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SL3 vs SL2...


I know, all speculations, but there seem to be some rumors with quite some information. Do you plan to upgrade from SL2 to SL3 or not (supposing the rumors are correct), and if so, what are the main reasons?  

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  1. 1. I know, all speculations, but there seem to be some rumors with quite some information. Do you plan to upgrade or not, and if, what are the main reasons?

    • I believe the SL3 is a nice upgrade, but the SL2 is still so good that I don't want to pay for the upgrade. I will keep my SL2
      62
    • Sensor and IQ is my main reason to upgrade to SL3
      24
    • AF is my main reason SL3
      34
    • other reasons which are worth for me to upgrade to SL3
      10
    • don't know yet
      26


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I can only tell you my answer from the perspective of a current SL2-S owner who used to own the SL2 and also used the Q3 extensively.  I am primarily a low light shooter.  The noise patterns on the SL2 weren't pleasing to my eye above ISO 3200 .  I felt the same way about the Q2.  With the Q3, noise patterns were much more acceptable and I could comfortably use it at 6400 and occasionally used 12500 without issue.  As much as I love my SL2-S, the one area where the SL2, in my opinion, was way ahead of it was with how it rendered high contrast black and white images with the APO SL lenses.  I can't get the same look out of my SL2-S.  I imagine the combination of the higher resolution of the sensor combined with the resolving power and microcontrast of the APO SL lenses contributed to that.  

I also sometimes crop from horizontal to vertical if I think the composition looks better when processing.  With the Q3s resolution this is no issue at all.  If I do it with my SL2-S and then need to come in a little bit more it's not so ideal.

Other improvements will be welcome, but the sensor is my primary reason for wanting the SL3.  

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2 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Maybe the thread is a bit premature? We'll know for sure in a few days.

With the invites out for the event on March 7th, do you think the press embargo will be lifted on the 7th or after that?

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Posted (edited)
1 minute ago, Olaf_ZG said:

What about 2s users thinking to upgrade? Especially towards the 2 as the prices will go quite nicely…

See my thoughts above.  Edit: If keeping both and using the SL2 in good light, that could be an option for some.

Edited by Dr. G
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3 hours ago, Dr. G said:

I can only tell you my answer from the perspective of a current SL2-S owner who used to own the SL2 and also used the Q3 extensively.  I am primarily a low light shooter.  The noise patterns on the SL2 weren't pleasing to my eye above ISO 3200 .  I felt the same way about the Q2.  With the Q3, noise patterns were much more acceptable and I could comfortably use it at 6400 and occasionally used 12500 without issue.  As much as I love my SL2-S, the one area where the SL2, in my opinion, was way ahead of it was with how it rendered high contrast black and white images with the APO SL lenses.  I can't get the same look out of my SL2-S.  I imagine the combination of the higher resolution of the sensor combined with the resolving power and microcontrast of the APO SL lenses contributed to that.  

I also sometimes crop from horizontal to vertical if I think the composition looks better when processing.  With the Q3s resolution this is no issue at all.  If I do it with my SL2-S and then need to come in a little bit more it's not so ideal.

Other improvements will be welcome, but the sensor is my primary reason for wanting the SL3.  

Interesting comments on the SL2 vs SL2s b+w rendering. As a mostly black and white photographer, I love the way the M11 renders black and white conversions so if the SL3 has the same sensor it will be great for b+w lovers. That's not just hyperbole, I have the M11M as well and the standard M11 isn't getting left behind in any significant way. 

I've been thinking hard about picking up an SL2s as a second camera to allow for IBIS on M lenses, the timing is right to buy used without losing much if I decide to sell it again... but knowing how much I love the way b+w converted M11 images look, and your comments regarding the SL2 vs SL2s conversions, the SL3 might make more sense.

 

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Posted (edited)

I think you should add "Waiting for price reduction/or used purchase."

I'm waiting to see video performance, to justify buying new I have to be able to sell one of my video bodies and I want to know how well it performs. I am not hopeful because the M11 is a slower readout sensor that the SL2 by all accounts.

Will probably by a new APO lens instead while waiting 3 years to upgrade to SL3

Edited by Geoff C. Bassett
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vor 23 Minuten schrieb Geoff C. Bassett:

I think you should add "Waiting for price reduction/or used purchase."

[…]

+1

I’ll wait for the price to half, i.e. having to sell five NVIDIA shares instead of ten to buy it. 

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2 hours ago, Stevejack said:

Interesting comments on the SL2 vs SL2s b+w rendering. As a mostly black and white photographer, I love the way the M11 renders black and white conversions so if the SL3 has the same sensor it will be great for b+w lovers. That's not just hyperbole, I have the M11M as well and the standard M11 isn't getting left behind in any significant way. 

I've been thinking hard about picking up an SL2s as a second camera to allow for IBIS on M lenses, the timing is right to buy used without losing much if I decide to sell it again... but knowing how much I love the way b+w converted M11 images look, and your comments regarding the SL2 vs SL2s conversions, the SL3 might make more sense.

 

If you’re truly not seeing much difference between the M11 and M11M then I would personally take the color sensor over the Monochrom sensor.  It”s the difference between having to use physical color filters vs adjusting the luminance of each color channel in post, which gives far more creative flexibility.   There’s also something that, more often than not, gets left out of the black and white conversation and that’s how an APO lens actually makes a difference, even though we usually think of APO lenses in terms of its effect on color.  Without chromatic aberrations and by having colors aligned properly on the sensor monochrome images have more realism.  If you have any APO lenses for your M11 you may have noticed this.

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Dr. G said:

I can only tell you my answer from the perspective of a current SL2-S owner who used to own the SL2 and also used the Q3 extensively.  I am primarily a low light shooter.  The noise patterns on the SL2 weren't pleasing to my eye above ISO 3200 .  I felt the same way about the Q2.  With the Q3, noise patterns were much more acceptable and I could comfortably use it at 6400 and occasionally used 12500 without issue.  As much as I love my SL2-S, the one area where the SL2, in my opinion, was way ahead of it was with how it rendered high contrast black and white images with the APO SL lenses.  I can't get the same look out of my SL2-S.  I imagine the combination of the higher resolution of the sensor combined with the resolving power and microcontrast of the APO SL lenses contributed to that.  

I also sometimes crop from horizontal to vertical if I think the composition looks better when processing.  With the Q3s resolution this is no issue at all.  If I do it with my SL2-S and then need to come in a little bit more it's not so ideal.

Other improvements will be welcome, but the sensor is my primary reason for wanting the SL3.  

Agreed. Which i'm low light shooter too, especially i hate the noise result from Q2 which on hand now, i think same to SL2. I very love the result from SL2-S, but i had no idea how Q3 compared to SL2-S on the low light result, consider fair or much better? I hope more sharing from you since you owned SL2-S and Q3 now, thanks!

Edited by Gavin G
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53 minutes ago, Dr. G said:

If you’re truly not seeing much difference between the M11 and M11M then I would personally take the color sensor over the Monochrom sensor.  It”s the difference between having to use physical color filters vs adjusting the luminance of each color channel in post, which gives far more creative flexibility.   There’s also something that, more often than not, gets left out of the black and white conversation and that’s how an APO lens actually makes a difference, even though we usually think of APO lenses in terms of its effect on color.  Without chromatic aberrations and by having colors aligned properly on the sensor monochrome images have more realism.  If you have any APO lenses for your M11 you may have noticed this.

Yep the 50 APO is great on the M11M, and it would want to be for the price. But I will say the M 50 APO isn't perfectly corrected by any means, I still get aberrations including CA, but given the tiny size of the lens it's pretty well corrected overall. In terms of CA I wouldn't say it's a match for a larger quality lens (even a non APO lens) from the likes of Sony and others, though I'm sure the larger Leica L series APO lenses are a massive step up from the M APO.  

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1 hour ago, Stevejack said:

Yep the 50 APO is great on the M11M, and it would want to be for the price. But I will say the M 50 APO isn't perfectly corrected by any means, I still get aberrations including CA, but given the tiny size of the lens it's pretty well corrected overall. In terms of CA I wouldn't say it's a match for a larger quality lens (even a non APO lens) from the likes of Sony and others, though I'm sure the larger Leica L series APO lenses are a massive step up from the M APO.  

Are you sure your 50 APO is OK? I'm not seeing what you're seeing with mine and most reviews seem to agree. I have the Sony 50 1.2GM and the RF50 1.2L. They're superb but aided by software corrections and at f2 I'm not seeing any significant issues with my M50 APO when I compare to these two. I think they're slightly sharper at f2 than the Leica but I rather like the way the 50 APO draws wide open. None are quite at the level of the SL 50 APO Summicron at f2. But it's a small difference.

Gordon

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vor 10 Stunden schrieb jaapv:

Maybe the thread is a bit premature? We'll know for sure in a few days.

Yes sorry. Will be better based on know facts instead of rumours from rumours websites. There might be good reasons which we have no idea about before the real camera is in our hands or at least experience from people who hve used the new body.

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5 hours ago, Chaemono said:

+1

I’ll wait for the price to half, i.e. having to sell five NVIDIA shares instead of ten to buy it. 

BitCoin ... 😉

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