35mm Summicron 8 Element vs. V4 King of Bokeh

[Cronilux]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

So, I am in need of a 35mm for my M10-P and I am undecided between these two Summicrons. The 8 Element (v1) or the King of Bokeh (V4).

I already owned a V4 and liked it, but I am normally more drawn to lenses that have a bit more glow. 
 

My only 35mm is the Voigtlander Nokton Classic II SC atm. While I love it‘s size and the glow I get from it, I am not always happy with the colors.

So what would be your choice out of the two or would you even consider a 35Lux pre asph? 

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[a.noctilux]

Neither ...

After using them ( Summicron 35mm, I and IV ) for many years in many units of each,

I can say that they are quite different and not one of them can be considered "everyday lens".

The other ( "glowy" Summilux pre-asph. 35) could be what you are after, even not as such "everyday lens".

Depending on user each lens can deliver very good pictures.

Learn how to use them can be my only advice.

Funny ...

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/272470-35mm-summicron-v1-vs-35mm-summilux-pre-asph/?do=findComment&comment=4339209

 

Edited November 16, 2023 by a.noctilux

[a.noctilux]

A link below

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/380292-summicron-35mm-v4-king-of-bokeh-vs-apsh-v1-on-film/?do=findComment&comment=4825516

[Cronilux]

@a.noctilux I used the V4 almost exclusively for almost a year, when traveling and can say it was a pretty amazing everyday lens.
What makes you feel like they are not?

[pippy]

2 hours ago, Cronilux said:

...I already owned a V4 and liked it, but I am normally more drawn to lenses that have a bit more glow....would you even consider a 35Lux pre asph? 

If you want more 'glow' than the v4 Summicron then a Summilux v2 would be (IMO) the obvious choice.

Philip.

[yanidel]

I owned the 35mm Cron v4 but I did not like its wide open performance. Corners were just too soft if you happens to have your main subject in one of them. Colors were more vintage compared to my Lux Asph, but this is obviously a question of taste.

[junix]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

5 hours ago, Cronilux said:

My only 35mm is the Voigtlander Nokton Classic II SC atm. While I love it‘s size and the glow I get from it, I am not always happy with the colors.

So what would be your choice out of the two or would you even consider a 35Lux pre asph? 

If you like the Nokton (splendid lens..) you will most probably like the Lux pre-asph as the Nokton was “inspired” by it.

Between the Cron V1 and V4 I would go with the V4 (tried both, bought a good copy of a  V4 (late German made chrome..), put please let’s stop calling it KOB.. ;))

[hdmesa]

7 hours ago, Cronilux said:

So, I am in need of a 35mm for my M10-P and I am undecided between these two Summicrons. The 8 Element (v1) or the King of Bokeh (V4).

I already owned a V4 and liked it, but I am normally more drawn to lenses that have a bit more glow. 
 

My only 35mm is the Voigtlander Nokton Classic II SC atm. While I love it‘s size and the glow I get from it, I am not always happy with the colors.

So what would be your choice out of the two or would you even consider a 35Lux pre asph? 

If you're happy with the very minor glow of the Voigtlander then get the MC version if you want better color. Or shoot in better light.

The pre-ASPH v2 will get you a lot of nice glow, and you won't want to go back to the Voigtlander after owning one (provided you get a good copy of the pre-ASPH and/or send it off for a CLA).

The 8-Element barely has any glow just like the Voigtlander. You have to zoom way in to see it.

Edit to add: if you see a lot of glow with the Voigtlander or 8-E, you are either missing focus or are in need of a CLA due to haze.

Edited November 17, 2023 by hdmesa

[Cronilux]

@hdmesa super helpful reply. My problem with the pre asph V2 is it’s min focus distance of 1 meter. I don’t see a lot of glow with my Nokton. 
 

@junix what made you go with the V4 over the V1? I only call it KOB, cause it’s what it’s often described at. I don’t feel like it is even near to being a king in regards og bokeh. 😂

[dpitt]

7 hours ago, yanidel said:

I owned the 35mm Cron v4 but I did not like its wide open performance. Corners were just too soft if you happens to have your main subject in one of them. Colors were more vintage compared to my Lux Asph, but this is obviously a question of taste.

I suppose you did not test the Summilux 35 pre-asph wide open?

I tried two samples, both CLA'd and both where remarkably soft wide open for a Leica lens. Now I regret selling them when I see the current prices, but I get more use out of my Summicron 35 v3. Very rich colors, sharpness and fairly good contrast wide open at F2.0, and it improves when stopping down. I think you would have to stop down the pre-ASPH to F4.0 before it gets equally sharp, and then you have a different lens behaviour. I like it more when lenses do not change character this much when stopping down... That's just me probably if you see how popular the pre-ASPH summilux is.

Edited November 17, 2023 by dpitt

[archive_all]

I would go Summicron v4 over the v1 but it's my personal favorite. It doesn't produce much glow if that's what your'e after but I like the colors and contrast over the v1. 

[junix]

6 hours ago, Cronilux said:

@hdmesa super helpful reply. My problem with the pre asph V2 is it’s min focus distance of 1 meter. I don’t see a lot of glow with my Nokton. 
 

@junix what made you go with the V4 over the V1? I only call it KOB, cause it’s what it’s often described at. I don’t feel like it is even near to being a king in regards og bokeh. 😂

The copies I tried of the V4 had better definition and contrast of the V1s so it was probably my preferred choice.. but in all honesty I just happened to stumble on a good copy of a late german chrome for a “reasonable” price and bought it. It could have easily been a v1 and I would probably be equally happy now. 😀 

Take in consideration that like you I own a Nokton SC, it is the only non Leica and non chrome/silver lens I own, and I will never let it go, especially for the price. It is a splendid lens that I mostly use with B&W film (this is maybe why I don’t understand your color problems with it 😂).

@hdmesa is right, if you want glow a (good copy) pre-asph v2 is probably what you’re looking for.

 

[raizans]

19 hours ago, Cronilux said:

My only 35mm is the Voigtlander Nokton Classic II SC atm. While I love it‘s size and the glow I get from it, I am not always happy with the colors.

What changes would you make to the colors?

[yanidel]

7 hours ago, dpitt said:

I suppose you did not test the Summilux 35 pre-asph wide open?

I tried two samples, both CLA'd and both where remarkably soft wide open for a Leica lens. Now I regret selling them when I see the current prices, but I get more use out of my Summicron 35 v3. Very rich colors, sharpness and fairly good contrast wide open at F2.0, and it improves when stopping down. I think you would have to stop down the pre-ASPH to F4.0 before it gets equally sharp, and then you have a different lens behaviour. I like it more when lenses do not change character this much when stopping down... That's just me probably if you see how popular the pre-ASPH summilux is.

I believe I took a few test shots with one of a friend's and remember the nice bokeh. The Lux Asph is obviously completely different, decently sharp in the corners wide open, but what attracts me is the high contrast, clarity and colors it produces. And as someone mentioned, the look does not change much throughout the whole aperture range, unlike the pre-asph ones.

[a.noctilux]

1 hour ago, crvhegas said:

If you want glow then get the Steel Rim instead.

Reissue SR ...some reports QC problems

and more

(sorry, not the right lens), I can not edit it

 

Edited November 19, 2023 by a.noctilux

[Cronilux]

I bought an 8 Element now, since the Summilux was never an option. One meter close focus range is simply too far away for a 35mm lens. 0,7m is already a compromise in my opinion. I´ll give an update in a few day once I received it and played around with it.

[a.noctilux]

14 minutes ago, Cronilux said:

I bought an 8 Element now

If it's M3 type with goggles, you gain 5cm in mfd

Not appealing, but who cares

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

from Wiki

[Cronilux]

I received the lens and will send it back. It has pretty strong haze behind the front element. The seller didn´t state anything of it. Said it was in great condition. When I messaged him, he told me that haze would be normal for old lenses like that. I own several lenses even from the 60s and I know they can be prone to haze, but I never had a seller acting like that would be normal for all of them.

The price was just too good. Now there are only copies around 5000€ or even way more out there, which I won´t pay. People have to chill with the Leica Prices nowadays.

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[Smudgerer]

In my opinion at the asking prices now for the Summicron 35 V1 the Summilux 35 1.4 re-issue begins to make more sense as being a better buy, if you need it at anytime you gain the extra speed, you get a decent "glow" wide open and at a couple of stops down it behaves somewhat like the Summicron but a tad sharper in the corners, bought new that'll come with a Leica warranty which is worth noting too................Or, consider the LLL 35 8 element, some people here really like that lens, I have the collapsible version and so far I am pretty pleased with it.

[Cronilux]

@Smudgerer the one meter min focus distance is a no go for me.