter_n]

Peter_n and ErikFive. Imagine meeting you here.

I'm everywhere Bob...

[stunsworth]

""Winding is winding and the stress is the same."

 

Not true."

 

I'm just a Nuclear Engineer with more than a passing understanding of Mechanics, so why don't you try an explanation out on me?

 

I think torque may have something to so with this. Assuming you've driven a car with a manual gearbox, have you ever tried putting a car into first gear without using the clutch?

 

I'm a computer programmer with more than a passing interest in lifting pints.

[Rolo]

""Winding is winding and the stress is the same."

 

Not true."

 

I'm just a Nuclear Engineer with more than a passing understanding of Mechanics, so why don't you try an explanation out on me?

 

 

But as it is, I will go right along using my Motor M's without ANY worry about increased stress.-Dick

 

Impressive ! However, I'm more interested in whether you can make photographs.

 

As it happens, I'm just a Chartered Mechanical Engineer with more than just a passing understanding of mechanics and materials science. Been involved in the design of gear trains over the years, but know squid about your narrow field of speciality.

 

I quote Nemeng to you:

 

"Ahem, this is more than just a "tiny" concern! Be very careful with as the brass gears in the M3, M2 & M4 were designed with gentler, low-torque forces in mind. When the motor became available in the mid 70s, Leica had to use toughened steel gears to cope with higher internal stresses and torque during motor-driven winding. So by mounting a Rapidwinder or motor onto your M2/3/4, you can - if you are not careful - end up stripping your brass-gear camera and turning the innards to junk!"

 

END.

 

"Winding is winding", and I'm not bovvered.

 

Rolo CEng., MIMechE

[budrichard]

Impressive ! However, I'm more interested in whether you can make photographs.

 

As it happens, I'm just a Chartered Mechanical Engineer with more than just a passing understanding of mechanics and materials science. Been involved in the design of gear trains over the years, but know squid about your narrow field of speciality.

 

I quote Nemeng to you:

 

"Ahem, this is more than just a "tiny" concern! Be very careful with as the brass gears in the M3, M2 & M4 were designed with gentler, low-torque forces in mind. When the motor became available in the mid 70s, Leica had to use toughened steel gears to cope with higher internal stresses and torque during motor-driven winding. So by mounting a Rapidwinder or motor onto your M2/3/4, you can - if you are not careful - end up stripping your brass-gear camera and turning the innards to junk!"

 

END.

 

"Winding is winding", and I'm not bovvered.

 

Rolo CEng., MIMechE

 

1. For your interest in my photography skills, I was a Staff Photographer for the Wisconsin State Journal during Graduate School. My NSF Grant was just not enough money to support my family.

2. My 'narrow field of Specialty' led to many other specialities among them Engineering Manager where I dealt with ALL aspects of Engineering, QA/QC Manager and Director of Nuclear Safety among others. An Engineering Degree in one discipline does not mean that you are only qualified to understand that single discipline.

2. The original Post did not specify any Leica model and I clearly stated that I used Motor M's on M6 and M7.

3. The problem with the earlier gears is not stress due to the Motor M, it is is wear due to increased usage with softer material. If one looks at a Motor M, there is no gear attachment to the winding spool in the classical sense of gear teeth but a round mechanism with the three radial spokes that engage the film winding spool. No matter how the film winding spool is engaged the stress on the camera gears is the same.

4. I read the full section you partially quoted and believe that Nemeng does not understand the problem and as he states,

"It is compiled and maintained independently of Leica Camera AG, Solms Germany, with an emphasis on practical issues rather than historical trivia or "collectability". So expect a no-nonsense approach, free of the fanboy sentimentality you see on other Leica websites :?)".

 

So the problem concerns brass versas steel gears, brass is softer than steel and wears faster with the same appllied force, that is the problem and not increased stress which could only cause a problem if the Yield Strength of the material was exceeded and plastic deformation resulted or the UTS was exceeded. I am also excluding fatigue failure. -Dick

[Rolo]

Nemeng is THE Leica gear expert. Look him up.

 

Dick,

It's time to move on. I'm sure nobody has any further interest in the gears.

 

Show us some pictures and lighten up. This is a recreational site.

 

Rolo

[JBA]

There's a demonstration video by Tom on youTube:

 

YouTube - "How to use Rapidwinder & Softrelease" by Tom A

 

I've just bought a Rapidwinder, but haven't used it in the field yet.

 

I'm trusting that I can speed up a short sequence of images with the winder which appears to enable 3x my wind-on rate. For me, about 1 per second is practical with the standard wind and being left eyed I can't improve on that. Occasionally, I want to triple that.

 

I read that the motor wind puts additional stress on the camera gearing. The Rapidwinder is quieter and doesn't rely on batteries.

 

Looking forward to learning if it works for me, especially my ability to focus and wind as I'm often at f1.4 and focus tracking is important.

 

Rolo

 

I'd been wondering what the point of a Leicavit was. It had never occurred to me to hold it that way, but looking at the video, it's obvious. Like you, I could find this a very useful accessory.

 

Thanks for posting that video.

[ndjambrose]

...

It's time to move on. I'm sure nobody has any further interest in the gears....

 

Amen to that.

 

As an aside: does anybody in this forum take any photographs these days -- apart from ones of their cameras, that is?

[bill]

Amen to that.

 

As an aside: does anybody in this forum take any photographs these days -- apart from ones of their cameras, that is?

 

Yes, Neil, we do. Nice portfolio, btw.

 

Regards,

 

Bill

[stunsworth]

As an aside: does anybody in this forum take any photographs these days -- apart from ones of their cameras, that is?

 

People split into two camps depending on what cameras they own. Those with film cameras take photographs of their cameras. Those with M8s take photographs of rulers. A minority take photographs of other things <grin>

[bill]

... Those with film cameras take photographs of their cameras. ...

 

...that's what digital's for, isn't it?

 

Regards,

 

Bill

 

P.S. On a serious note, I am a left-eyed shooter. I had a Rapidwinder a few years ago. I decided that I would trade off the undoubted extra speed for not having the increased bulk (I kept the Rapidgrip though). If I want to machine-gun a subject I'll use a motorised SLR. My M (and Screw) photography is more pedestrian in pace.

[ndjambrose]

People split into two camps depending on what cameras they own. Those with film cameras take photographs of their cameras. Those with M8s take photographs of rulers. A minority take photographs of other things <grin>

 

Well, my hopes rest on the minority

 

I've seen a lot of 'I love my M6/M7/MP/M8/ruler' posts lately. But not much evidence of people with an interest in photography. The Berlin challenge seems to have been the high point in recent weeks. (Speaking of which - thanks to those who participated, I enjoyed the voting and recent write up in LFI).

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Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[Rolo]

...that's what digital's for, isn't it?

 

Regards,

 

Bill

If I want to machine-gun a subject I'll use a motorised SLR. My M (and Screw) photography is more pedestrian in pace.

 

Bill, beautiful 12 Best Images. Thanks for giving the link.

 

Rolo